Poll: Talk me out of an AR Pistol...

[redmud]

I say build one and if you don't like it sell it or part it out. I would prefer an ar pistol in 300 blk over 5.56 since the round is meant to be shot from a shorter barrel any way a 10.5 barrel is plenty long enough. Or build that monster 458 socom pistol, you could even build an Ar 10 pistol but why your selling the round short just like a 5.56 .223 pistol.

 

[Turkey]

If you are going to get one, don't get the standard gas operated AR configuration with the buffer tube. Go with the Rock River LAR-PDS which is a piston driven system and has no buffer tube. It is reliable, runs way cooler and cleaner than the standard gas system, and is 17.5 inches overall with a 9 inch 1:9 twist barrel. It does not have a forward assist. Rock River says it will do MOA at 100 meters and in my experience it will do pretty close to that with M855 and an EOtech sight. For close in use I put a streamlight/laser combo on the tri-rail handguard. I also added flip up adjustable iron sights (co-witnessed with the Eotech and laser for backup) and a tactical sling. This gun also has an adjustable gas piston that can be set for lighter loads. If you get the version with the tri-rail handguard, just make sure you don't put a pistol grip on the front or you have a gun that will need to registered with the ATF. Adding a rear stock turns it into an SBR. All NFA rules apply. It is concealable under a longish coat with the tactical sling, but I wouldn't recommend using it this way--much too heavy and awkward for a concealed carry gun. The biggest downside is for this gun set up this way you are looking at a couple grand. I think the gun alone runs around $1400. It is a bit more complex to clean than the standard AR but no overly so. The bolt assembly is not interchangeable with standard AR bolts and it will not work with a standard suppressor--but supposedly Rock River has a suppressor for it in development. development.

Yeah. What he said. You should buy my Rock River PDS. It's posted now! $1000 with optic and laser.....

 

[wired]

This is not Hollywood and the movies. They are called a suppressor, not a "silencer".

Hold on. Let me look at the original patent filed by Hiram Maxim and his "Silenced Firearm Co.". Yep. The inventor named it a silencer, marketed and sold them as such for decades. Silencer is a noun. Doesnt matter what it does. I could take all of my silencers and fill them with concrete. They'd still be silencers. Thats what it says on the ATF Form 1 and Form 4's to build and buy them. Look up silencer in the dictionary , you know what you'll find and if I say Silencer you know exactly what I am talking about because its not only the legally recognized name its in the common vernacular. When"silencerco" built many of my silencers they didnt name themselves "suppresserco" to honor the hack Soldier of Fortune writer in the 70's who decided to rename silencers to "suppressors" so that government and police procurement wouldnt be scared off from buying silencers which had been the common parlance for 60 years at the time. Silencer is the correct NAME not "term" .




http://www.forgottenweapons.com/wp-content/uploads/Maxim silencer/Maxim silencer patent 916885.pdf

Firearms - Guides - Importation & Verification of Firearms - Gun Control Act Definition - Silencer | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives

Patent US1482805 - Silencer for guns

the definition of silencer

From the U.S. code...
18 U.S. Code § 921 - Definitions

24)
The terms "firearm silencer" and "firearm muffler" mean any device for silencing, muffling, or diminishing the report of a portable firearm, including any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and intended for use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or firearm muffler, and any part intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication.

 

[cookie]

An AR pistol is like having several drinks and picking up a babe only to find out she is a tranny. You have to decide how fun it would be.

 

[MasterChief]

So...besides not having stock, VFG or other SBR/pistol component/legalities....and the muzzle velocity lost from a shorter barrel.....please explain what we're confused about?

 

[Argonaut]

I am building a factory Colt SBR similar to the GAU5 that I cut my teeth on. I find real shoulder stocks 20X more effective in really getting rounds on target. Most police departments have even done away with folding shotgun stocks that were all the rage at one time. They are just too difficult to control.

 

[Flopsweat]

I am building a factory Colt SBR similar to the GAU5 that I cut my teeth on. I find real shoulder stocks 20X more effective in really getting rounds on target. Most police departments have even done away with folding shotgun stocks that were all the rage at one time. They are just too difficult to control.

This one works great:
https://www.themakogroup.com/fab/st...buttstock-for-remington-870-agrf870-fksb.html

 

[Argonaut]

This one works great:
Recoil-Reducing Folding Collapsible Buttstock for Remington 870 - AGRF870-FKSB
View attachment 403176

Looks good.....does it qualify as a pistol? NFA laws are really tough....oh, I see it is for an 870. Still looks OK but it is not the same as a folder.

 

[Flopsweat]

Looks good.....does it qualify as a pistol? NFA laws are really tough....oh, I see it is for an 870. Still looks OK but it is not the same as a folder.

