Fury - the left just hates this movie

[Kevinkris]

guess i was wrong but it still doesnt make it okay to do the same thing. you will never convince me that using nuclear bomb on japan was necessary, logical or ethically acceptable. japan of that time most certainly was a deserving enemy of the US, we all know that of course. we really didnt need to use them to end the war that was already coming to a close.

and Jack if that was directed at me , you definitely have me confused with someone else. im far to libertarian to agree with government control of peoples lives. to even say the US is still a free country would be against my personal philosophy.

 

[Stomper]

well saying the outcome would have been the same if the US had not joined is partly true but it would have certainly been a longer and bloodier war. not to mention we would not have risen to be such an influential and privileged nation. we also could not sit out when we had blood spilled on our soil. i do have a disdain for the use of nuclear weapons though. no historian can honestly tell you the Japanese emperor surrendered because of the nuclear bombs. they were simply out of resources and nearly out of young men. i feel for the crew of those 2 planes for feeling obligated to do such a thing though.

I wasn't going to bother with you, but that's some revisionist view on history you have there, dude.

Had we not got involved militarily and materially with lend-lease of weapons, and raw materials, England would have succumbed to the Luftwaffe raids, they would have been decimated in North Africa, the Russians would have withered without the 2nd front opened by the D-Day invasion on ships and equipment mainly supplied by he USA, as well as the most treacherous of the beaches taken on by the US Army, and massive airborne operations, then there's the Battle of the Bulge...

Japan surrendered because they had no idea that we only two atom bombs, and the Emporer didn't want the Japanese nation to completely perish based in the knowledge they had at the time.

Those bombs spared the lives of possibly 1,000,000 American casualties because we didn't have to outright invade Japan. They started the war, they brutalized, raped, murdered, enslaved and tortured those who were conquered.

It can be argued that if you ARE going to go to war, the most ethical thing you can do is use your best weapons right away to end the war as fast as possible.

i dont recall hearing anything about the japanese executing anyone except for solders. although i do understand the innate risk in the carpet bombing of the day but our leaders of the time knew they were targeting residential areas with the atom bombs. when it comes to WW2 our guys only did to thing anyone can call immoral and they called them fat man and little boy.

also i dont see how that video has to do with anything i said coastal.

I had an uncle who survived the Bataan death march, only to die aboard a Japanese prison ship. You need step away from the Xbox, and turn up your hearing-aid.

 

[erudne]

The co-founder of the Portland, OR Philippine/American Cultural Society was a Battan Death March Survivor, he was released from the Death Camp after 18 months along with the rest of the Philippine Patriots .
Their families were held hostage and murdered as their sons fought the Japanese.
Hung, beheaded, raped.
You talk about Resistance
I don't think you know what that word means
We are men who love our children and our country
We will make you understand what that means

 

[ted.wen]

i dont recall hearing anything about the japanese executing anyone except for solders. although i do understand the innate risk in the carpet bombing of the day but our leaders of the time knew they were targeting residential areas with the atom bombs. when it comes to WW2 our guys only did to thing anyone can call immoral and they called them fat man and little boy.

also i dont see how that video has to do with anything i said coastal.

You need read about rape of Nanking. Japanese killed many innocent Chinese and other Asians under their occupation.

I can guarantee you, 90% of Chinese think a-bomb Japan was the right decision. Japanese are good at playing victims after the war, but what they did during and be for WWII in China is the source of tension between the two nations today.

 

[ted.wen]

guess i was wrong but it still doesnt make it okay to do the same thing. you will never convince me that using nuclear bomb on japan was necessary, logical or ethically acceptable. japan of that time most certainly was a deserving enemy of the US, we all know that of course. we really didnt need to use them to end the war that was already coming to a close.

and Jack if that was directed at me , you definitely have me confused with someone else. im far to libertarian to agree with government control of peoples lives. to even say the US is still a free country would be against my personal philosophy.

Why should more American soldiers die for the sake of saving Japanese who were firmly behind their government? If Japan surrendered earlier, they have saved their own peoples lives. A-bombs also saved many Chinese soldiers lives.

I want to stand on the moral high ground as well, but that is after the threat and danger is over. You are saying the war ending as a sure thing, did the Japanese say they would surrender? Did Truman has a calendar with Japanese surrender date on it before the A-Bomb? We all have the benefit of knowing the outcome of the war, but people at the time did not.

