Cross border OR/WA FTF gun sales discussion

[Trlsmn]

Cross border OR/WA FTF gun sales discussion. I have seen several posts from AD's where the non FFL private citizen states he can sell his gun in either state because he is a resident of both states.

My thoughts say that this is incorrect.

What say you?

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[Cougfan2]

Methinks a quick e-mail to OFF might provide an answer. I'll send the e-mail and post reply if I get one, but the are usually pretty good about answering questions.

 

[Captain Question]

I don't think you can be a resident of more than one state, but I don't practice federal law, so buyers beware - it would not behoove you to be paying a federal attorney big money to argue with a federal prosecutor over the issue.

Between states needs to involve an FFL, as best as I can tell.

 

[Trlsmn]

I don't think you can be a resident of more than one state, but I don't practice federal law, so buyers beware - it would not behoove you to be paying a federal attorney big money to argue with a federal prosecutor over the issue.

Between states needs to involve an FFL, as best as I can tell.

That's the way I understand it too.

 

[markw76]

You only have one primary residence, you only vote in one state. Anything else requires the involvement of an FFL.

 

[Cougfan2]

Never mind. Was typing a response when I saw MarkW's post

 

[slyguy]

Hmm - I thought FFL required for handgun transfers, but for WA to OR residents long gun is OK with bill of sale. I agree with involve FFL to take no chances.

 

[PhysicsGuy]

Hmm - I thought FFL required for handgun transfers, but for WA to OR residents long gun is OK with bill of sale. I agree with involve FFL to take no chances.

Nooooooo

§ 178.29 Out-of-State acquisition of
firearms by nonlicensees.
No person, other than a licensed importer,
licensed manufacturer, licensed
dealer, or licensed collector, shall
transport into or receive in the State
where the person resides (or if a corporation
or other business entity,
where it maintains a place of business)
any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained
by such person outside that
State: Provided, That the provisions of
this section:
(a) Shall not preclude any person who
lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest
or intestate succession in a State other
than his State of residence from transporting
the firearm into or receiving it
in that State, if it is lawful for such
person to purchase or possess such firearm
in that State,
(b) Shall not apply to the transportation
or receipt of a rifle or shotgun
obtained from a licensed manufacturer,
licensed importer, licensed dealer, or
licensed collector in a State other than
the transferee’s State of residence in
an over-the-counter transaction at the
licensee’s premises obtained in conformity
with the provisions of
§ 178.96(c) and
(c) Shall not apply to the transportation
or receipt of a firearm obtained
in conformity with the provisions of
§§ 178.30 and 178.97.
[T.D. ATF–270, 53 FR 10493, Mar. 31, 1988]

 

[bcp]

You can be a resident of 2 states.

From:
<broken link removed>

27 CFR 478.11
Title 27: Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms
PART 478&#8212;COMMERCE IN FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION
State of residence. The State in which an individual resides. An individual resides in a State if he or she is present in a State with the intention of making a home in that State. If an individual is on active duty as a member of the Armed Forces, the individual's State of residence is the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. An alien who is legally in the United States shall be considered to be a resident of a State only if the alien is residing in the State and has resided in the State for a period of at least 90 days prior to the date of sale or delivery of a firearm. The following are examples that illustrate this definition:

Example 2. A is a U.S. citizen and maintains a home in State X and a home in State Y. A resides in State X except for weekends or the summer months of the year and in State Y for the weekends or the summer months of the year. During the time that A actually resides in State X, A is a resident of State X, and during the time that A actually resides in State Y, A is a resident of State Y.

 

[twoclones]

From the ATF website FAQ...

May an unlicensed person obtain a firearm from an out-of-State source if the person arranges to obtain the firearm through a licensed dealer in the purchaser's own State?


A person not licensed under the GCA and not prohibited from acquiring firearms may purchase a firearm from an out-of-State source and obtain the firearm if an arrangement is made with a licensed dealer in the purchaser's State of residence for the purchaser to obtain the firearm from the dealer.

It would make sense that I, as a Washington resident, should be able to purchase weapons in Oregon since I have an Oregon non-resident concealed carry permit. But it's probably a BYO situation

 

[twoclones]

Meant to include this one as well from the ATF

From whom may an unlicensed person acquire a firearm under the GCA?

A person may only acquire a firearm within the person's own State, except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee's premises in any State, provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides. A person may borrow or rent a firearm in any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes.

 

[PhysicsGuy]

From the ATF website FAQ...



It would make sense that I, as a Washington resident, should be able to purchase weapons in Oregon since I have an Oregon non-resident concealed carry permit. But it's probably a BYO situation

You do realize what this is stating?

It says that someone may purchase a firearms from out of state if arrangements are made to have it sent to a FFL in the home state. Just like buying a gun from gunbroker.com, and having it shipped to your local FFL.

Also, are you confusing the term "Licensed" with a concealed carry license? "licensee's" in these terms is referring to someone with a Federal Firearms License.

 

[twoclones]

Not confusing anything. Just failed to paste in the second question and answer.

 

[PhysicsGuy]

Not confusing anything. Just failed to paste in the second question and answer.

Okay, just had to make sure that you weren't thinking that you could buy a gun because you had a CHL

 

[twoclones]

Okay, just had to make sure that you weren't thinking that you could buy a gun because you had a CHL

But wouldn't that be a reasonable thing for the law to allow? Currently, I can carry a loaded gun in my pocket in at least 30 states but can buy [in person] in only one of those states. Who thought of that crap?

 

[PhysicsGuy]

But wouldn't that be a reasonable thing for the law to allow? Currently, I can carry a loaded gun in my pocket in at least 30 states but can buy [in person] in only one of those states. Who thought of that crap?

Welcome to the Separated States of America, I always found it to be odd that it could possibly be a negative thing to purchase a gun from another state, I guess the lawmakers think that people must be wanting to commit some crime if they purchase a gun across state lines.

 

[Randini]

I would not say to anyone to do something that is wrong, so if a seller sells and there is no record/bill of sell then who is to know? a bit like the dont ask dont tell.

 

[Bello425]

You can be a resident of 2 states.

From:
<broken link removed>

27 CFR 478.11
Title 27: Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms
PART 478—COMMERCE IN FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION
State of residence. The State in which an individual resides. An individual resides in a State if he or she is present in a State with the intention of making a home in that State.If an individual is on active duty as a member of the Armed Forces, the individual's State of residence is the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. An alien who is legally in the United States shall be considered to be a resident of a State only if the alien is residing in the State and has resided in the State for a period of at least 90 days prior to the date of sale or delivery of a firearm. The following are examples that illustrate this definition:

Example 2. A is a U.S. citizen and maintains a home in State X and a home in State Y. A resides in State X except for weekends or the summer months of the year and in State Y for the weekends or the summer months of the year. During the time that A actually resides in State X, A is a resident of State X, and during the time that A actually resides in State Y, A is a resident of State Y.

+1

 

[eriknemily]

I would not say to anyone to do something that is wrong, so if a seller sells and there is no record/bill of sell then who is to know? a bit like the dont ask dont tell.

Not worth the risk to me. On the other hand, it has been convenient to have a friend who lived out of state purchase a gun and then move to my state within the next couple of months. Doesn't happen very often but still nice when it does

 

[PhysicsGuy]

I would not say to anyone to do something that is wrong, so if a seller sells and there is no record/bill of sell then who is to know? a bit like the dont ask dont tell.

The ATF likes to do sting operations, so going through with such a transaction could land you with about 10 years in club fed, and usually the people working for the ATF seem just like normal gun owners. Better to be safe than sorry is what I go by.