Had a Double With My Revolver

[The Heretic]

Anyone who owns a 329 PD is a glutton for punishment!

A coworker had one for camping, and he described it as "carried often, shot little".

Yes, and the 460V is shot, but never carried.

 

[edslhead]

Never had any problems with my 460 and Ive hunted with it a few times.

 

[Mistman]

I've shot a 500 quite a number of times and have never had that happen but I kinda get it. I've shot a 4", not much fun and I like heavy recoil handguns.

Last deer season my partner and I decided to stop at a rock quarry as he had his 8" 500 loaded w/some 500 grainers and wanted to see how they shot. He hadn't shot it a lot and these were some new loads he put together. I wasn't too excited as the 4" experience wasn't exactly pleasant. He had 100 rounds loaded up. He shot a cylinder through it, didn't seem too bad from my observation. When I shot that thing the grin factor started spiking, I couldn't get enough of it. The compensated 8" barrel made it a joy to shoot, had a great time making gravel.

When we got back to camp my nephew had lined up some cans on a log and was plinking them w/a 22 revolver. He was about 25 yds away and wasn't having a lot of luck knocking them over. I quietly went over and got the 500, loaded it up and nonchalantly walked over to where he was shooting. Raised up the 500 one handed (found it to be fun 1 handed at the quarry) and proceeded to send a can into the stratosphere. Tell the truth, I was trying to get on target pretty quickly as I didn't really want him to see what I was doing so when that can took a leap I was a little surprised. He and I were the only ones in camp w/ear protection, the other guys were like "what the H was that!". The muzzle brake sure tames the recoil but makes it ungodly loud for anyone near it. That was actually one of 'those' shots that you never expect to make but are pleasantly rewarded when they work out. My opinion sure changed about the 500 magnum between the 4" and 8" versions, went from 'okay, I guess I'll shoot it' to 'heck yeah, bring it on!".

 

[The Heretic]

Never had any problems with my 460 and Ive hunted with it a few times.

My only problem with it is that it is so large and heavy.

If I still worked in Alaska or somewhere else with huge brown bears, I might carry it. If I worked where there were polar bears I would probably carry it or one of my Shockwaves with slugs. But my 329 PD is fine for Orygun.

 

[edslhead]

I sling it like a rifle.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

Is this why a properly designed brake on a 7lb 338 Lapua magnum will kick less than a 10lb one without? lol

Brakes on rifles often have side ports with baffles for the gas to act against, or sometimes the ports are even angled backwards a bit. They are generally designed to control linear recoil, from my uneducated understanding.

Most revolvers are simply ported on top, which helps control muzzle rise, but I'm not sure it does much for linear recoil.

The Smith has a few different port designs available, from ports on top only to both top and side ports, with different versions for lead and jacketed bullets. The side ports may definitely help some with linear recoil, but it seems to me that they were originally more focused on countering the muzzle rise and rotational force.

I've also read a lot of opinions where people hate the muzzle brakes and feel they are ineffective, only serving to increase muzzle blast. One theory is that the amount of gas isn't enough to counter the recoil from bullet weight, especially with the really heavy bullets.

Regardless of how well it works, trying to compare it to a .338 Lapua muzzle brake is a bit ridiculous, in my opinion.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

I've shot a 500 quite a number of times and have never had that happen but I kinda get it. I've shot a 4", not much fun and I like heavy recoil handguns.

Last deer season my partner and I decided to stop at a rock quarry as he had his 8" 500 loaded w/some 500 grainers and wanted to see how they shot. He hadn't shot it a lot and these were some new loads he put together. I wasn't too excited as the 4" experience wasn't exactly pleasant. He had 100 rounds loaded up. He shot a cylinder through it, didn't seem too bad from my observation. When I shot that thing the grin factor started spiking, I couldn't get enough of it. The compensated 8" barrel made it a joy to shoot, had a great time making gravel.

