IRS refuses to answer why it needs AR-15's

[Stomper]

We need a "dislike" option here for posts... I would be willing to bet the poster you responded to works for the beast, or has some association..

These fed buildings are usually pretty tall. Those who terrorize out of them have a big fall coming

I hope I'm (at least) alive to see it, too!

 

[Stomper]

What difference does it make?

That right there has to be the most used (and abused) phrase in human history. I seem to recall the last high profile use of it by our "esteemed" former Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton when pressed in front of a Congressional panel of inquiry on the Benghazi debacle...

I bet the Romans said the same thing when the Visigoths were crossing the Rubicon, then repeated it when they were at gates of Rome.

Funny thing about history and those who have lived their entire lives in relative peace, safety, and prosperity... they always seem to forget it, then get it BRUTALLY repeated upon themselves. This often results in the pleading for a " messiah" to save them from their peril... resulting in their total enslavement, either from within the walls or from the hordes outside. In either case it ends in tears.

 

[bellarum]

Signed nothing. No background check. No verbal. I think that anyone working there after the building was occupied had to have a background check.

Whoa dude, I've worked on that project as well as the new FBI building near the airport... and in both cases went through a thorough background check and signed papers stating "I shall not discuss ANY specific details of the physicals of the facility".

As much as I despise an abusive government, if you did any of the same (signing such documents) you shouldn't post such things... anywhere. It'll rain down on you like Noah's flood if you get into the crosshairs... especially with the likes of wikileaks going on these days.

Just sayin'

 

[Stomper]

Signed nothing. No background check. No verbal. I think that anyone working there after the building was occupied had to have a background check.

Ok, cool! Just didn't want to see you get hammered by the machine.

 

[The B]

That right there has to be the most used (and abused) phrase in human history. I seem to recall the last high profile use of it by our "esteemed" former Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton when pressed in front of a Congressional panel of inquiry on the Benghazi debacle...

I bet the Romans said the same thing when the Visigoths were crossing the Rubicon, then repeated it when they were at gates of Rome.

Funny thing about history and those who have lived their entire lives in relative peace, safety, and prosperity... they always seem to forget it, then get it BRUTALLY repeated upon themselves. This often results in the pleading for a " messiah" to save them from their peril... resulting in their total enslavement, either from within the walls or from the hordes outside. In either case it ends in tears.

All that, and you didn't tell me what difference it makes.

 

[Stomper]

All that, and you didn't tell me what difference it makes.

Wow, I figured it should be obvious, but I shall indulge you, Ben.

A strong centralized and concentrated source of power (and the means to enforce that power) ALWAYS leads to an abuse of power. That's why we have a REPUBLIC with three co-equal branches of government, along with the Constitutional Convention and amendment process afforded to the States, and not a monarchy.

In theory it gives the citizenry enough time to react to, and counter an overreaching tyranny. Ideally the process starts (and ends) at the ballot box, but the Founding Fathers being the learned men that they were, also were painfully aware of the lessons of history and provided for a "reset button" if ever needed.

I don't know how old you are, Ben but as a kid in the 70's and early 80's I remember the days of hearing about abusive IRS agents making armed raids on average citizens and seizing their homes, and assets, and tossing them into jail cells BEFORE taking them to court for due process. A lot of that has been quelled due to public outcry, but the culture of abuse is still there... watch the news lately?

Checks and balances against unilateral government actions and abuses, Ben. It's a long gradually gentle slope downwards... that's what difference it makes.

 

[Squidly]

Wow, I figured it should be obvious, but I shall indulge you, Ben.

A strong centralized and concentrated source of power (and the means to enforce that power) ALWAYS leads to an abuse of power. That's why we have a REPUBLIC...

Nail, meet hammer.

 

[unklekippy]

Signed nothing. No background check. No verbal. I think that anyone working there after the building was occupied had to have a background check.

