Mindset...it's not about "fighting"

Messages
75
Reactions
121
Something I wrote for another forum awhile back. Thought I'd share here...

As an instructor I use the term "fighting" because it is universally recognized and it is easy shorthand. It’s also a lot more approachable to laypeople than other terms we might use. But honestly I don’t care for the term “fighting”.

"Fighting" implies a contest of equals.

I believe that how we frame things in our mind is meaningful. Visualization of actions/concepts can and does impact our mindset. Our ATTITUDE greatly affects our ability. To that end, I maintain that thinking in terms of “fighting” is counterproductive.

I prefer thinking in terms of predator versus prey.

The hawk does not fight the snake. The lion does not fight the antelope. They simply hunt and strike quickly, stealthily, and without mercy. There is no thought about “fighting”, no “good sportsmanship”, no “fair fight”. There is only intense focus and will: KILL THE PREY.

It’s just food. A target to be taken down immediately, with no hesitation, posturing or sparring-type dancing around. The predator may enjoy the kill, or may be dispassionate about it…it’s just a task that must be completed.

FIND FOOD. KILL. EAT. CHECK.

Predators spar and “fight” with members of their species; they compete for dominance and for breeding rights. Outside their species, they just KILL.

In TRAINING, I like to think of myself as a cat, playing with a mouse. The mouse is no threat to me; it’s a toy that I bend to my will. I play with it, experimenting, learning, but all the while communicating “I can kill you at any moment I choose.”

This is not to say that we underestimate our prey. Predators take on dangerous prey whenever it’s necessary. They recognize the danger and take action to mitigate that danger. But the attitude is the same: It is not a fight, it is killing. It is butchery. A task that must be done. A task that WILL be done.

Humans have become so civilized that they have forgotten to be good animals. Civilization is a wonderful thing and it’s good that we’ve moved past embracing only our animal instincts and needs. But when it comes to the primal instinct of predator/prey, we must embrace the animal that we are.

stalking-tigers.jpg
 

albin25

Messages
3,206
Reactions
15,219
o_O Are you advocating the teaching of someone to hunt people to eat 'em?...or just to be the next bunch of thugs and predators? Attacking and pouncing first is seldom considered as a "self defense" move... and chasing them down after the threat is neutralized to "finish 'em off" is not a smart idea.
....Maybe it would be wiser to consider a more "prey avoiding becoming a meal" approach.
 
Last edited:
OP
NWMA
Messages
75
Reactions
121
o_O Are you advocating the teaching of someone to hunt people to eat 'em?...or just the next bunch of thugs and predators?
Maybe it would be wiser to consider a more "prey avoiding becoming a meal" approach.
I'm not advocating thuggery.

I'm saying that sometimes it's necessary to flip a switch. In defense of yourself, or in defense of your family. Much of the training out there is fear-based. Which is fine if that works for you. But to my mind that is like the little dog that bares its teeth out of fear. Rather than the wolf that calmy does what needs to be done.

I'm merely saying that in some situations a prey mindset might not be as useful as a predator mindset.

But whatever works for you.
 

ZigZagZeke

Messages
5,327
Reactions
12,576
I understand what you are trying to say. There was a specific day for me when a switch was flipped in my head and it made all the difference. I was playing on a tournament paintball team. It was a time when we were teetering on the edge of being professional paintball players as a team.

Before an important tournament I got to thinking about how I played the game. It suddenly came to me that the object of the game was not to fight the enemy. It was to capture their flag or headquarters. So why did I and my team mates generally spend a lot of time fighting the other team? Why engage them in a firefight and try to take them out man by man? That was not the stated goal. That did not determine the winner of the game. So the next time I hit the field and the horn went off I concentrated on AVOIDING firefights, and instead flanked and crawled, and hid and sneaked, taking out only the opposition between me and my objective, and then only if I couldn't avoid engagement. That particular day I single-handedly secured the victory for the team several times. All it took was realizing that the goal was not to shoot as many of the opposition as possible. The goal was not to fight, but instead to infiltrate and capture.
 

