Arizona SWAT shoots marine, new developments

[titsonritz]

Sirens don't mean anything, could be an ambulance or a firetruck.

Get real a siren blaring right outside in your driveway, followed by a series of pounding on your front door, then a breach. Yeah, sounds like an ambulance or a firetruck to me.

goon squads
stormtroopers
tax-eating freaks

You are quite obviously a cop hater; perhaps that fact is impairing your judgment in this case.

 

[jimwsea]

A few questions...

At first look at the raw video, I thought I was watching video taken in daylight (shadows, colors, textures). Is the latest generation of night vision helmet cams that good?

If anyone knows the protocol for identifying themselves and the minimum amount of time knocking in the door, do the SWAT team actions conform?

 

[ZigZagZeke]

Get real a siren blaring right outside in your driveway, followed by a series of pounding on your front door, then a breach. Yeah, sounds like an ambulance or a firetruck to me.

You are quite obviously a cop hater; perhaps that fact is impairing your judgment in this case.

It's cases like this that create cop haters. Going with the facts as we have them so far there's no excuse for the way this was handled.

 

[titsonritz]

At first look at the raw video, I thought I was watching video taken in daylight (shadows, colors, textures). Is the latest generation of night vision helmet cams that good?

This incident took place in the mid-morning in broad daylight

It's cases like this that create cop haters. Going with the facts as we have them so far there's no excuse for the way this was handled.

What facts are you referring to? There certainly have not been any coming from the media.

 

[dmancornell]

What facts are you referring to? There certainly have not been any coming from the media.

Facts:

- Cops pulled off a home invasion to justify their tax-eating jobs when they could have knocked on the door to serve the warrant
- Cops shot a man 60 times, a man who likely did not even point the rifle at them since the safety was still engaged
- Cops actively denied medical care to their victim and let him die
- Cops shamelessly lie through their teeth about every facet of the shooting
- Cops slander the victim by accusing him of crimes without any evidence

Educated people dislike cops for a reason, it's because of these types of incidents which happen every single day. Exposing their crimes is a moral duty.

 

[titsonritz]

With the exception of "Cops shot a man 60 times", there is not a single fact, only unsubstantiated allegations.

 

[Grunwald]

Here is the video clearly showing the SWAT team came in with sirens blaring and properly identified themselves.

<broken link removed>

Are you kidding? Those sirens sound like a car alarm. That's what I would have thought it was if I heard them. Seeing this video, my opinion is only confirmed that this was an egregious example of police' abuse of force.
As for them identifying themselves, I cannot make out what is being said at all.

Additionally, if what I read is true and the warrant was not for a specific house nor person, then every single cop on this raid should be throw in jail.
They have an obligation to refuse unlawful order, and if they do break the law then they cannot claim protection as a benefit of their position.
Everyone of us that has served in the military should remember that we were trained to refuse unlawful orders. Same goes for the police - they are not above the law.

 

[Sasquatchvnv]

<broken link removed>

 

[ZigZagZeke]

With the exception of "Cops shot a man 60 times", there is not a single fact, only unsubstantiated allegations.

The media reports and police tapes are the only information we have. Until we hear differently I have to put some credence in them. I can't automatically discount them just because I think the police can do no wrong and they're all noble heros, like you do.

With the situation as reported there was no excuse for how this was handled. Even if we consider only your single "fact", there's no excuse for shooting a suspect 60 times. That's just mindless excess. If police are trained that way it only supports my view that police training has become too militaristic. In a war, anyone not wearing your uniform is an enemy. That's not true on the streets. "Kill them all and let God sort them out" doesn't fly when 99% of the population is innocent civilians.

Maybe you can help me figure out why the Sandy, OR cops got away with shooting a naked, unarmed man who was standing on top of a patrol car's roof a few years ago. That's always haunted me because I can see absolutely ZERO justification for it. Neither the officers, nor the public were in danger from an unarmed, naked guy standing on a patrol car roof. Was he going to pull an AR out of his butt? There are a half dozen of this kind of stories just around Portland in the last 10 years. You wonder why folks question the police and their motives and training?

Perhaps homeowners should take a procedural cue from the SWAT teams. When in doubt about who's breaking down your door at 2 am, shoot as many of the unidentified other guys as possible before you go down. If you survive you can apologize later. That should be good enough for the police, since they expect it to be good enough for us citizens.

 

[svxr8dr]

Video Timeline

:06 siren on
:13 siren off
:20 officer gives signal he will knock
:27 officer moves to door and knocks
:33 door breached
:37 officers enter doorway
:41 shots fired
:48 shots end

 

[dmancornell]

With the exception of "Cops shot a man 60 times", there is not a single fact, only unsubstantiated allegations.

On the contrary, except for the first item, everything I said is collaborated by media reports, shot 60 times, denied medical care, caught in multiple lies, slandering the victim by accusing him of being involved in a "home invasion" ring without proof. That is documented fact. Go to my first post and read the linked news reports.

Before you claim the media reports to be useless conjecture, explain why the cops deserve any more credibility than reporters, especially since they've been caught lying about every detail of the shooting.

