.380 vs .38spl in a small EDC thinking out loud

[brentb636]

I have a very nice pre-lock 442 with a fancy trigger job -- best trigger on any gun I have owned. Also have a Micro Desert Eagle, which is a very nice and compact all metal .380 6+1. Of them I think the 442 is the better gun, but the MDE carries better. That said, depending on how I'm dressed, either one might get carried.

As other have said, shot placement is more important than caliber, and I argue that reliability of the firearm is as important as shot placement. My experience with the little .380s is that most have feeding and ejection issues. I went to a fancy range in Seattle with a couple buddies who were gun shopping and we rented and tested about 10 of the compact .380s (every one they had) -- in total we put about 5-6 boxes of ammo downrange. Each little gun got 3-4 magazines put though it, and we all shot at least one mag from each gun. We also played with my MDE and 442.

It was an expensive afternoon

Every single one of the compact .380s had some type of issue -- including the Kahr and the Sig. The Taurus and the Ruger had by far the worst triggers. The Sig had the best trigger but had reliability issues. My MDE was the most reliable, but the hardest to shoot due to the long hard trigger pull --other than for me, 'cause I had lots of practice.

But, my little 442 went bang every time, had tight groups, and had a DA pull almost as good as the best .380 SA pull. They both agreed that it was their favorite of all the ones we shot that afternoon.

p.s. BBTI - Ballistics by the Inch :: Home

I'm pleasantly surprised by the uDesert Eagle. I hated the Keltec, and the Bodyguard 380, but my MDE continues to be a reliable 25 foot shooter. Winter months in Michigan , I'm carrying a CZ-82, for the extra margin of punch and firepower, but in warmer months, the little MDE is quite undetectable, and comfortable to carry.

 

[chemist]

Lots of people have opinions, but not as many have information to share.
Often overlooked: revolvers are much more sensitive to dirt and drops than semis.

People who chose their .38 spl for its "reliability" have never rolled around in the mud with it, or chucked it out of a freaking airplane, for pete's sake!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6i3dtytmBA

How likely is that to happen? A lot more likely than having to face down two armed guys on the highway. Reliability is EVERYTHING, and wheelguns don't even come close.

 

[Mark W.]

Dude I can assure you the chances of me chucking my revolver out an airplane is in the .00001% range so I won't be worrying about that. As to the rolling around in the Mud possible though again highly unlikely since if I draw the weapon within seconds I'll be pulling the trigger cause I must be in immediate danger to have drawn it in the first place.

YMMV

 

[RVTECH]

Reliability is EVERYTHING, and wheelguns don't even come close.

This is a new revelation. Unfortunately I cannot agree given my own, longtime experience with both wheelguns and autos. Give me a wheelgun for reliability ANYTIME.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Yep, the issue (IMO) with wheelguns is caliber

 

[fireninja13]

Yep, the issue (IMO) with wheelguns is caliber

Indeed -- that is the BEST part of running revolvers is the ability to fire magnum rounds. 9mm and .45 ACP are ok, but they ain't got sh*t on .357 Magnum and .44 Magnum

And, yes, you can get a .357 mag in a small light EDC. You can even get a decent snubby .44 mag for similar duty. But firing either of is not for anyone with weak wrists. . .

 

[Snowy Rivers]

I am gonna stir the kettle a bit.

I currently carry either a Taurus 738 (38O MOUSE GUN) or a Glock 32 (357 sig)
The mouse gun carries totally unnoticed in a Bulldog pouch on my belt and no matter if I am wearing a
coat or not, the gun is handy.

The Glock 357 is far better at stopping, but harder to hide, especially in warm weather.

I also have a Glock 29 (baby 10 mike) which is the same size as the 32 (close anyway)

The 10mm has got a lot of ka ho nees, but it weighs more too.

After having a stroke about a year and a half ago my right hand is still pretty much MIA

I have decided to go with an FN five seven in a fanny pack carry.

This little beast has virtually zero recoil, and carries a butt ton of ammo (20 rnds)

Now, before the neigh sayers go after it, remember the Fort Hood shooting ???????? A 5.7x28 was used, and everyone shot CTM succumb to their wounds.

The extremely fast round does not ask questions.

Having been in the training business for many many years has allowed me access to much data, and no matter what your shooting, its shot placement that makes the big difference.

Unless you are using a 500 smith mag with hollow points, or a scatter gun with 00 buck at point blank range it's all a crap shoot.

Severe shock to the CNS is a biggy, and a single well placed round to the central computer will stop all unwanted actions, and quick.

Get something that does not mind a bit of dirt.

I must admit to being a Glock Freek, but am looking forward to carrying the Five Seven.

Just some thoughts

Ms SNOWY (Yes thats right)

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Indeed -- that is the BEST part of running revolvers is the ability to fire magnum rounds. 9mm and .45 ACP are ok, but they ain't got sh*t on .357 Magnum and .44 Magnum

And, yes, you can get a .357 mag in a small light EDC. You can even get a decent snubby .44 mag for similar duty. But firing either of is not for anyone with weak wrists. . .