 

[U201491]

what about the woman and children killed by the bombs?

And what about all the women a children and civilians beheaded and chopped up or shot through out all the pacific islands and the genocides they committed on the Chinese during that war and before.
The Japanese were as evil as the Nazi's.
Not only did it end the war and save Thousands of American and allies lives, It let another power that was also developing the bomb, know we would use it and it most likely made them think long and hard about using it against Europe or America.
And no nation has used it beyond threats since.
My hunch is the only ones dumb enough to use one, will be the Islamics. They will end up paying a price far above what they can afford when they do.

 

[BAMCIS]

i dont recall hearing anything about the japanese executing anyone except for solders. although i do understand the innate risk in the carpet bombing of the day but our leaders of the time knew they were targeting residential areas with the atom bombs. when it comes to WW2 our guys only did to thing anyone can call immoral and they called them fat man and little boy.

​

Sadly, it appears the revisionist historians hard work is starting to pay off.

Imagine how prevalent this type of understanding (of history) will to be in future generations.

 

[Kevinkris]

wow clearly we have some dense people. you people seem to think i believe we had no reason to go to war with japan. i have already admitted i made a mistake with some of their actions. all of you are crazy for thinking i am defending them solely as victims. the only thing i believe our guys did wrong was drop nuclear bombs on innocent people. none of you can tell me that women and children that had nothing to do with fighting the war deserved to be killed in mass like that and if you do, i suggest you seek help. even if the women did anything to aid the war effort you still cannot say children fall into acceptable targets. that would be like saying we should execute the children of murderers along with their guilty parents. all of you getting hung up on that should do some serious soul searching.

 

[gunfreak]

Every country has done bad during war. I too have read about the stabbing of pregnant Chinese by Japanese, the German death camps, and I am currently reading Killing Patton. In it tells of Stalin and the estimated 6 million polish and other surrounding countries people. The US new of it but needed Russia's help to defeat Hitler.

 

[DMcGPNW]

i dont recall hearing anything about the japanese executing anyone except for solders. although i do understand the innate risk in the carpet bombing of the day but our leaders of the time knew they were targeting residential areas with the atom bombs. when it comes to WW2 our guys only did to thing anyone can call immoral and they called them fat man and little boy.

also i dont see how that video has to do with anything i said coastal.

It's getting cold out you should travel somewhere warm. The Phillipines are an up and coming destination. The Aussies love it. Oh and head up to Luzon and swing through Manila and make the same comment in a crowded square or bar. You may find the response enlightening.

 

[Kevinkris]

maybe you should continue reading some more. and if you have, maybe consider the soul searching advice. the only thing im concerned with getting cold is your heart.

 

[Just Jim]

maybe you should continue reading some more. and if you have, maybe consider the soul searching advice. the only thing im concerned with getting cold is your heart.

Yep, no sense letting facts get in the way of your feelings.

 

[Kevinkris]

thats right, the fact is US military leaders specifically targeted civilian areas where there were no significant japanese soldiers. the whole point was to kill people not fighting. the people that gave that order are sick people and the world is a better place without them. strange how some people here people feel so strongly about keeping their families safe from harm regardless of who threatens that safety, could feel so strongly about justifying destroying the families of others. if the bombs had targeted military installations with any significant usefulness to their war effort you may have some ground with this argument. it still does not justify destroying entire communities with their children in toe. on top of that, making the land poisonous without telling them it would be after the end of the war. allowing future generations to suffer from radiation sickness. like i said, if thats okay with anyone here you should seek help. the use of nuclear bombs was wrong and gave no military advantage that we did not already possess. the fight was over and all it served to do was beat the dead horse and drown their kids.

 

[Just Jim]

thats right, the fact is US military leaders specifically targeted civilian areas where there were no significant japanese soldiers. the whole point was to kill people not fighting. the people that gave that order are sick people and the world is a better place without them. strange how some people here people feel so strongly about keeping their families safe from harm regardless of who threatens that safety, could feel so strongly about justifying destroying the families of others. if the bombs had targeted military installations with any significant usefulness to their war effort you may have some ground with this argument. it still does not justify destroying entire communities with their children in toe. on top of that, making the land poisonous without telling them it would be after the end of the war. allowing future generations to suffer from radiation sickness. like i said, if thats okay with anyone here you should seek help. the use of nuclear bombs was wrong and gave no military advantage that we did not already possess. the fight was over and all it served to do was beat the dead horse and drown their kids.