The former company I ran built the office furniture at the FBI building in Cascade Station, moved the IRS to their new location on top of the parking lot east of the cop shop, built the furniture in the FBI offices around the state, all the furniture at Ft. Lewis(that is A LOT of furniture) and other CIA branches and whatnot. It is true, occupancy is the key. If there were secrets involved in the construction, those involved would have filled out BGC,s. It's amazing what I and my former employees have seen. I worked at Bonneville Power Administration in Hazel Dell, WA for 3 years from '99-'02. There is a "war room" in the basement of the main building, then came post-911 renovation. I wonder what it looks like today? Finally, my mother worked at the Edith Green-Wyatt building for 26 years.

Quite frankly, with all the stuff I have seen in what I mentioned, I can only imagine the things I haven't seen.

 

[RBid]

We need a "dislike" option here for posts... I would be willing to bet the poster you responded to works for the beast, or has some association..

Thank you for the laugh, sir. That just made my day.

I may get around to writing a proper response. For now, I'll just say that not all issues are "all or nothing". I am NOT a fan of the state of taxes.

 

[The B]

Wow, I figured it should be obvious, but I shall indulge you, Ben.

A strong centralized and concentrated source of power (and the means to enforce that power) ALWAYS leads to an abuse of power. That's why we have a REPUBLIC with three co-equal branches of government, along with the Constitutional Convention and amendment process afforded to the States, and not a monarchy.

In theory it gives the citizenry enough time to react to, and counter an overreaching tyranny. Ideally the process starts (and ends) at the ballot box, but the Founding Fathers being the learned men that they were, also were painfully aware of the lessons of history and provided for a "reset button" if ever needed.

I don't know how old you are, Ben but as a kid in the 70's and early 80's I remember the days of hearing about abusive IRS agents making armed raids on average citizens and seizing their homes, and assets, and tossing them into jail cells BEFORE taking them to court for due process. A lot of that has been quelled due to public outcry, but the culture of abuse is still there... watch the news lately?

Checks and balances against unilateral government actions and abuses, Ben. It's a long gradually gentle slope downwards... that's what difference it makes.

Having efficient enforcement does not mean shelving checks and balances, Stomper. You can make your LE investigations and criminal prosecutions efficient, AND maintain a separation of powers... all at the same time. You seem to be implying that we should deliberately impede due process to prevent abuses of due process... that's just gumming up the works, not preserving liberty.

 

[Stomper]

Having efficient enforcement does not mean shelving checks and balances, Stomper. You can make your LE investigations and criminal prosecutions efficient, AND maintain a separation of powers... all at the same time. You seem to be implying that we should deliberately impede due process to prevent abuses of due process... that's just gumming up the works, not preserving liberty.

Well, as long as the trains run on time I guess everything will be just peachy-keen then. They ran on time under Benito Musolini, and I believe the Germans' trains ran so efficiently during WWII that the entire solar system ran by their lead. Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain, everything is efficient and fine.

"Gumming up the works" of tyranny IS preserving Liberty.

 

[RoneKiln]

Having efficient enforcement does not mean shelving checks and balances, Stomper. You can make your LE investigations and criminal prosecutions efficient, AND maintain a separation of powers... all at the same time. You seem to be implying that we should deliberately impede due process to prevent abuses of due process... that's just gumming up the works, not preserving liberty.

In the past, the IRS and the ATF have displayed a combination of tunnel vision and over zealousness when it comes to enforcement. The abuses they've committed in the past make many wary of allowing them to act as enforcers. Those agencies were meant to be administrative. We have police forces for a reason. The administrators should use those enforcement agencies that already exist instead of making their own private little armies. If you're not familiar with this history of abuse from our administrative agencies, I can understand why it seems silly for some people to be concerned. Aside from the issue of past abuses, multiple enforcement agencies creates far more complicated paperwork and administration needs and causes all sorts of screw-ups in the field. While this is a problem that will never be completely resolved, many do not like to see it actively made worse by administrative agencies that were never meant to be enforcement agencies in the first place.

