Surviving off other people

[Just Jim]

Any of you guys who don't have a trade then buy a good shovel and become a grave digger. They will be in high demand.

jj

 

[Wheeler44]

Any of you guys who don't have a trade then buy a good shovel and become a grave digger. They will be in high demand.

Probably diggin' latrines and wells is more like it.....after diggin' out from whatever disaster finds us next......

The very few poachers, looters and thieves will soon adapt to whatever moral standard and consequence society dictates...

Just as the good folks will be makin' assessments and risk/benefit decisions everyday (which they do everyday anyway).....so will the ne'er do wells (which they do everyday)......

Only the risk will be greater (generally) and the benefit uncertain.....

Posse ain't an American word.......It was around way before the constitution was.....Good folks will stick together and help each other out....Others.....will be forced to make thorough examinations of their motives and methods....and compare them to the new norm...

I don't forecast a need for too many more grave diggers...

 

[DERGLOCKINMEISTER]

I don't know if I am in denial or what , but I for one hope that all the preparation is for naught . I do think though that human nature being what it is , folks are going to get a bit testy about you harvesting their food , on the hoof or not. If tshf for real , people are going to hunker down and protect whatever they have that has not been destroyed. I certainly do not want to test the resolve of an armed man who doesn't want to share his goodies with me . Better to lay in a good stock of canned food , dried food , etc. and plan on being responsible for you own survival . If it gets all mad max and society is permanently shot to **** you and I probably won't be around to worry about it anyway.

 

[Just Jim]

I don't know how things will be but the world kind predicts the way people will behave when no law is around. I watched the LA riots and saw alot of crimes being commited and people banding together when the cops wouldn't help.

Times that by ten when the whole country goes due to an economic collapse and I believe for a period of time the carnage will be full blown till all the people who don't follow the rules get their dirt nap. I suspect there will be people out to settle old scores and also suspect not many politicions will survive should they collapse our economy.

After the rubbish is gone it should be a much better life as government will be much smaller and will listen carefully to every word spoken.

jj

 

[EZLivin]

What I would like to know is what event, besides an all out nuclear war, would result in the massive societal upheaval that is being discussed here? Disasters are generally local, or possibly regional at best, and things tend to return to normal fairly quickly when such things occur in modern, civilized societies. Those who have seriously prepared for a few weeks discomfort should be reasonably well off (like a lot of people on this forum). Those that haven't prepared will stand in soup lines and sleep in stadiums. The riff-raff looters will loot their neighbor's houses and businesses when their neighbor's are down at the stadium.

 

[Just Jim]

When the dollar collapses there will be nobody out there to do police protection. You gonna risk your life for nothing protecting others while your own family is at risk? Who will drive the food shipments when they don't get paid? Where you gonna get fuel when nobody is delivering? How you gonna buy anything when money is worthless?

The boys in government are still spending it faster than it will ever be made back and stealing it to fund themselves. Just keep watching the debt rise. When oil makes another big jump it may start the process but right now it's wait and see, and I hope like **** I am all wrong

jj

 

[EZLivin]

When the dollar collapses there will be nobody out there to do police protection.
jj

That is the area where I would disagree with a lot of folks on this forum. And I absolutely do believe the dollar is going to go way down from here. I am so certain of it that most of my investments are structured to profit from a falling dollar. Whether it is a continuing gradual slide, or at some point an overnight devaluation, I don't know. What I don't see is a Mad Max scenario resulting from it. I think the dollar slide will stop at a predetermined point; a point which will be linked in some way to US gold reserves. I personally question whether the US still has the gold it says it does, but it will not be an issue because nobody is going to question it.

 

[Just Jim]

I hope you are right.I hope the food trucks keep rolling when the drivers are not getting paid. Our system of food delivery is set up on computors that tell the stores what and when to replace what is sold. We have no big warehouses of food anymore as the system is different to allow for less handleing (your store rewards card is used to help run the system). We get a spike in fuel cost due to war or whatever and the food stops.

I also hope you are right that the police will let their families stay at home and they keep working when their pay won't buy a sandwich. Human nature tells me people will protect their own first and they will probably take over what stores still have food in them.

Gold won't buy food in very hard times. People will kill you for it in hopes it will in the future but I wouldn't sell you food for all the gold around if the food quits being delivered. Socialist governments have used food for a weapon and starved their people to death on many occasions.

