If Biden can rule you have to be vaccinated to work, he can take your guns the same way

[wired]

Forgive me but I fail to understand your retort?

Just sounds like a typical union member line of thinking.

Of course not. So you like it that the government can force your employer to force you to get the jab or get a huge fine?

They're Nazis.

No one is forcing you to work for an employer that requires you to get vaccinated as a condition of employment.

 

[xtratoy]

think about it

 

[RobMa]

Just sounds like a typical union member line of thinking.

No one is forcing you to work for an employer that requires you to get vaccinated as a condition of employment.

Not yet... but when all the employers do... what then?

 

[thorborg]

I often wonder if the same folks that vehemently oppose and refuse to eat genetically modified foods have received the shot since it is also genetic modification of humans and not the same vaccine process vetted for decades.. Plus, when testing for safety, how can they be certain our future children, or grandchildren will not be adversely affected as it gets passed on considering Genetic modification is really in its infancy, scientifically.
I'm thrilled that the science of genetic modification has found great advances in the helping of previously helpless victims of poor health which had no where to turn, I'm hopeful the future holds great refinements in this arena for those wanting to embrace it voluntarily, but I also view with much trepidation forcefully subjecting all of mankind to what amounts to an experiment in genetic modification.

 

[GripItAndRipIt]

This is a common misconception. Vaccinations work. The data is clear on that. You're far less likely to get as sick or die with the vaccination. The reason people being unvaccinated is a problem, is because it allows the virus to spread through unvaccinated individuals easier, which gives opportunity for more mutations.

Uhm. Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but vaccines themselves are a leading driver of viral mutation as the microbe reflexively alters its DNA in response to a threat (the host's white blood cells activated by the vaccine) in a desperate attempt to replicate -- which is its sole function.

We mammals are endowed with an embedded vaccine library known as our immune system. This explains why prior to the proliferation of the Wuhan SARS vaccines, the human race had a ~99% survival rate.

The real risk posed by Wuhan SARS or any microbe frankly is to people with compromised immune systems -- some hereditary, some due to comorbidities -- who comprise the bulk of the mortality rates.

Vaccines are a useful tool in controlling the spread of a virulent microbe, but are honestly no substitute for good old natural immunity. The vaccines tend to be most applicable to the lowest common denominator: the unhealthy, the immunosuppressed, the elderly, etc.. The majority of people don't need to be vaccinated. But the state wants to impose a "one size fits all" pogrom in the name of expediency and they are using fear of the stick to achieve it.

 

[wired]

Not yet... but when all the employers do... what then?

Stand your ground. Show them who the boss is.

 

[GripItAndRipIt]

I feel no one should be forced to get a shot. If your employer is requiring you to get a shot you have every right to exercise your free will and ditch that employer.

Don't disagree, however that's not what's happening here, aka "moving the goalposts."

The federal government will be overstepping its boundaries by unilaterally imposing sanctions on employers for noncompliance with wholly arbitrary and unsubstantiated rules it has no lawful authority to emplace.

 

[wired]

Don't disagree, however that's not what's happening here, aka "moving the goalposts."

The federal government will be overstepping its boundaries by unilaterally imposing sanctions on employers for noncompliance with wholly arbitrary and unsubstantiated rules it has no lawful authority to emplace.

Then the courts will sort it out. Theres a lot of precedent showing that it is constitutional for the government to require vaccinations or impose fines. The Constitution isnt just what you want it to be.

 

[RobMa]

Then the courts will sort it out. Theres a lot of precedent showing that it is constitutional for the government to require vaccinations or impose fines. The Constitution isnt just what you want it to be.

Yes the courts will sort it out but not until after massive damage has been done to our liberties and our country

 

[kmk1012]

Yes the courts will sort it out but not until after massive damage has been done to our liberties and our country

Cannot say I disagree at all!

 

[patrikky]

No one owes you a job. Union man?

On a local level Unions are great. They give employees a voice.

 

[wired]

On a local level Unions are great. They give employees a voice.

As a manager who's worked in several union shops over the years all I can see that they protect workers who should be fired and of course cause unnecessary and businesses threatening expense.

 

[GripItAndRipIt]

Then the courts will sort it out.

Fallacy: Argumentum ad vericundiam.

Theres a lot of precedent showing that it is constitutional for the government to require vaccinations or impose fines.

NB: Please cite this precedent as it applies to the current circumstance. Thank you.

The Constitution isnt just what you want it to be.

Fallac(ies): Straw man, argumentum ad hominem. I am neither the topic of this thread, nor did I reference any claims of the constitutionality of this pogrom.

