What do you guys recommend for a 9mm self defense round?

[joeroket]

I'm always hearing about Glazer Safety ammo. Whats the story on those rounds???

These are for indoor use. It is buckshot loaded into a pistol casing. There is no wall penetration with these rounds and they really are no good after a few yards from what I hear.

 

[wichaka]

Not much penetration with Glazers, especially thru med-heavy clothing.

 

[OFADAN]

Being the devils advocate and not knowing that much about shooting, fighting, and self defense I'll throw in some different thoughts: being overly concerned about the "ideal" defensive cartridge is highly over-rated and in the big scheme of things isn't super substantial. It is important but not critical. Any modern defensive cartridge with a long track record on the street is as effective as the next.

There just isn't one "magic pill" that will provide you with a "substantial" advantage. If there was one "non-disputed" champion from among all of these cartridges on the market then we'd all be using this one product - undesputed. The reality is none of them work as well as the gun rags or manufacturers lead us to believe. Therefore that is why you see so many replies in threads, see many agencies using different rounds, and an excessive amount of advertising in gun rags.

So with that being said...we're better off selecting cartridges that are extremely reliable in our defensive handgun and that we can defend effectively in court. There is some strategy and tactics behind making an intellegent and wisse choice but that is fodder for another day.

Of the two choices...purchasing more "Hardware" (the actual gear, cartridges, accessories, firearms) and programming one's "Software" (one's defensive mindset, will, skills, knowledge, behavior, & application in simulations) is what is really going to make a substantial difference in the end. One will do in a fight what one has done repeatedly in training and practice irrespective of what one has access too as far as hardware goes.

Recently my business partner at OFA was involved in a self defense shooting when his partner used a "highly rated - much touted" rifle cartridge that performed extremely well but required far greater number of hits on the thread to stop him and finally put the fight out of him. Much discussion has been made about the choice of cartridge and if Brand X would have been more effective (less hits to stop the threat)...the bottom line...they are still using the same cartridge and now understand one particular brand over another isn't going to make the difference and it was their training and tactics (which they have practiced a gazillion times) that solved the problem!

 

[Rapid1]

my thoughts exactly Dan...excellent explanation.

I've been shooting 115's in my 9's for years, and have an ample supply of bullets for loading in that size. the 124's and 147's get all the ink these days but when it comes right down to the end, the deciding factor will likely be something other than the weight of the bullet.

 

[BooKilla]

Federal Hydrashock in my daily carried 1911.

 

[wichaka]

Most any quality constructed HP round will do the job, as long as it's reliable in YOUR carried firearm.

Spend your time and money in training and on quality equipment. Just beware of gimmicks etc.

 

[Zhivago]

Any advantage, even a small one, is worthwhile IMO. That's why I choose HST or Gold Dot over WWB or similar. However, generally speaking, as long as you avoid EXTREME SHOCK crap, it probably wont make much difference.

 

[wichaka]

Hydra-Shok is on the way out........they haven't upgraded the design in over 15+ years. The only reason they still make it, is because they still get orders for enough of it to make it worth their while.

I would use something more up to date......

 

[elsullo]

I read firearm messagboards a lot. All of the experts who matter, and have tried the rounds a lot, through barriers and into gelatin, they all agree that Corbon DPX is better than anything, in spite of its cost. Coming in second for 9mm is the Gold Dot 127 grain. Third, a close second, is the Federal HST. Next, the Winchester Ranger-bonded. They all say that these are nearly identical in performance, and can be carried with full confidence.....................elsullo

 

[Aristotle13]

My .02, 2 folds...

1. Get formal defensive pistol training.
2. Maintain dedicated practice.

Doesn't matter if the bullet is explosive. If it doesn't hit your intended target or your not able to clear leather fast enough, none of that research matters.

 

[wichaka]

Make your choice based on two reasons;
1) Reliable functioning in your chosen gun;
2) The most reliable performer in ACTUAL shootings, not just gel tests.

Nothing will beat bullet placement. If the shot does not go in the snot locker, then it's a toss of the dice.

But one also must take into consideration bullet performance. I know fmj has taken many a man in WWII and beyond, but there are much better choices. If the bullet does not go in the snot locker, then a good quality HP will have it all over a fmj in wounding ability. That said I can recommend the following, based on autopsies I have attended from actual shootings;

1) Federal HST; hands down the best all around round.

2) Speer Gold Dot; heavy constructed bonded bullet. Stays together when going thru media while on it's way to the intended target. Because of it's heavy construction, it will not expand to the extent of a HST or the like, but can do the job.

3) Remington Golden Sabre; another heavy constructed bonded bullet. Again won't expand to the extent of a non bonded bullet, but can get the job done.

4) Winchester SXT; I recommend this round with some hesitation as I've seen the core separate many times from the jacket in simple gel testing.

