Pre-Crime Policing Disgruntled Man Update

[Gunner3456]

-snip-

since when does a civil process require fully deployed SWAT team?

Although it is for sure a civil action, a strong show of force is believed to deter violence, not cause it. The police went there to take a man who was reported to them to be very disturbed and armed into custody.

Handcuffs? Entering a private residence witnout a warrant or other due process? Seizing personal property and depriving its legal owner his right of possession?

It hasn't been established or even stated on what grounds they entered his residence, and handcuffs are standard procedure when taking someone into custody. That's for his protection and the police's protection.

It will be interesting to learn of the source(s) of the information leading to the "very disgruntled" "status" of this man, and the basis for the source making the claims they did.

It's already well reported that it was ODOT which first expressed the concern.

 

[Gunner3456]

So, for the record here, if the police break into your home and steal your guns, violating many constitutional amendments, you are not going to be angry. Ok I get that. If the police lie to you, that's OKEE DOKEE for you, Ok.

It hasn't been established that any of that happened. Broke into his home?

It's OK by you if the criminals

They were police officers and we have only one side of the story.

cuff you after telling you they wouldn't and haul you off against your will, OK. They can point real assault weapons at you and force you to comply, I think your a really weird duck if that wouldn't anger you.

I'm not agreeing that any of that happened just that way because we have only one side of the story. However, yes, the police can take you by force for a mental health evaluation if they think it is appropriate. That's the law. Yes they can use weapons if they believe you are armed and potentially dangerous. You don't have to actually be dangerous, they just have to have that belief that you possibly are.

To your viewpoint if you lie that's a jail-able offense but when the police lie they are just doing their job. Ok, an odd idea of justice but I admit that's the way it is set up now, police can lie, we can't.

First, we don't know they lied. There is the rumor that Mr. Pyles said they did. We don't have both sides of the story. If we don't like it that police lie when interrogating people and taking suspects, we should change the law because I agree that they sometimes do, legally. We just don't know about this time.

Man! That's you! I reserve the right to demand that the police explain what they have done in every instance, and especially in a case where it's clear to most of us that they have broken the law.

I suggest that you go to the Oregon State Police or the Medford Police and "demand" that they answer to you. Let's see how far that gets you, especially since so much of this is confidential due to personnel and medical records laws.

You keep implying that Mr. Pyle is lying about what happened,

All we know about what Mr. Pyle may have said is what's been reported. "He said she said." I'm saying we don't know for a fact if Mr. Pyle told the whole story.

but I've seen enough cop shows to know that it's the police who feel they get to lie, somehow that's not wrong to them, while most of us 'civilians' feel that lying is always wrong. Put on a uniform, lie all you want, lie to the press, lie to their wives, lie to some guy named "gunner", no big deal.

I agree that the police lie to suspects when interrogating them. The feds are the worst, yet if you lie to them you can go to prison for it. I never said that was right. I just said that we don't know that here.

I also agree that they might lie to get a suspect to come out. That's not illegal, but I won't say I agree with it. I do understand it somewhat if the suspect is considered armed and dangerous.

I hate liars, I hate it when under duress I spit out a little white lie, it grieves me. I'm pretty sure someone lied to you gunner, and instead of being angry about it you keep sticking up for the source. Weird.

You simply don't know that, but I respect you for saying "I'm pretty sure" rather than stating it as fact.

Please also note that nowhere in this thread am I relying on what anyone else said. In every single case I'm just using the information which is public! I'm just trying to show how little is really known, and yet how so many people claim things as facts or jump to conclusions using the same information we all have here.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

So, for the record here, if the police break into your home and steal your guns, violating many constitutional amendments, you are not going to be angry. Ok I get that. If the police lie to you, that's OKEE DOKEE for you, Ok.

It's OK by you if the criminals cuff you after telling you they wouldn't and haul you off against your will, OK. They can point real assault weapons at you and force you to comply, I think your a really weird duck if that wouldn't anger you.

To your viewpoint if you lie that's a jail-able offense but when the police lie they are just doing their job. Ok, an odd idea of justice but I admit that's the way it is set up now, police can lie, we can't.

Man! That's you! I reserve the right to demand that the police explain what they have done in every instance, and especially in a case where it's clear to most of us that they have broken the law.

You keep implying that Mr. Pyle is lying about what happened, but I've seen enough cop shows to know that it's the police who feel they get to lie, somehow that's not wrong to them, while most of us 'civilians' feel that lying is always wrong. Put on a uniform, lie all you want, lie to the press, lie to their wives, lie to some guy named "gunner", no big deal.

I hate liars, I hate it when under duress I spit out a little white lie, it grieves me. I'm pretty sure someone lied to you gunner, and instead of being angry about it you keep sticking up for the source. Weird.

Yes, and IMO no longer worth responding to..

 

[Gunner3456]

Yes, and IMO no longer worth responding to..

Yeah, I don't blame ya'll. Gets old mentally getting your azz kicked, doesn't it.