Just a few thoughts here as I don't want to go comepletely into this.

jj

 

[EZLivin]

I hope you are right.I hope the food trucks keep rolling when the drivers are not getting paid.
jj

That isn't what I said. I don't think those conditions will occur here (because of the currency stabilization scenario I mentioned). But regardless, those who have prepared for total collapse will be fine either way (or at least a whole lot better off than those who didn't prepare for any of it). Actually, if someone looked at my "devaluation" preparations they would think I have prepared for TEOTWAWKI anyway

 

[Gunner3456]

Try looking into goats. They eat anything, are multi functional, are lean meat, easier to dress out, don't create the havoc on the land like cattle do (think wet mud) and the billys put up a good fight with coyotes.

We are looking at them just to clear out some acreage covered in black berries.

SF-

I once had a neighbor who did that. We had pasture but his place (about 20 acres) had been allowed to go wild. Not only did the goats amaze me for how they killed those blackberries (they kept the leaves completely stripped and ate young shoots but didn't eat the mature vines. They kept the leaves stripped off all vines and killed everything including new shoots that came up from seed.) but he got a lot of goat meat out of the deal.

 

[Gunner3456]

This is causing me to think thru more things. I should build a smoke house and learn how to use it. I guess most meat could be preserved by smoking. Maybe long enough to use it up.
Who knows what all will be lacking. If trucks stop delivering food and goods everything will run out. Probably truck hijacking will happen if there are too few running.

Good idea. Also, still today in poor countries where they have no refrigeration they salt meat down. Salt is really cheap. Our pioneers salt cured meat. It's a good thing to know how to do. It's best done in really cool weather if you have a choice when to butcher. Smoking, jerking and salting all work.

If our freezers go down, the first thing I'll do is thaw the meat and salt cure it.

 

[EZLivin]

We are looking at them just to clear out some acreage covered in black berries.
SF-

Make sure you get one of the short-haired breeds. Our fibre goats stick to blackberry vines like flies stick to flypaper.

 

[Gunner3456]

Make sure you get one of the short-haired breeds. Our fibre goats stick to blackberry vines like flies stick to flypaper.

I didn't know that, but now that you mention it, the neighbor did get short haired goats. That never came up, but it makes sense. Those goats sure did kill that big patch though, no kidding.

 

[Just Jim]

Funny how a thread starts about the nature of people and ends up being about goats I guess it's just to hard for some to concentrate on the thread

Yes I am guilty of the same offenses

jj

 

[Gunner3456]

Funny how a thread starts about the nature of people and ends up being about goats I guess it's just to hard for some to concentrate on the thread

Yes I am guilty of the same offenses

jj

It's just that some people remind me of goats and I can't help myself.

 

[Just Jim]

Hey I resemble that remark

How do us goats live off other people?

jj

 

[EZLivin]

Funny how a thread starts about the nature of people and ends up being about goats
jj

Goats are just like people. They are stubborn as ****, and there is always one in the herd that will loot the others food even though it has plenty of its own.

 

[Just Jim]

Goats are just like people. They are stubborn as ****, and there is always one in the herd that will loot the others food even though it has plenty of its own.

Funny but better quit getting so close to your goats

My church feeds alot of people and does alot of things to help them. I live in a good community that helps others. This may all change should the SHTF but in general most people are good and will fight the bad ones. It's what Americans have allways done.

jj

 

[EZLivin]

Funny but better quit getting so close to your goats

jj

Wish I could. They started out as our daughter's animals. Unfortunately BOYS have replaced them as the primary area of interest. We're keeping them around for their compost-making ability. If SHTF, and meat runs out, I guess I would harvest them prior to harvesting the boyfriend.

 

[unionguy]

I also think that as our society has changed from a more self reliant culture to the culture of immediate gratification. We have gotten used to just being able to go get whatever we want or need at a moments notice with no need to plan ahead.

+1 to that. Has anyone noticed the Cricket billboards that say "Teach Your Family Not to Share" as the ad to sell their family cell plan. It's obnoxious the way our culture has eroded. I always wonder about the 8 year old riding around and seeing that and what they think. (And, yes, I've talked it over with my kids.)

This is a great thread, Mountain Bear. It bothers me a lot to read about those planning to kill/loot/poach to survive. Throughout history, groups that cooperate actually do better than a "kill or be killed" approach.