So,in your mind it would have been better to lose a million American fighting men than to bomb two cities we were at war with?

 

[albin25]

If I remember correctly the Japanese Gov's plans for the defense of the country included throwing women, children and the elderly into "kamakazi" style waves against an invasion to die for their Divine Emperor. Much like Hilter put children as young as 9, the frail and elderly and women into uniform for the final defense. Japan's ferocious self-made image of "fight 'till the last person dies" and incredible brutality towards it's enemies, is probably more to blame for the final outcome than anything else. By this time the US military was not in the mood for another bloody island beachhead and then a house to house battle against an enemy that was ready and willing to die for their Emperor God.

If wars were fought using feelings and hindsight...maybe Hirohito and Truman would have raced their unicorns to see who won.

 

[BAMCIS]

Imagine had the bombs not been used. The Russians were poised to start fighting Japan. Indeed they had started the day the first bomb was dropped. Imagine how Japan would have turned out had the Soviet Union gotten more involved. Japan would have ended up looking a lot like West and East Germany, North and South Korea and so on.

Truman understood he needed to end the war quickly for many reasons. He knew the Russians were going to be troublesome after the war. Most of all, he felt (and I agree) it would have been immoral not to use them, in other words not get the war over with as quickly as possible.

Civilian deaths are an unfortunate reality of any war and should be avoided if possible. But not at the expense of a single American or American military objective. Imagine the civilian deaths had an invasion of Japan taken place. (Hint: Take a look at the battles of Guam and Okinawa.) The civilian deaths would have been many, many times that of the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

I'm not trying to pick on you Kevinkris, but as I mentioned in my earlier post the revisionist historians are hard at work.

 

[BAMCIS]

If wars were fought using feelings and hindsight...maybe Hirohito and Truman would have raced their unicorns to see who won.

That's hilarious! Except to be more accurate it would have been Roosevelt and Hirohito. At least at the start of the war anyway.

​

​

 

[ted.wen]

thats right, the fact is US military leaders specifically targeted civilian areas where there were no significant japanese soldiers. the whole point was to kill people not fighting. the people that gave that order are sick people and the world is a better place without them. strange how some people here people feel so strongly about keeping their families safe from harm regardless of who threatens that safety, could feel so strongly about justifying destroying the families of others. if the bombs had targeted military installations with any significant usefulness to their war effort you may have some ground with this argument. it still does not justify destroying entire communities with their children in toe. on top of that, making the land poisonous without telling them it would be after the end of the war. allowing future generations to suffer from radiation sickness. like i said, if thats okay with anyone here you should seek help. the use of nuclear bombs was wrong and gave no military advantage that we did not already possess. the fight was over and all it served to do was beat the dead horse and drown their kids.

I saw the pictures of the suffering Japanese in Nagasaki and Hiroshima and sympathize with them. However, I sympathize more with ally forces and countries. Japanese government and military already showed their willingness to sacrifice their troops and most of their soldiers were outside of Japan. I definitely wouldn't want to see Chinese civilians die just because they lived close to Japanese troops in Manchuria.

We also should not judge history using current standard. Japan bombed Chinese cities, Germany bombed London, that was the way how war was conducted. Today decapitation by ISIS is considered brutal and inhumane way of killing enemies, but go back just 100 years, decapitation was used a lot for capital punishment.

I sympathize with the Japanese civilians, but the suffering was brought on by the the Japanese government, not by the US. They picked a fight and did not want to quit. The US only used the available means to try to end it the fastest. If the A Bomb was available right after Pearl Harbor, it could have saved a lot more lives, including Japanese.

 

[Stomper]

wow clearly we have some dense people. you people seem to think i believe we had no reason to go to war with japan. i have already admitted i made a mistake with some of their actions. all of you are crazy for thinking i am defending them solely as victims. the only thing i believe our guys did wrong was drop nuclear bombs on innocent people. none of you can tell me that women and children that had nothing to do with fighting the war deserved to be killed in mass like that and if you do, i suggest you seek help. even if the women did anything to aid the war effort you still cannot say children fall into acceptable targets. that would be like saying we should execute the children of murderers along with their guilty parents. all of you getting hung up on that should do some serious soul searching.