When we got back to camp my nephew had lined up some cans on a log and was plinking them w/a 22 revolver. He was about 25 yds away and wasn't having a lot of luck knocking them over. I quietly went over and got the 500, loaded it up and nonchalantly walked over to where he was shooting. Raised up the 500 one handed (found it to be fun 1 handed at the quarry) and proceeded to send a can into the stratosphere. Tell the truth, I was trying to get on target pretty quickly as I didn't really want him to see what I was doing so when that can took a leap I was a little surprised. He and I were the only ones in camp w/ear protection, the other guys were like "what the H was that!". The muzzle brake sure tames the recoil but makes it ungodly loud for anyone near it. That was actually one of 'those' shots that you never expect to make but are pleasantly rewarded when they work out. My opinion sure changed about the 500 magnum between the 4" and 8" versions, went from 'okay, I guess I'll shoot it' to 'heck yeah, bring it on!".

I'm curious about your experience with the muzzle brake. Did it help with the rearward recoil or more with the rotational torque on your wrists?

 

[DirectDrive]

First time I ever shot a 500 S&W, I had shot a 329PD (44 Mag) just before.
The 500 didn't seem bad at all compared to that nasty 329PD.

Good idea though, to do the one round thing for the n00bs until they get acclimated.

 

[Mistman]

I'm curious about your experience with the muzzle brake. Did it help with the rearward recoil or more with the rotational torque on your wrists?

I believe I misspoke as I called the compensator a muzzle brake, I looked it up and they aren't the same but often function similarly or in combination. I attributed the reduced recoil of the 8" over the 4" to the longer barrel and extra weight. The muzzle flip on the 4" was hard to control, the 8" was back on target more in line w/a 44 mag w/a solid locked up hold. I have an 8" scoped SRH, the 8" 500 was more in-line w/the recoil of that w/stout 240gn loads. To tell the truth, it felt a little less snappy than the 44, more of a huge push but easily controlled one handed w/a good hold.

After watching some people shoot the 500 it seems that they don't properly prepare for the recoil. Knowing how to properly grip a revolver and preparing for some massive recoil keeps it well controlled. You can't use a 2 handed semi-auto hold and expect good results. The trigger guard and cylinder shroud bump (not sure what it's called) will smack your fingers/thumb hard. One handed actually allows a more comfortable grip, I shoot revolvers both ways.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

I believe I misspoke as I called the compensator a muzzle brake, I looked it up and they aren't the same but often function similarly or in combination. I attributed the reduced recoil of the 8" over the 4" to the longer barrel and extra weight. The muzzle flip on the 4" was hard to control, the 8" was back on target more in line w/a 44 mag w/a solid locked up hold. I have an 8" scoped SRH, the 8" 500 was more in-line w/the recoil of that w/stout 240gn loads. To tell the truth, it felt a little less snappy than the 44, more of a huge push but easily controlled one handed w/a good hold.

After watching some people shoot the 500 it seems that they don't properly prepare for the recoil. Knowing how to properly grip a revolver and preparing for some massive recoil keeps it well controlled. You can't use a 2 handed semi-auto hold and expect good results. The trigger guard and cylinder shroud bump (not sure what it's called) will smack your fingers/thumb hard. One handed actually allows a more comfortable grip, I shoot revolvers both ways.

It wasn't you who misspoke, I'm the one that's been incorrectly calling it a muzzle brake this entire time...

I think you're spot on about the extra length and weight. Having over 4 lbs of pistol probably does help tame the recoil some, I imagine.

 

[tac]

I understand the so-called 'doubling', after all, that's zackly what happened with the original owner of my 4" bbl Model 29 when he fired two 300gr 'for Thompson Contender Only' cartridges in it on its first outing. Ten years later I bought it with the original box of ammunition containing two empty cases.

The first shot went into the target and the second through the roof...

 

[FordPrefect]

I'm really REALLY interested to see what a 700gr .50 revolver bullet looks like that ISN'T like the one shot in a Ma Deuce.

Here are some photos. I can't find the fun one, with a shot of the cylinder with the 700 grains loaded which take up all but about 0.02" of the length of the cylinder. I guess I'll have to take another photo of that.

From the top, 350 grain, 500-grain FTX, 700 grain.


700 grain loaded vs AA battery

350 grain 50 Magnum vs 44 Magnum.

 

[FordPrefect]

It wasn't you who misspoke, I'm the one that's been incorrectly calling it a muzzle brake this entire time...