For them to refuse to answer a legitimate query from our elected politicians as to why they have armed agents only adds to some people's wariness. Maybe they're only training office security that never go into the field. After all, a lot of people have cause to flip out on an IRS office. I'd be fine with their security being adequately armed to protect their workplace. But they're not answering with that. They're just refusing to answer. Why do our accountants need to be issued armaments at taxpayers expense?

 

[The B]

In general, I agree that every little agency doesn't need it's own "enforcement" wing. But we're talking about the IRS here, gentlemen. They're not a small bureau by any means, and they've almost always handled their own criminal investigations and enforcement. Any agency sending officers up against big, ruthless, hardened criminals should give them serious firepower.

 

[The B]

Never thought I'd ever be defending the Infernal Revenue Service, my single least favorite appendage of our government. Strange conversation, this.

 

[Stomper]

Indeed.

 

[Botte Hork]

Whoa dude, I've worked on that project as well as the new FBI building near the airport... and in both cases went through a thorough background check and signed papers stating "I shall not discuss ANY specific details of the physicals of the facility".

As much as I despise an abusive government, if you did any of the same (signing such documents) you shouldn't post such things... anywhere. It'll rain down on you like Noah's flood if you get into the crosshairs... especially with the likes of wikileaks going on these days.

Just sayin'

Keep in mind that you published the same information by quoting bellarum's post. The fact that it's between 'quote' tags doesn't mean you're off the hook. So if you're really concerned, I would remove those bits of crucial info from your post too...

 

[Stomper]

Keep in mind that you published the same information by quoting bellarum's post. The fact that it's between 'quote' tags doesn't mean you're off the hook. So if you're really concerned, I would remove those bits of crucial info from your post too...

So in theory with that logic, I could get in trouble for repeating what he said to an "authority figure" who may or may not have the proper clearance to that information if I were to report it.

If I quoted what he posted two posts before mine as part of an admonition not to if he signed a NDA is not me actually divulging what I know about the bones of those facilities. Plus his post was quoted so he would have no doubts as to who I was talking to, and what I was talking about.

I could beat that rap with one eye squinted.

 

[Stomper]

Having efficient enforcement does not mean shelving checks and balances, Stomper. You can make your LE investigations and criminal prosecutions efficient, AND maintain a separation of powers... all at the same time. You seem to be implying that we should deliberately impede due process to prevent abuses of due process... that's just gumming up the works, not preserving liberty.

I was just sitting here this morning catching up on the news from the latter part of last week and over the weekend, and listening to Pres. Obama talking about how the Republicans are only interested in "gumming up the works" concerning the affordable healthcare act.

Interesting phrase "gumming up the works", not used very frequently. It strikes me as rather "strange" timing of the phraseology used at the same time. I am not a huge believer in "coincidence", I suspect at worst a "professional" leftist sheite stirrer, or at best a "honest drone" believing in the "virtues" of an all-knowing, all-powerful, centralized government.

In either case, I see you!

 

[The B]

I was just sitting here this morning catching up on the news from the latter part of last week and over the weekend, and listening to Pres. Obama talking about how the Republicans are only interested in "gumming up the works" concerning the affordable healthcare act.

Interesting phrase "gumming up the works", not used very frequently. It strikes me as rather "strange" timing of the phraseology used at the same time. I am not a huge believer in "coincidence", I suspect at worst a "professional" leftist sheite stirrer, or at best a "honest drone" believing in the "virtues" of an all-knowing, all-powerful, centralized government).

In either case, I see you!

First of all, I think I make rational arguments, not "stir sheite." So we can cancel out professional Democrat troll (that and I'm an extremely established member of the local gun and shooting scene, use my real name, and have a long standing record of outspoken disapproval for our overreaching, over compromised, space-case federal legislative assembly and executive branch).

As to whether or not I pilfered the phrase from a man I don't care for- no. I haven't seen an Obama speech in months, and you're not going to catch me quoting him even if I did. His speech writer obviously follows my posts.



The preceding was brought to you by pride and indignation.

 

[The B]

It's funny how simply not hating the government and having really moderate political views can actually get you accused of being a political saboteur though.