5) Hydra-Shok; I do not recommend this bullet as it has not been updated in over 15+ years. The only reason Federal still makes it, is because people are still buying enough of it to make ATK a profit. This info comes from their reps. I would expect to see the Hydra-Shok line phased out over the next few years.

As for the other hi-speed low drag bullets out there.............well you just don't see them being used on the street much. Oh sure you'll get the gun rags to talk them up, but the proof in this case is in the flesh, not the gel.

A person can shoot the same bullet into several different people and get a different result every time. There's way too many variables in the human body that makes that happen.

 

[Zhivago]

I read firearm messagboards a lot. All of the experts who matter, and have tried the rounds a lot, through barriers and into gelatin, they all agree that Corbon DPX is better than anything, in spite of its cost. Coming in second for 9mm is the Gold Dot 127 grain. Third, a close second, is the Federal HST. Next, the Winchester Ranger-bonded. They all say that these are nearly identical in performance, and can be carried with full confidence.....................elsullo

Who exactly are these "experts" ? I've never seen anything to indicate that Corbon DPX can compare to Federal HST. And, of course, I use the term "compare" lightly since, as we all know and as has been repeated over and over, placement is the key.

 

[Rapid1]

a while back, I did a little research on DPX. this is from Chuck Hawks at Guns and Shooting online...

DPX is advertised as high energy, deeper penetrating and environmentally friendly handgun ammunition. Its Barnes-X solid copper hollow point bullet typically penetrates deeper than conventional JHP bullets of any given caliber and sectional density. This deeper than normal penetration results in a larger permanent crush cavity, as has been thoroughly demonstrated by testing in 10% ordinance gelatin.

there are many other articles but at any rate, the concept simply makes sense to me. Barnes makes great bullets for many different purposes and this one is designed to penetrate and hold together. I feel the biggest weakness a 9mm has is penetration, and is the main reason one would want to use the 124gr and heavier slugs.

opinions are like bubblegums, and I'm surely no expert, but I prefer the 115gr loadings in 9mm to maintain velocity and along with a bullet specifically designed to penetrate and hold together seems to me the smartest way to go. YMMV

 

[97321]

Any fans of Hornady critical defense?

 

[lamrith]

Ohhg man, Zombie thread!

I currently have the Critical defense, but I will be switching away from it. Std Nato 9mm/Luger has a max OAL of 1.169" I have purchased 2 boxes of the CD 115g and the avg OAL has been only 1.078"

I have noticed my pistol does not consistently feed short ammo, I have fired 2 magazines worth of Crit Def 115g had multiple jams/fail to feed. The rounds got stuck with the nose of the bullet pointing at the top of the chamber, like they went up the feed ramp and got into too vertical a position as the slide comes forward. I have also had jams when reloading a round into the chamber for CCW home after at day at the range. I have to pull the slide back a bit so the magazine pushed the back of the round up then it will chamber. I have recently started reloading and noticed that even my reloads that are under about 1.120" OAL jam on occasion, so it is not a Crit Defense specific issue, just happens that they are short, but something to keep in mind. It is $, but make sure to shoot at least a full magazine of any ammo you plan to use for Self Defense.

You may have better luck, but for me I just will not bet my life on it running in my gun and not jamming every time I pull the trigger. They do shoot accurately, not issue there, just the jams.

 

[rumblebee1967]

any 9mm lead in the right place is what really counts. Everything else is close enough to the same to not really make a difference in my opinion. If you think you need to go through walls, doors and windshields then you need the high impact (and high dollar) stuff.

 

[gunnoob75]

Shot Placement, Shot Placement, Shot Placement.

 

[97321]

Bringing the dead back to life, one thread at a time.

 

[biggie24420]

Well Massad Ayoob and James Yeager like Cor-Bon and the only experience I have is with the Pow'R Ball rounds for 1911 pistols that are picky with SD ammo..... no feeding issues with them at all. I recently picked up some Winchester Ranger Talon +P 124 grain (I would have gone with a heavier bullet but that's what I could find). I really like the Talons because of the nasty claws. I also like the Federal HST and Remington Golden Saber (bonded)...... I had jacket separation shooting Golden Sabers none-bonded into water jugs, so I don't know how the bullet would behave if I had to shoot through glass or whatever.

 

[clambo]

Bunch all of the " experts " (guys who have made careers out of getting us to buy bubblegum ) and I'd be surprised to find out if there have been 3 or 4 actual shootings between all of them in the last 40 years. Maybe not that many. In my mind unless you have actually shot someone, preferrably a lot of people, with a lot of different so called " self defense " ammo, then your opinion really doesn't mean all that much. I remember when Ayoob was going around making a huge deal about how his body armor saved his life....until I read it was from his steering wheel in an auto accident. My .02 cents worth is shoot what you can hit with and works well in your guns. Shoot them as many times as you can. At that point it's up to God or luck or karma or whatever your believe in.