EPS

Messages
13,138
Reactions
25,380
o_O Are you advocating the teaching of someone to hunt people to eat 'em?...or just to be the next bunch of thugs and predators? Attacking and pouncing first is seldom considered as a "self defense" move... and chasing them down after the threat is neutralized to "finish 'em off" is not a smart idea.
....Maybe it would be wiser to consider a more "prey avoiding becoming a meal" approach.
Not true there a fish and other animals that do not go looking for a fight but are targets of preaders and when they are attacked they respond and kill the attacker
 
OP
NWMA
Messages
75
Reactions
121
Attacking and pouncing first is seldom considered as a "self defense" move... and chasing them down after the threat is neutralized to "finish 'em off" is not a smart idea.
I said nothing about "chasing them down to finish em off".

Likewise I didn't say anything about attacking first. Although yes, in some cases that's exactly what should be done and given the facts and circumstances can be entirely justified.

I think you read something different than I wrote.
 

P7M13

Messages
7,065
Reactions
15,779
This is not to say that we underestimate our prey. Predators take on dangerous prey whenever it’s necessary. They recognize the danger and take action to mitigate that danger. But the attitude is the same: It is not a fight, it is killing. It is butchery. A task that must be done. A task that WILL be done.

Humans have become so civilized that they have forgotten to be good animals. Civilization is a wonderful thing and it’s good that we’ve moved past embracing only our animal instincts and needs. But when it comes to the primal instinct of predator/prey, we must embrace the animal that we are.
View attachment 335194
I don't think it's that humans have become more civilized. Most people will be good natured and respectful toward one another; some folk will be civilized only because of laws enacted which make it illegal to do the things they might normally do. A minor portion of the population will be downright uncivil. None of it has anything to do with station in life.
Most of western civilization is too far removed from death, to the extent that people can eat cooked meat but not look at it raw. Somehow western civilization has cast the knacker into the realm of a dirty, disgusting and sinister profession. If we were all closer to death, witnessing it daily, reawakening our primal instinct would not be something you are suggesting.
Sadly, we do have a morbid obsession, hence "if it bleeds, it leads...."

[edit] and others will never possess either the "fighting" or the "predator/prey" instincts. They are sheep. Whether we ignore them, protect them, or allow them to be slaughtered is a choice.
 
OP
NWMA
Messages
75
Reactions
121
There is much truth in this premise. If you're in a fair fight your tactics need improvement.

Sometimes though we don't get to choose the circumstances of an engagement. Train for the worst case until reactions are automatic.
Totally agree.

My point though was about mindset...and the ability to change it as necessary. That applies as much to a proactive engagement as a reactive one.

Good mindset combined with solid trained responses. AND the ability to think and adjust accordingly.
 

albin25

Messages
3,206
Reactions
15,219
1. self defense ain't paintball, thugs aren't going to get a trophy and a re-match with their victims next weekend.
2. a moose or fish won't destroy his family and future if he chases his predator to kill it.
3. while animals are used as similes for human predators their motivations are different.
 
OP
NWMA
Messages
75
Reactions
121
Mine in bold...

I don't think it's that humans have become more civilized. Perhaps civilized was the wrong word. Too removed from gritty reality perhaps.

Most people will be good natured and respectful toward one another; Yes, as it should be

some folk will be civilized only because of laws enacted which make it illegal to do the things they might normally do. Perhaps not ideal...but if they refrain from unjustified violence towards others I'll take it.

A minor portion of the population will be downright uncivil. And the ones that take incivility to the point of unjustified violence is why I advocate an aggressive mindset...when it's necessary.

None of it has anything to do with station in life.

Most of western civilization is too far removed from death, to the extent that people can eat cooked meat but not look at it raw. Somehow western civilization has cast the knacker into the realm of a dirty, disgusting and sinister profession. Not entirely sure what you mean here but making a guess, I agree with you.

If we were all closer to death, witnessing it daily, reawakening our primal instinct would not be something you are suggesting. I might argue just the opposite. I'm not saying we should become cannibals. I AM suggesting that in the defense of your family, and for lack of a better word, your tribe, yes I think I am suggesting exactly that. One can be kind, loving and compassionate and quite capable of extreme violence at the same time. Becoming the predator in defense of that worth protecting is no vice in my eyes.

