Why are we supporting Ukraine?

[Croat]

I figure one word; "Crimea". If Ukraine can kick Russia out of the Black Sea, and put some USA bases right up to the Russian border, we'd have an advantage. For what exactly, I don't know.

But for Zelenskyy to act as if he deserves anything from us rubs me the wrong way. Ukraine is no where near ready for NATO. And to push for more arms just makes us weaker IMO.

We have many cities with homeless piling up on our doorsteps, yet spend billions for weapons of war.

BIden already gave it away we're short on ammo. Over 100 countries ban cluster-bombs for a reason.

I can't say I support the thugs from either side, but I get how Russia wouldn't care for a lack of a "buffer" between them and NATO. We did say we wouldn't push further East.

Yet I see we as a country have taken up to using the Ukrainian flag as a symbol of support. I can't help but think the media has pushed that agenda.

Kinda silly, like how folks put a yellow ribbon on their SUV and think they "support the troops." Nah, you support the Saudis and whatever Chinese company sold you that magnet.

Feels to me along the lines of; Would we battle to save Texas from joining Mexico? I'd be like, "adios" and take your weak-azz power grid with you.

So, pro or con, how do you feel about our involvement in what I figure is little more than a civil war.

Wow. I'll restrain myself in honor of NWF courtesy and just say I completely disagree with most of what you wrote. Some items require a more direct response.

• "We have many cities with homeless piling up on our doorsteps, yet spend billions for weapons of war." Your implication is that billions of dollars diverted to homelessness would solve that problem. Wrong. This country has already spent billions of dollars trying to "solve" the homeless problem, and it has only gotten worse. More money is obviously not the answer to that problem, despite what Democrats would have you believe.
• "We're short on ammo." Says who? I suggest you visit your LGS. Ammo supplies are actually quite healthy, even to the point that "boutique" rounds are available at more or less reasonable prices. For example, purchased two boxes of Hornady 212-grain 300 PRC at LGS last Friday, and cost was only $54.99 per box. That certainly does not speak to "short on ammo," and while not cheap that availability is certainly a strong indicator of market conditions.
• "Kinda silly, like how folks put a yellow ribbon on their SUV and think they 'support the troops.' Nah, you support the Saudis and whatever Chinese company sold you that magnet." Okay, now you're entering the laughable realm. You really should learn a bit of history my friend. Yellow ribbons as a symbol of troop support date back at least to the 17th century. Good grief, to waste your time griping about people using yellow ribbons to show troop support is one of the silliest, most petty things I've ever read.
• "Would we battle to save Texas from joining Mexico? I'd be like, 'adios' and take your weak-azz power grid with you." This statement is so ill-bred that it stands on its own as a display of ultimate ignorance. No further response required.

 

[wired]

Its not about supporting Ukraine. They can piss off as far as Im concerned. The last 10 years the Ukrainians have been doing everything they can to buy their way into NATO . They can't have it. There needs to be a buffer zone and so sad for them, theyre it. Its about stopping Russia. Ukraine just happens to be the one the Russians are ganging up on right now. Russian aggression needs to be countered as soon as it starts. This has been going on for hundreds of years. We can afford to help the Ukrainians along with every country in Europe to do just that. If you ask me the biggest blunder the Republican Party is doing right now is turning this Ukraine war thing into a political football and basically supporting the Russians territorial expansion. It all goes back to daddy Trump being a Russian stooge and the rest of the party apparatchik (appropriate, huh? ) not having a backbone..


Feed the homeless? They can get a job. Record high employment and theyre b1tching about not having jobs. Please. $14 an hour to start at Wal Mart.

 

[Longwalkhome]

I doubt any of the propaganda is absolute truth but it looks like Russia was justified in moving into Ukraine to protect the Ukrainian Russians being shelled in their own homes. Something like 14,000 were killed before Russia moved in.

Search it and read it..

 

[wired]

I doubt any of the propaganda is absolute truth but it looks like Russia was justified in moving into Ukraine to protect the Ukrainian Russians being shelled in their own homes. Something like 14,000 were killed before Russia moved in.

Search it and read it..

Thats the part we don't hear about. I dont know about those numbers being right but there was what is essentially a civil war going on in Ukraine that Russia interjected itself into on behalf of the pro Russia forces. Then Russia got stalled when the Ukrainians started getting free stuff thrown at them.

 

[Longwalkhome]

It's all been covered for the guys who want to know the truth. The propaganda has been the best ever in this Ukraine war, people are quick to buy the lies.

 

[slimmer13]

The Russians just want to rebuild the SU. If they aren't stopped in Ukraine, we will be fighting them here. Sadaam had WMDs, the Terrorists hate our freedom, and the North Vietnamese attacked us in the gulf of Tonkin on 08-04-64.

 

[Spitpatch]

Why? Easy. Here's why. For every sorry-azz "war" we don't even have the balls to call a war (let alone define a winning strategy or criteria for victory and withdrawal), from Korea to Viet Nam, to Afghanistan to Ukraine:

We must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by this military-industrial complex. This conjunction of an immense military establishment with a large arms industry is new in American experience. It's total influence -- economic, political, even spiritual -- is felt in every city, every statehouse, every office of the federal government.

From the farewell address of Dwight D. Eisenhower, January 17, 1961

Gotta hand it to the ol' man. He knew why (and was in the BEST position and level of experience to know better than anyone).

