International Catalonia - Independence Vote

[Argonaut]

You remember when a few states in the south wanted to leave the union, here in the States!?!
Only the most productive killing fields in history to that point in time. Issues are issues, but the feds arent fixin to let any state go.
Let alone an economy as large as California. I say screw commiefornia, let them succeed.
This is the same issue with Catalonia. That region is Spains major economic value. But let them succeed.
The Kurds saved Iraq from ISIS, they held it down when the US govt sat back with thumb in rectum not knowing what to do. the Kurds got screwed again by the US federal government.

Great point and another opportunity to tout my Senator Jim Risch. He sat with Kurdish representives 4 years ago at the state of the union and lobbied the (criminal) administration to send them arms. The criminal administration refused.

 

[Argonaut]

If I was king.......I would draw a line about 75 miles from the coast (how far are Portland and Seattle from the coast) from Mexico to Canada and drop it into the Pacific.

 

[Provincial]

If I was king.......I would draw a line about 75 miles from the coast (how far are Portland and Seattle from the coast) from Mexico to Canada and drop it into the Pacific.

Hey! There are a lot of us that live in the Coast Range and don't think like the urban masses. Have the King make his decison based on something less arbitrary. And don't stick us with the urban areas, either!

 

[Argonaut]

Hey! There are a lot of us that live in the Coast Range and don't think like the urban masses. Have the King make his decison based on something less arbitrary. And don't stick us with the urban areas, either!

I understand that.......there are good conservatives in California too. It is all about the macro vs the micro.

 

[FireArm]

Catalonia independence, became cutting off a section of America
into the ocean?
Glad your not "King".

I hear the separatist leaders bailed to a different country. Weird that they didnt want to stay and fight.
I was thinking there was going to be a civil war. The people of the region seem to be very much behind the movement of Catalonia independence but not willing to fight the Central Spanish Government over the issue.
Odd days we live in where political leaders start political battles, then flee the country in fear of imprisonment. What ever happened to leaders being leaders by example and actually leading... now days leaders lead by passing more layers and layers of laws. People dont lead anymore, they get into a position of some power and negate the people who got them there, and abuse the power until they get caught, or move up.
Thus the American political system we have today of corrupt vs corrupt. The vote any more comes down to choosing evil or evil(the lesser of two evils being the person elected, normally). And this has become our acceptable system of politics.

 

[Argonaut]

Catalonia independence, became cutting off a section of America
into the ocean?
Glad your not "King".

I hear the separatist leaders bailed to a different country. Weird that they didnt want to stay and fight.
I was thinking there was going to be a civil war. The people of the region seem to be very much behind the movement of Catalonia independence but not willing to fight the Central Spanish Government over the issue.
Odd days we live in where political leaders start political battles, then flee the country in fear of imprisonment. What ever happened to leaders being leaders by example and actually leading... now days leaders lead by passing more layers and layers of laws. People dont lead anymore, they get into a position of some power and negate the people who got them there, and abuse the power until they get caught, or move up.

Everything that you (we) know about this subject is filtered through the press.........not a reliable source.......the Spanish political and social issues have always been very complicated. When I was there you couldn't tell the good guys from the bad. It all looked like an 8 sided firing squad. What was it like when you were there?

 

[FireArm]

My sister lived there for two years, went for a vacation became a Nanny to a wealthy Catalon family. They made sure she told people she was in Catalonia not Spain. I personally havent been to Spain. Im sure if I was there it would be for the Festivals not the politics.
I can read and write Spanish, I can speak it just not as fluently as I can read and write. Catalonia independence was an issue back then in 2008. So I have been slightly more up on the issue then people just learning about the region. I did for a while read thea local news when my sister was there and for a time after.
Im not looking to get into a measuring contest over the issue or stating I know more of Catalonia Independence then another just looking to get the convo back on track.

 

[ob1]

So I am thinking...how about splitting up Portland ? The lefties can have everything West of the Willamette....err....West of 39th {that would eliminate City Hall, PSU and the Hawthorne and Reed Districts} Then we could establish Highway 26 as a DMZ.

 

[Argonaut]

It seems to me that this is a pretty minor issue on today's stage. Spain has been the European stepchild since before Franco and deffinatly since. There issues rarely spill out of there boarders (the Nazis used the Spanish civil war as a training exercise) and generally pale in comparison to other European threats. (I am sure if you or yours were on the receiving end of the problems, you would feel differently) Prior to the advent of common literacy and mass media, all terrorisom was local, mostly studied by historians after the event. Today, we have instant information that promotes fear and loathing worldwide from even the remotest events. The problem is everything is filtered through the bias of the author. My people have been involved in major historical wars since before the Norman invasion in 1066. Many times on both sides of the conflict so in my studies it is imperative to understand who is laying the text down and what his perspective was. When I spent time in Spain, I had no dog in the fight and found no clear hero's. Tensions have built for a thousand years in many cases. The only clear cut conflict to me is between Christians and Muslims....especially on the Iberian peninsula. The differences between Catholics in Catalonia, Andalusia, the Basque region or whatever other divisions there are seem trivial by comparison. It is more akin to a family feud than an international crises.