Sadly, we do have a morbid obsession, hence "if it bleeds, it leads...." You probably think that statement fits for me...I can only tell you that it does not.

[edit] and others will never possess either the "fighting" or the "predator/prey" instincts. Agree. Though I argue that some are capable of developing those instincts. I think it's something those interested in self-protection need to consider.

They are sheep. Whether we ignore them, protect them, or allow them to be slaughtered is a choice.
 
OP
NWMA
Messages
75
Reactions
121
Mine in bold
1. self defense ain't paintball, thugs aren't going to get a trophy and a re-match with their victims next weekend. Totally agree. I tend to think this statement supports my point

2. a moose or fish won't destroy his family and future if he chases his predator to kill it. Again...who here said anything about chasing down an attacker after he's no longer a threat?

3. while animals are used as similes for human predators their motivations are different. Yes...but I think it's usually understood that a metaphor only goes so far. The point was to help illustrate an idea.
 
OP
NWMA
Messages
75
Reactions
121
I'm not too concerned about the Walmart, nor a stick up at the gas station. I tend to think those situations are easily avoided.

Just a few incidents over the last several months:
11/28/16 - Columbus, Ohio. 1 killed and 11 injured from a vehicular attack, followed by a knife attack, at Ohio State University

9/17/16 - Saint Cloud, Minnesota. 1 killed and 10 injured in a stabbing attack at a shopping mall.

7/7/16 - Dallas, Texas. 6 killed and 10 injured by rifle fire.

6/12/16 - Orlando, Florida. 50 killed and 53 injured in nightclub terror attack.

2/11/16 - Columbus, Ohio. 1 killed and 4 injured in machete attack at restaurant.

12/3/15 - San Bernadino, California. 16 killed and 23 injured at an employee Christmas party and ensuing gun fight with police.

No, this kind of violence isn't common. But it clearly happens.

I'm not suggesting we walk around like tactical idiots. Nor am I suggesting we walk around in fear. I am suggesting that perhaps we adjust our definition of "every day self-defense". And for those of us who aspire to any level of preparation at all...perhaps we should train harder.

Or maybe that's just puffery. We can leave it at that.
 

Andy54Hawken

Messages
16,184
Reactions
78,012
Having had four combat tours I had to develop a mindset that could be used within the Rules Of Engagement in order to survive.
While some parts of that mindset are still in use , many while remembered are not.

A mindset that excels in one type of situation can be useless or even dangerous in a another setting or place.

Speaking only for myself , Situational Awareness is my biggest and most used mindset.
Learn to read whats going on around you and respond appropriately.

Appropriately as in what will help you given your abilities , skill , willingness to act etc ...
To get out of the situation with the least amount of fuss.
Andy
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

Project Appleseed
Douglas Ridge Rifle Club
27787 OR-224, Eagle Creek, OR 97022, USA
Albany Rifle & Pistol Club (ARPC) Gun Show 2021 show is cancelled
Linn County Expo Center
3700 Knox Butte Rd E, Albany, OR 97322, USA
22 Rimfire Challenge
Redmond Rod and Gun Club
Redmond, OR 97756, USA

LATEST RESOURCE REVIEWS

  • Sound Loan and Pawn
    5.00 star(s)
    Definitely recommended
    friendly people, great prices on guns ammo tools, jewelry, other pawn shop stuff, always been easy to deal with
  • A Cut Above Pawn
    5.00 star(s)
    Responsive, courteous, great comms and absolutely reasonable!
    Bought a firearm from a local NWF's member and as I live in Idaho it had to transfer through a local FFL. The Seller picked A Cut Above... The...
  • A Cut Above Pawn
    5.00 star(s)
    Another sterling experience A+
    Tyler is a great man and this place is a treasure. Reasonable fees and excellent service. Kind and polite. No BS. I will keep coming back.
  • A Cut Above Pawn
    5.00 star(s)
    Great FFL Gun Transfers.
    Last Saturday morning. Me & the wife bought a pistol from another great Northwestfirearm's member. Meet up A Cut Above pawn shop. Wife had a...
  • TJ Gun Sales
    5.00 star(s)
    TJ Gun Sales
    Needed some sights for a Glock 19. Found them here for a good price and free install. :)
Top Bottom