The real issue here is the 'grave danger test' and whether a reasonable argument exists for the emplacement of a nebulous 'emergency temporary status' order to be enforced by an unelected, unaccountable bureaucracy while our politicians pat themselves on the back for using the administrative state as a cudgel against the people.

 

[Cavedweller]

Uhm. Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but vaccines themselves are a leading driver of viral mutation as the microbe reflexively alters its DNA in response to a threat (the host's white blood cells activated by the vaccine) in a desperate attempt to replicate which is its sole function.

We mammals are endowed with an embedded vaccine known as our immine system. This explains why prior to the profliferation of the Wuhan SARS, the human race had a ~99% survival rate.

The real risk posed by Wuhan SARS or any microbe frankly is to people with compromised immune systems -- some hereditary, some due to comorbidities -- who comprise the bulk of the mortality rates.

Vaccines are a useful tool in controlling the spread of a virulent microbe, but are honestly no substitute for good old natural immunity. The vaccines tend to be most applicable to the lowest common denominator: the unhealthy, the immunosuppressed, the elderly, etc.. The majority of people don't need to be vaccinated. But the state wants to impose a "one size fits all" pogrom in the name of expediency and they are using fear of the stick to achieve it.

This is partially correct, but some misconceptions are presented here. First of all, if we are speaking of Covid, it has no DNA. It is a RNA virus.

Secondly, neither vaccines nor natural immunity "drive" mutation. Mutations occur randomly due to errors in replication. Some mutations are beneficial, some are deleterious. Whether a mutation is one or the other is largely determined by the environment. Microbes do not alter their genetic structure in response to the immune system. Those which are conferred an advantage by a beneficial mutation simply reproduce at a greater rate than those without that mutation. Natural selection drives this process, mutation only provides the raw material.

Thirdly, immune response to viruses is largely antibody driven, and not cellular. It doesn't matter whether the antibody response is vaccine produced or natural. Immunity in the host will select for a strain which can evade the immune response.

 

[patrikky]

As a manager who's worked in several union shops over the years all I can see that they protect workers who should be fired and of course cause unnecessary and businesses threatening expense.

So what you're saying is that as a manager you may have been incompetent. If a company wants to fire an employee for violating the company's written procedures and policies the company can. So either the Union employee was not violating procedures and policies or the companies management was not following said procedures and policies for corrective action and dismissal.

 

[beefwithcheese]

Uhm. Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but vaccines themselves are a leading driver of viral mutation as the microbe reflexively alters its DNA in response to a threat (the host's white blood cells activated by the vaccine) in a desperate attempt to replicate -- which is its sole function.

We mammals are endowed with an embedded vaccine library known as our immune system. This explains why prior to the proliferation of the Wuhan SARS vaccines, the human race had a ~99% survival rate.

The real risk posed by Wuhan SARS or any microbe frankly is to people with compromised immune systems -- some hereditary, some due to comorbidities -- who comprise the bulk of the mortality rates.

Vaccines are a useful tool in controlling the spread of a virulent microbe, but are honestly no substitute for good old natural immunity. The vaccines tend to be most applicable to the lowest common denominator: the unhealthy, the immunosuppressed, the elderly, etc.. The majority of people don't need to be vaccinated. But the state wants to impose a "one size fits all" pogrom in the name of expediency and they are using fear of the stick to achieve it.

I'm sorry, but where are you receiving this info, because that is demonstrably false? Virus mutate freely by running through populations. Vaccines make it harder to be infected, thus making it more difficult for mutations to happen. https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-mutations-vaccine-idUSL1N2OZ1PU

 

[Longwalkhome]

If the jab truly was a working vaccine then this would be over by now. There are 178 million fully jab with both shots.

 

[308]

If the jab truly was a working vaccine then this would be over by now. There are 178 million fully jab with both shots.

Yeah they should not be complaining and just let us rebellious pro-nonjabbers die off since the virus with a 98% survival rate is so deadly….

 

[wired]

Fallacy: Argumentum ad vericundiam.

NB: Please cite this precedent as it applies to the current circumstance. Thank you.


Fallac(ies): Straw man, argumentum ad hominem. I am neither the topic of this thread, nor did I reference any claims of the constitutionality of this pogrom.

The real issue here is the 'grave danger test' and whether a reasonable argument exists for the emplacement of a nebulous 'emergency temporary status' order to be enforced by an unelected, unaccountable bureaucracy while our politicians pat themselves on the back for using the administrative state as a cudgel against the people.

Jacob V Massachussets
Zucht v King

 

[wired]

Yeah they should not be complaining and just let us rebellious pro-nonjabbers die off since the virus with a 98% survival rate is so deadly….

A 98% survival rate with say 100 million getting the virus is still 2 million dead.

Math