 

[dmancornell]

Video Timeline

:06 siren on
:13 siren off
:20 officer gives signal he will knock
:27 officer moves to door and knocks
:33 door breached
:37 officers enter doorway
:41 shots fired
:48 shots end

Thanks for documenting this. 6 seconds from knock to bashing the door down. Even if Guerena were immediately woken up by the siren that gave him only 27 seconds to process the flood of information coming at him from his wife and outside noises. Clearly an impossible situation.

Seriously, did the cops really expect the door to be answered in 6 seconds? WTF?

 

[Bazooka Joe]

Seriously, did the cops really expect the door to be answered in 6 seconds? WTF?

Seriously, it takes me longer than that when I'm completely awake.

 

[supergenius]

Oh, nice....


More pigs with badges guns and sticks... AND FAR LESS TRAINING THAN NEEDED FOR THE SITUATIONS THEYRE PUT IN... DId you see that breech? What a joke...

WHat would you have had thought-done after the car alarm (NOT A PIG SIREN) went off???, the morons set off his alarm... DERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR, after that suspect *** breach, having had family murdered in the same fashion.. coming back off 2 tours? Im thinking I need to grab my gun, but its loaded and safety off.

EVERY ONE of them that shot SHOULD HANG.


Can you feel it? The publics about had enough.


What comes next.......


I literally wanted to pumell everyone of those delta force wannabe clowns with my elbow while watching that clip, but was sick to my stomach.

 

[Sasquatchvnv]

Thanks for documenting this. 6 seconds from knock to bashing the door down. Even if Guerena were immediately woken up by the siren that gave him only 27 seconds to process the flood of information coming at him from his wife and outside noises. Clearly an impossible situation.

Seriously, did the cops really expect the door to be answered in 6 seconds? WTF?

There was absolutely no expectation on the part of the police that the door would be opened and a civilized exchange would take place. The animals had every intention of kicking the door in and putting the slave in his place. Sick of it? Yeah - we're getting sick of it.

 

[Sasquatchvnv]

Arizona Police Under Scrutiny After Opening Fire on and Killing Marine in His Home - FoxNews.com

 

[supergenius]

YouTube - &#x202a;Raw video: PCSD helmet cam clip shows SWAT raid and shooting&#x202c;&rlm;


F these clowns. Hope they hang... 70 rounds, are you f ing kidding me??? Ya. Totally neccessary.

 

[armedredneck]

After watching the video......yeah, what the #%*@ were these guys doing? Their "entry" alone shows severe lack of training and discipline. The guy breaching the door busts it open and then casually walks away and stands there with his back turned to a potential threat for several seconds? Not only that but he was completely squared up with the door when he breached it. Just begging to be shot. There were several other things but that's what jumped out at me right away from the video sasquatch linked to on Fox News.

I know, I know, I'm armchair quarterbacking....but these guys really looked like clowns. If they came through that door and he was right there with a rifle pointed at them then I don't blame them for firing. They have to assess and assume he's a threat. They don't know if/when he's going to pull that trigger.

On the other side, as I posted before, the suspect was probably not aware of what was really going down as he was probably startled from his sleep and preparing to repel a home invasion.

I think it's just a very unfortunate situation all the way around, although I do believe from what I've read and seen so far that the po po really screwed up on this one.

....and 60 times? 70 times? Whatever. That's excessive. Do you really believe he was still standing there presenting a threat after say, the first 10 rounds entered his body? May have still been standing but not necessarily posing a threat any longer......I don't know, again I wasn't there. This thing really stinks and at this point I'm going to have to say that my opinion is that they royally screwed up. The mentality nowadays is shoot first, ask questions later.

All the law enforcement training I've received was to be overly aggressive in EVERY situation. It's what they're teaching these guys now. Everyone's a scumbag.

I believe they just kicked in his door and murdered him. On national TV no less. How long is the public going to continue to put up with these scenarios?

Oh and let's not forget that these "pro's" weren't able to clear the rest of the house so they let him bleed out for an hour. Not that medical attention would have mattered much after taking 60 rounds........

 

[Grunwald]

One of these days they will do this to a relative of a national level politician and that's when things will be done to restrain this abuse of force.
Imagine if a Harry Reid's son is staying over at his friend's house and becomes a victim of such a shooting.
All of a sudden you will have national attention focused on fixing this trampling of the Constitution.
Sad truth is that in the eyes of those in power our lives are worth a lot less than those of their own friends and families.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

If they came through that door and he was right there with a rifle pointed at them then I don't blame them for firing. They have to assess and assume he's a threat. They don't know if/when he's going to pull that trigger.

If he was going to resist, at least 4 of those clowns wouldn't be alive right now. He wouldn't either, but that's the unfortunate truth in these raids, they'll just send more until you are dead, or send in tons of tear gas that just happens to "accidentally" set the house on fire.
He probably did more real house clearing in his time in the USMC than those guys have done in training and figured they couldn't be that serious acting like amateurs. Didn't even have to take his weapon off safety, just assess the situ..bangbangbangbangbangbangbangbangbangbangbangbang
Looked more like a hit than an arrest warrant. Nice coup de grace shot at the end.