You obviously lack a clear understanding of that enemy's culture. The Japanese were a feudal society (that got industrialized) and lived under a warrior code. Every man, woman, and child was raised from birth to hold the Emporer of Japan as a literal god, and his ministers, district overlords (etc) were to be ABSOLUTELY obeyed in ALL THINGS. To do otherwise was to dishonor yourself and your entire family, which meant they would ALL be executed right down to the last newborn distant cousin and eternal dishonor (a fate worse than death).

The typical westerner has no clue on how the eastern mind works (it truly is bizzare to us). The Japanese society loved death (for their Emporer) more than we loved life. Today's Islamic jihadist say the same thing, and in fact put their bodies where their mouths are. Warfare isn't just armies against armies, it's civilizations fighting civilizations from the top down, and back up to the top.

I've served in the Army, I don't regret the things I did... what I regret is THE NESSISSITY OF HAVING TO DO THEM. As for my heart & soul... It's only as cold as it NEEDS to be.

 

[BoonDocks36]

You obviously lack a clear understanding of that enemy's culture. The Japanese were a feudal society (that got industrialized) and lived under a warrior code. Every man, woman, and child was raised from birth to hold the Emporer of Japan as a literal god, and his ministers, district overlords (etc) were to be ABSOLUTELY obeyed in ALL THINGS. To do otherwise was to dishonor yourself and your entire family, which meant they would ALL be executed right down to the last newborn distant cousin and eternal dishonor (a fate worse than death).

^^^^ Real Historical TRUTH ^^^^

The typical westerner has no clue on how the eastern mind works (it truly is bizzare to us). The Japanese society loved death (for their Emporer) more than we loved life.

^^^^ One of the Top FIVE Reality Statements in this thread.^^^^

Today's Islamic jihadist say the same thing, and in fact put their bodies where their mouths are. Warfare isn't just armies against armies, it's civilizations fighting civilizations from the top down, and back up to the top.

Our Country put thousands of Americans, of Japanese ethnicity, into camps, for Two Reasons, one has been Entirely forgotten, by revivionist history... The fact they Were Protected, inside the Camps, has been disregarded... It is easier for Communist Propoganda (I won't mince words) to shout how bigoted it was, how Biased it was. If anyone thinks that, I have three numbers for you: '442' as in the "Go for Broke" Batallion. A CLOSE family friend, was a member of the 442nd, he was one of them that received the Medal of HONOR. And LIVED. He was one of the men who carried my Fathers Casket, that Close a family friend. So I have personal knowledge, of how our Japanese ethnicity American Citizens Really Felt, about the Camps.

Now, let us Compare THAT, to the Japanese Invasion into Manchurian China. And their use of Chemical Weapons, against the Population, enclosed in CAMPS. The Japanese Chemical Battalion is one of the most hidden facts of Pre WWII, such wonderful troops, they saved out the feminine of the population, to RAPE, GANG RAPE, and then Mutilate, the women.... Survivors were then put into the chemicals... Manchuria, on occaision, continues to find NEW locations, uncovering tens of thousands of citizens, that the Japanese ~released from the need to breathe~ ISN'T that a gentle way of saying what took place...

Almost as gentle as the Unicorn Race shown above... Trying for a rainbow effect with the icons.... Oh I let an emotion get hold of me.

I've served in the Army, I don't regret the things I did... what I regret is THE NESSISSITY OF HAVING TO DO THEM. As for my heart & soul... It's only as cold as it NEEDS to be.

STOM MAN, I pray your heart & SOUL is Warm, and "fuzzy" as it should be, and that you were only Euphamizing there...

Gee, I never realized how Close, how Similar Euphamizing & Euthanizing are!!!!! I Euphamize a lot!!!!! Still have not practiced the other.... YET.

philip,

Revisionist History Writers should be drawn & quartered, not by Unicorns... But by Wild Stallions. Held in check until the ropes are tightly upon the writer.

Then we should gather all the FUTURE revisionist Writers and ~suggest~ they could learn from what they see, and Write Truth, or be ready for a Wild Stallion Ride, upon publishing truth, as they Revise it.

~darn those US NAVY ships, being in the way, of where those
Japanese Bombers were practising "Protection" of their Countries boundaries~ ....