It folds. It just also telescopes and reduces recoil. It can do more than one thing.
Start at 0:24

 

[ob1]

While he says the kit is for the Mossberg/Remington "Combat series" shotguns, I assume it is only for pump guns, as opposed to the "Law" folders.

 

[Flopsweat]

While he says the kit is for the Mossberg/Remington "Combat series" shotguns, I assume it is only for pump guns, as opposed to the "Law" folders.

Just the 500, 590 and 870 I think. I haven't seen one for a semi-auto yet.

 

[Argonaut]

While he says the kit is for the Mossberg/Remington "Combat series" shotguns, I assume it is only for pump guns, as opposed to the "Law" folders.

As I remember, 870 and 1100 stocks are interchangeable.

 

[Flopsweat]

As I remember, 870 and 1100 stocks are interchangeable.

Well that's interesting...

 

[Max713]

I say they most definitely have a useful place. But what do I know

It should be noted, the Railscales VFG on the 3rd pistol is no longer legal, the designation of that device wasn't decided at the time of the photo.
I can give you a better rundown on my opinions/advice, or give you build specs, if it would be helpful.

 

[fxdc]

His and Her's
I will never learn....
I get a Harley, she gets a Harley.
I get an AR, she gets an AR.
I get an AR pistol, she gets an AR pistol.

LOL

 

[Argonaut]

I say they most definitely have a useful place. But what do I know

It should be noted, the Railscales VFG on the 3rd pistol is no longer legal, the designation of that device wasn't decided at the time of the photo.
I can give you a better rundown on my opinions/advice, or give you build specs, if it would be helpful.

View attachment 403663 View attachment 403664 View attachment 403666 View attachment 403667

Those look like short barrel rifles........not pistols. I know people have pushed the limits on the definition but it will eventually come back to bite you in the bubblegum.

 

[Max713]

Those look like short barrel rifles........not pistols. I know people have pushed the limits on the definition but it will eventually come back to bite you in the bubblegum.

You are 100% wrong in that statement.
All four of the pictures posted were of 100% legal, AR PISTOLS.
It is not wise to make assumptions when it's obvious that you do not have enough knowledge on the subject to make a proper judgement, in doing so you spread false information.
To clarify for you, and for others that may stumble upon this thread:

Picture #1: A 7.5" Aero Precision built pistol equipped with an SB Tactical PDW Brace
Picture #2: A 10.3" Crossmachine Tool built pistol, equipped with an SB Tactical SBM4 pistol brace, also equipped with a VFG as the overall length of the weapon is over 26". This actually designates it as a "Firearm", not a pistol (or rifle).
Picture #3: A 7.5" Aero Precision built pistol equipped with a Gearheadworks Tailhook Mod 1 pistol brace. As I mentioned in the original post, the VFG/Handstop equipped in the picture has since been deemed a VFG, and is not legal to have on a pistol of less than 26".
Picture #4: An Angstadt arms UDP-9 pistol, equipped with an SB Tactical PDW pistol brace.

 

[jordanvraptor]

Here is my Vietnam Colt Commando commemorative.
Here it is being fired the way the government wants you to fire it.

 

[Max713]

Those look like short barrel rifles........not pistols. I know people have pushed the limits on the definition but it will eventually come back to bite you in the bubblegum.

These on the other hand, are SBRs, as their barrels are shorter than 16" while being equipped with a rifle buttstock.

 

[Argonaut]

You are 100% wrong in that statement.
All four of the pictures posted were of 100% legal, AR PISTOLS.
It is not wise to make assumptions when it's obvious that you do not have enough knowledge on the subject to make a proper judgement, in doing so you spread false information.
To clarify for you, and for others that may stumble upon this thread:

Picture #1: A 7.5" Aero Precision built pistol equipped with an SB Tactical PDW Brace
Picture #2: A 10.3" Crossmachine Tool built pistol, equipped with an SB Tactical SBM4 pistol brace, also equipped with a VFG as the overall length of the weapon is over 26". This actually designates it as a "Firearm", not a pistol (or rifle).
Picture #3: A 7.5" Aero Precision built pistol equipped with a Gearheadworks Tailhook Mod 1 pistol brace. As I mentioned in the original post, the VFG/Handstop equipped in the picture has since been deemed a VFG, and is not legal to have on a pistol of less than 26".
Picture #4: An Angstadt arms UDP-9 pistol, equipped with an SB Tactical PDW pistol brace.

Definitions change with politics. Like many things gun related.......those will eventually be deemed over the line. Looks pretty obvious that they are designed to be shoulder mounted. I cut my teeth on a GAU5......something that you probably never heard of......but it is similar to Jordanvraptors Commando. It is one of the handiest weapons on the planet and I am building another one now but it is deffinatly not a pistol. All it will take is a change in definition by the ATF (do you remember removable magazine SKS?) and your folding stock AR pistols will be illegal.