 

[Argonaut]

So I am thinking...how about splitting up Portland ? The lefties can have everything West of the Willamette....err....West of 39th {that would eliminate City Hall, PSU and the Hawthorne and Reed Districts} Then we could establish Highway 26 as a DMZ.

sounds good but as we all know, Lefties are incapable feeding or providing for themselves. Soon they would be building tunnels under the road, crying about how unfair it is that conservatives have everything and they have nothing. They would soon be starving in the streets and we would have to rescue them. Off course, as soon as we nursed them to health, they would steel anything they could carry and run back to there squalor only to be repeated over and over again.

 

[ArgentineSteel]

I understand that.......there are good conservatives in California too. It is all about the macro vs the micro.

The "King" should have a better Gerrymandering process

 

[ob1]

sounds good but as we all know, Lefties are incapable feeding or providing for themselves. Soon they would be building tunnels under the road, crying about how unfair it is that conservatives have everything and they have nothing. They would soon be starving in the streets and we would have to rescue them. Off course, as soon as we nursed them to health, they would steel anything they could carry and run back to there squalor only to be repeated over and over again.

Well the solution to that is pretty straight forward. Leak it out that we in Eastlandia only have red meat and no tofu to eat...Then in horror..they didi mau back to California.

 

[ArgentineSteel]

sounds good but as we all know, Lefties are incapable feeding or providing for themselves. Soon they would be building tunnels under the road, crying about how unfair it is that conservatives have everything and they have nothing. They would soon be starving in the streets and we would have to rescue them. Off course, as soon as we nursed them to health, they would steel anything they could carry and run back to there squalor only to be repeated over and over again.

You might consider warning the area a possible disaster of biblical proportions is coming.
Put Ray Nagin in control of the Disaster Prep
Plug the Gorge for a few weeks and then blow it to flood the willamette valley

The Conservatives will move their families ahead of time.
The industrious Liberals will stay to loot the homes of conservatives and the lazy ones will stay waiting for Nagin to get them a bus

Seattle just needs a pyroclastic flow from Rainer. The Kings Valley is aimed at downtown like a shotgun.

And California comes with it's own flushing mechanism. Waiting for the Big One.

 

[Argonaut]

Well the solution to that is pretty straight forward. Leak it out that we in Eastlandia only have red meat and no tofu to eat...Then in horror..they didi mau back to California.

If it was only that simple. My dad used to pray for harsh winters (in Spokane) to chase them Home. It is truly a shame that today we are growing so many local lefties. People that are products of great (conservative) western pioneers that are radicalized by our education system.

 

[CountryGent]

Josep Carreras (better known as José Carreras here, or "the other guy" for the Seinfeld fans), quite possibly my favorite opera singer, sneaks in a comment. That comment being "Visca Catalunya lliure" (Long live a free Catalonia). I found this clip strangely funny, so am passing it along.

 

[CountryGent]

I recently saw a statement from the tenor on the topic too:

"I am pro-independence and I am very patriotic. Sometimes you have to express how you feel, even if it could cause you problems in some situations." — José Carreras​

 

[mrblond]

My GF is Spanish and is going to Barcelona over the weekend on business which I am not thrilled about.

 

[RicInOR]

Spain to issue arrest warrant for Catalan leader

An EU warrant?

Madrid (AFP) - A judge in Madrid was set Friday to issue an EU arrest warrant for Catalonia's deposed leader over his region's tumultuous independence drive, in a move likely to take tensions to a new level in Spain's worst political crisis in decades.

 

[RicInOR]

Sep 11 2018

One million Catalans rally for independence in Barcelona - France 24

 

[CountryGent]

​

​

One of my favorite singers, José Carreras, "trolled" the media over there, and posted for the levity and the silliness:

(I am most assuredly an American, born and raised, and love this country with every fiber of my being. With ever increasing depth of study on the topic of this great land, the more I love and admire what was created here. And, as such, I labor to preserve this amazing, beautiful, wild, experiment in liberty, in any way I can. Back to the topic, my father's side is Catalan, and therefore my family name is such, so I follow some news from over there. Whatever may be, I have to support the self-determination of all peoples, but more specifically the rights most wonderfully enshrined in our Constitution.)