Agreed, IF you are using VERY fast and high velocity frangible loads that work at snubbie velocities

To snowys comments, I wish I could carry a 40MM grenade launcher but we have to use what is safer in a crowd, so we do our best. My next primary may be an EAA Witness 10MM Elite

 

[fireninja13]

I am gonna stir the kettle a bit.

The extremely fast round does not ask questions.

Actually, I agree that round speed leads to penetration and that shot placement is very very important. Two of my daily carry pieces are NAA .22 Magnum revolvers -- the 4" barrel lives in my boot and the little pug disappears into any pocket. You can get well over 1000fps from the short barrel and 1500fps from a 4" barrel with the right modern ammo. And hardball .22 mag has been known to punch right through "bulletproof" vests.

 

[fireninja13]

Agreed, IF you are using VERY fast and high velocity frangible loads that work at snubbie velocities

Yep -- ammo choice is really really important from a short barreled gun. Some of the new stuff designed for short barrel carry guns is pretty awesome, both in .357 mag and in the .38 spec +p and +p+

if anyone wants to know more about about the effects of barrel length on performance this site is a must read:
BBTI - Ballistics by the Inch :: Home

it turns out that size really does matter

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Agreed, technology is making fast advances

 

[Snowy Rivers]

Sadly, our society is advancing in retrograde.

More and more violence, that only a few years ago was pretty much limited to the dark inner city regions.

The sprouting of the school shootings is just one example of just how far society has decayed.

Back in 1989 when Oregon's CCW came online, it was just not nearly as common for most folks to carry on a regular basis.
Now it's common place for so many.

Technology has advanced exponentially, but society is going backwards.

I wrote and directed a 1-1/2 hour CCW training video a few years ago, Titled "The Urban Wild West"
I look back on that now, and the title was quite appropriate, and pretty accurate too.

Anymore, I feel naked out there on the byways of life without some iron, Well Polymer if you will

Ya just never know any more.

For many, they will never need to pull the piece, but for others it may happen.


Be safe troops

Keep your powder dry.

Snowy

 

[Blitzkrieg]

We are mimicking the fall of Rome but at a faster pace

BTW Snowy, welcome to the forum, look forward to reading more of your thoughts

 

[Snowy Rivers]

THANK YOU

This old girl can get opinionated at times, but I try not to get out on the fringe too far.

Snowy

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Perhaps. . . they looked like they were in pretty decent shape -- didn't see any excessive wear. It they had looked really worn out I would have refused to fire them -- I like having fingers

You can't always tell with a visual inspection

 

[Blitzkrieg]

THANK YOU

This old girl can get opinionated at times, but I try not to get out on the fringe too far.

Snowy

Fringe away

 

[Snowy Rivers]

Sits blowing up her inflatable soap box

 

[Blitzkrieg]

You would get a laugh about the hating on the soapbox thing that's happening in the paying members lounge. Donna worrry, we got ya covered

 

[Backfire]

Faced with the requirement for concealment, I opted for a SIG P232 in .380 ACP. I have criticized the .380 in the past, when I carried a Walther PPK, but my criticism was directed at the ammunition then available. Performance ammunition is available for the .380 ACP, and I keep Hornady 90 grain Critical Defense ammunition in my magazines. The piece is easily concealable, and I'm pleased with it. Previously, I carried a Kimber Custom II .45 ACP and it was relatively cumbersome, concealable only in winter clothing. The Kimber .45 is a reliable piece, but a full-size .45 is impractical and uncomfortable to routinely carry discreetly and routinely. The .45 has been relegated to home defense and regular practice sessions. The SIG P232 has been a good choice as a carry piece for me.

 

[bivy53]

Wow. So much interest in this thread. And so many opinions. Just gunna say that my edc for the last year has been a black XDs. Over the years I have carried a .25auto, full size 1911, .38special j-frame, and a keltec p32. Back to the j-frame now while my XDs is in the shop. Oh yeah, almost forgot the pf9.
Gotta say that , even though they are on opposite ends of the spectrum, my two favs are the p32(because it is so dang easy to hide and shoot), and the XDs.45. Not until i went back to the .38 did I realize how tiny the XDs is. A j-frame .38special is LARGER THAN THE XDs.45 IN ALL BUT 2 AREAS! The caliber and the back end of the slide. The only ones I don't carry anymore are the .25auto and the 1911. Too small/too big. My point I think is, no one can say which is the best gun for YOU. You have to decide that for yourself. It may take awhile, but do your homework diligently.
What's the worst that could happen? You get to try a variety of handguns. Never a bad idea. Almost forgot. Ammo choice may very well be more important than caliber. I eagerly await the negative responses to my personal OPINIONS.