 

[Longwalkhome]

Why? Easy. Here's why. For every sorry-azz "war" we don't even have the balls to call a war (let alone define a winning strategy or criteria for victory and withdrawal), from Korea to Viet Nam, to Afghanistan to Ukraine:

We must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by this military-industrial complex. This conjunction of an immense military establishment with a large arms industry is new in American experience. It's total influence -- economic, political, even spiritual -- is felt in every city, every statehouse, every office of the federal government.

From the farewell address of Dwight D. Eisenhower, January 17, 1961

Gotta hand it to the ol' man. He knew why (and was in the BEST position and level of experience to know better than anyone).

Yep Ike warned Kennedy and the rest of us about the military industrial complex that killed Kennedy.

What is the reason we are in Ukraine, could be many reasons.

https://kunstler.com/clusterbubblegum-nation/situational-awareness/

 

[AirgunAce]

The Russians just want to rebuild the SU. If they aren't stopped in Ukraine, we will be fighting them here. Sadaam had WMDs, the Terrorists hate our freedom, and the North Vietnamese attacked us in the gulf of Tonkin on 08-04-64.

Russia is interested in keeping a buffer between them and NATO, I'm sure they have no interest in invading the USA.

No WMDs were found.

Terrorists would rather we not get into their business. Our foreign policies is why they hate us.

The incident at Tonkin may have been based upon bad naval intelligence.


Do a little research on all of those points before replying. Better informed people than us have already covered them all quite well.

Careful where you get your news.

 

[wired]

Russia is interested in keeping a buffer between them and NATO, I'm sure they have no interest in invading the USA.

No WMDs were found.

Terrorists would rather we not get into their business. Our foreign policies is why they hate us.

The incident at Tonkin may have been based upon bad naval intelligence.


Do a little research on all of those points before replying. Better informed people than us have already covered them all quite well.

Careful where you get your news.

Pretty sure he was being facetious

 

[AirgunAce]

Wow. I'll restrain myself in honor of NWF courtesy and just say I completely disagree with most of what you wrote. Some items require a more direct response.

• "We have many cities with homeless piling up on our doorsteps, yet spend billions for weapons of war." Your implication is that billions of dollars diverted to homelessness would solve that problem. Wrong. This country has already spent billions of dollars trying to "solve" the homeless problem, and it has only gotten worse. More money is obviously not the answer to that problem, despite what Democrats would have you believe.
• "We're short on ammo." Says who? I suggest you visit your LGS. Ammo supplies are actually quite healthy, even to the point that "boutique" rounds are available at more or less reasonable prices. For example, purchased two boxes of Hornady 212-grain 300 PRC at LGS last Friday, and cost was only $54.99 per box. That certainly does not speak to "short on ammo," and while not cheap that availability is certainly a strong indicator of market conditions.
• "Kinda silly, like how folks put a yellow ribbon on their SUV and think they 'support the troops.' Nah, you support the Saudis and whatever Chinese company sold you that magnet." Okay, now you're entering the laughable realm. You really should learn a bit of history my friend. Yellow ribbons as a symbol of troop support date back at least to the 17th century. Good grief, to waste your time griping about people using yellow ribbons to show troop support is one of the silliest, most petty things I've ever read.
• "Would we battle to save Texas from joining Mexico? I'd be like, 'adios' and take your weak-azz power grid with you." This statement is so ill-bred that it stands on its own as a display of ultimate ignorance. No further response required.

There's so much wrong in so many places in your reply. I'll just briefly touch on them as I'm sure nothing will change your POV.

No, I didn't say or mean to imply money was being redirected. But it could be put to better use than fighting some else's battles.

Biden said we're short on ammo. I didn't mean us civilians.

I'm aware of the yellow ribbon meanings. I served eight years. I'm also aware that that's about as far as many folks will go to truly support the troops.

Texas/USA was an analogy to Russia/Ukraine. Imagine if the Mexican border was a few hundred miles north.


You seem to be unnecessarily irritated and more focused on ad-hominem than the question I asked. You said nothing toward the whole point of the OP.

 

[AirgunAce]

Pretty sure he was being facetious

Hard to tell, but I hope so.

 

[CLT65]

Hard to tell, but I hope so.

I thought it was quite obvious, at a glance, beyond a shadow of a doubt.

 

[arakboss]

Russia axes landmark Ukraine grain deal just hours before deadline

A pact facilitating the export of key Ukrainian grains to the global markets was set to expire on Monday.

www.cnbc.com

 

[slimmer13]

Russia is interested in keeping a buffer between them and NATO, I'm sure they have no interest in invading the USA.

No WMDs were found.

Terrorists would rather we not get into their business. Our foreign policies is why they hate us.

The incident at Tonkin may have been based upon bad naval intelligence.


Do a little research on all of those points before replying. Better informed people than us have already covered them all quite well.

Careful where you get your news.

Got it. Thanks for setting me straight!

 

[parallax]

NATO members refuse to pay their fair share of dues and laugh at the U.S. for hemorrhaging dollars pulling up the slack. Needs to end now.

 

[Ziggy44]

The enemy of my enemy = friend, or at least short term ally.

 

[wired]

NATO members refuse to pay their fair share of dues and laugh at the U.S. for hemorrhaging dollars pulling up the slack. Needs to end now.

If you are looking at percentage of GDP going to Ukraine the US is tied with the Czech Republic at #8 at 1/4 of a percent. Latvia is #1 with a full 1%

 

[parallax]

2% of GDP is price of admission So many countries are not meeting their commitments Bend over U.S. taxpayers

 

[wired]

2% of GDP is price of admission So many countries are not meeting their commitments Bend over U.S. taxpayers

What do NATO costs have to do with the topic?