I take on all of you, kick all of your butts, and now you want to quit.

Good idea!

 

[eriknemily]

Yeah, I don't blame ya'll. Gets old mentally getting your azz kicked, doesn't it.

I take on all of you, kick all of your butts, and now you want to quit.

Good idea!

Don't struggle with self-confidence do you Gunner

 

[Father of four]

No gunner, You have not won. What you are showing everyone is that you are only 1 sided. Alot of people posting here want to know all the truth and are only posting opinions to what may have happened. You though continue to pick fights with people and belittle them. Some of us want to know the outcome of this issue and we will talk among ourselves. You are just adding fuel to the fire and causing more problems by what seems to be your all out war to provide defense for your local Leo's. We want to know what really happened and if it was right or wrong. Lawful or unlawful. Please stop Helping. Sorry!

 

[svxr8dr]

No gunner, You have not won. What you are showing everyone is that you are only 1 sided. Alot of people posting here want to know all the truth and are only posting opinions to what may have happened. You though continue to pick fights with people and belittle them. Some of us want to know the outcome of this issue and we will talk among ourselves. You are just adding fuel to the fire and causing more problems by what seems to be your all out war to provide defense for your local Leo's. We want to know what really happened and if it was right or wrong. Lawful or unlawful. Please stop Helping. Sorry!

plus eleventy billion

 

[Stomper]

did... did he... did he just throw his OWN testicles at his opponent?.... wow!

 

[Father of four]

What?

 

[Gunner3456]

No gunner, You have not won. What you are showing everyone is that you are only 1 sided. Alot of people posting here want to know all the truth and are only posting opinions to what may have happened. You though continue to pick fights with people and belittle them. Some of us want to know the outcome of this issue and we will talk among ourselves. You are just adding fuel to the fire and causing more problems by what seems to be your all out war to provide defense for your local Leo's. We want to know what really happened and if it was right or wrong. Lawful or unlawful. Please stop Helping. Sorry!

No, FOF, you and your pals here keep posting things as fact when the facts aren't known. Over and over I point that out, one item and one comment at a time.

In your hatred for the police, you are blinded. There is also another thread going here where your motivation is only to bash police.

I feel sorry for you.

 

[Gunner3456]

Don't struggle with self-confidence do you Gunner

Nope.

 

[Father of four]

You are doing it again, just as I said earlier.
Gunner Quote: "No, FOF, you and your pals here keep posting things as fact when the facts aren't known. Over and over I point that out, one item and one comment at a time.

In your hatred for the police, you are blinded"

I never not once said anything was a fact about this case. Find it and post it!

You know that I hate the police and I am blind? Again all you can do is post your one sidedness and belittle people. I am also done talking with you.

 

[Father of four]

Nice quietness!

Has anyone heard of anything to update this topic? Any recent news reports. I also noticed this topic on infowars.com. Be warned to look at that site (and all sites) with a grain of salt though.

 

[Father of four]

WOW! Putting someone on your ignore list will remove ALL of that persons previous post from your view! Just some information.

 

[Gunner3456]

I am also done talking with you.

That fits right in with my plans.

 

[Gunner3456]

edit

 

[Father of four]

For those interested, look at the thread that New York started.

http://www.northwestfirearms.com/forum/showthread.php?p=200748#post200748

Kevin Starret from Oregon Firearm Radio discusses it live on the radio.

Thanks New York.

 

[Partsproduction]

If we don't demand that the people in charge of this explain their actions it will happen again, and then, if people like Gunner manage to talk it into nothingness it will happen again and again until it is the norm! We will be looking over our shoulders as if we are criminals, afraid to buy that new gun we saw in the display, afraid to even look at the display!

The people who did this are not friends of the Constitution or free Americans, they are friends of the SS and brownshirts of nazi Germany, friends of the people 70 years ago who hauled people off in the middle of the night never to be seen again.

If we don't speak up on this we are helping the cowardly criminals who did this. Sorry Gunner, you are wrong on this.

You need to admit it.

 

[soberups]

Here's one thing that concerns me.

Mr Pyle is free to say whatever he wants about the incident.

The police and ODOT are not. Due to confidentiality requirements, they are effectively operating under a gag order. The fact of the matter is, we dont know what threats, if any, Pyle may have made to his ODOT supervisor.

Im not saying the police were right. I'm saying that we arent hearing both sides of the story.

If Pyle wants to plead his case in the court of public opinion thats fine....but fairness requires that he should waive his right to confidentiality so that both sides can speak freely. Or, if he wants his privacy respected, then he needs to shut up and let his attorney deal with it behind closed doors. But he shouldnt be able to have it both ways.

Its pretty easy to win a debate when your opponent is wearing a gag.

 

[Jamie6.5]

That's the heckuvit! The "gag" is self imposed. If they had followed due process there would be warrants,... A paper trail.
The police had none, and thus there is no paperwork. Nothing to follow.

Typical police response when they screw up.
Nothing to see here folks, move along please,...