I think you're spot on about the extra length and weight. Having over 4 lbs of pistol probably does help tame the recoil some, I imagine.

That was my reasoning for getting the 10" version. I wanted the thing to weight as much as I could make it.

 

[bbbass]

Shooting boomers in deer/elk camp...

 

[Certaindeaf]

Brakes on rifles often have side ports with baffles for the gas to act against, or sometimes the ports are even angled backwards a bit. They are generally designed to control linear recoil, from my uneducated understanding.

Most revolvers are simply ported on top, which helps control muzzle rise, but I'm not sure it does much for linear recoil.

The Smith has a few different port designs available, from ports on top only to both top and side ports, with different versions for lead and jacketed bullets. The side ports may definitely help some with linear recoil, but it seems to me that they were originally more focused on countering the muzzle rise and rotational force.

I've also read a lot of opinions where people hate the muzzle brakes and feel they are ineffective, only serving to increase muzzle blast. One theory is that the amount of gas isn't enough to counter the recoil from bullet weight, especially with the really heavy bullets.

Regardless of how well it works, trying to compare it to a .338 Lapua muzzle brake is a bit ridiculous, in my opinion.

Yea, the Smith has them on the sides of the barrel.. and that's what we're talking about here so it works just like they do on a rifle.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

Yea, the Smith has them on the sides of the barrel.. and that's what we're talking about here so it works just like they do on a rifle.

Actually, there are Smiths with top ports only, Smiths with top and side ports, and even Smiths with no ports at all. Without confirmation or a photo from OP, we are merely presuming which model he has. Odds are it is the normal model with top and side ports though.

Regardless, I would presume that pistol compensators do not work as well as rifle muzzle brakes, due to the lower pressure and volume of gas. However, I am not an expert in muzzle brake design, gas flow, or fluid dynamics (or really anything, for that matter), so I will gladly cede the debate.

I do still believe OP's experience was based primarily on poor trigger follow through and an instinctive reaction to grip tighter, and certainly could have been exacerbated by hammer bounce.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it!


Harrumph.

 

[kmk1012]

Actually, there are Smiths with top ports only, Smiths with top and side ports, and even Smiths with no ports at all. Without confirmation or a photo from OP, we are merely presuming which model he has. Odds are it is the normal model with top and side ports though.

Regardless, I would presume that pistol compensators do not work as well as rifle muzzle brakes, due to the lower pressure and volume of gas. However, I am not an expert in muzzle brake design, gas flow, or fluid dynamics (or really anything, for that matter), so I will gladly cede the debate.

I do still believe OP's experience was based primarily on poor trigger follow through and an instinctive reaction to grip tighter, and certainly could have been exacerbated by hammer bounce.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it!


Harrumph.

My pistol is an early model with the ports in the top only. Here is a side shot of it.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

View attachment 568567
My pistol is an early model with the ports in the top only. Here is a side shot of it.

Honestly, I think that's my favorite version. I think the side ports would annoy the crap out of me, as well as everyone around me!

I had a ported Taurus .357 Magnum for a while that looked very similar, just smaller. That was back when Taurus was using old S&W machines.

Interestingly enough, that was the revolver I had the cylinder turn backwards on once, just like they drscribed for the early model of your S&W.

Speaking of which, you should probably try to research the problem with the cylinder stop. From what I've read, the early models had issues with it, and then S&W fixed it for later models. It might even be worth a phone call to S&W just to be safe.

 

[kmk1012]

Honestly, I think that's my favorite version. I think the side ports would annoy the crap out of me, as well as everyone around me!

I had a ported Taurus .357 Magnum for a while that looked very similar, just smaller. That was back when Taurus was using old S&W machines.

Interestingly enough, that was the revolver I had the cylinder turn backwards on once, just like they drscribed for the early model of your S&W.

Speaking of which, you should probably try to research the problem with the cylinder stop. From what I've read, the early models had issues with it, and then S&W fixed it for later models. It might even be worth a phone call to S&W just to be safe.

I've got a message to them asking if anything should be addressed. If it needs a trip back to the factory to be looked at I'd rather do that versus always wondering every time I squeeze a round off.

 

[FordPrefect]

Finally found the photo of my 500 magnum with the 700-grain rounds loaded.