National Trump To Ban ‘Bump Stock’ Devices Used in Las Vegas Shooting

[DedPyro]

This is essentially the same proposal that is being joined with the conclusion of the ATF's inquiry. No tin foil hat needed. I think you give him too much credit as a "gun guy". He isn't. He was the best option of 2. That's it.
If the ATF and the DOJ are successful at banning an item or redefining a machine gun by changing regulations that have the force of law, without going through the Congress and actually passing a law, you can ban anything. If they do this for bump stocks, then the next liberal president and appointed Attorney General can make changes to ban semi-autos or guns without sporting purpose or whatever other crap they want. Welcome to the slippery slope. I hope this doesn't go through but that's the worry, hence this discussion.

 

[Argonaut]

Trump is not a gun guy, he grew up in New York City.

You need to study him more..........he has traveled and hunted most of the continents as well as his sons. Donald Jr and his brothers are a frequent Hunters here in Idaho.

 

[Argonaut]

This is essentially the same proposal that is being joined with the conclusion of the ATF's inquiry. No tin foil hat needed. I think you give him too much credit as a "gun guy". He isn't. He was the best option of 2. That's it.
If the ATF and the DOJ are successful at banning an item or redefining a machine gun by changing regulations that have the force of law, without going through the Congress and actually passing a law, you can ban anything. If they do this for bump stocks, then the next liberal president and appointed Attorney General can make changes to ban semi-autos or guns without sporting purpose or whatever other crap they want. Welcome to the slippery slope. I hope this doesn't go through but that's the worry, hence this discussion.

No one has even seen the proposal......that is deffinatly the old one......go back to the Jerry Springer program. Machine guns are defined by the 1928 NFA act that has been upheld by the Supreme Court, it isn't a reach to include bump fire stocks under the umbrella of that law. They were only excluded by a fluke ruling by the ATF. They are certainly within the spirit and scope of that 90 year old law. Like an auto sear or other modifications deemed illegal. Why don't you guys put this much energy and vitriol into something that really matters like defeating the idiot leftist politicians in your state.......that is where you could really do some good......but I know.....it is easier to sit on the sidelines and bubblegum than participate in any real work.

 

[ThePhonMan]

Here's what we should propose: Put Bump-stocks on the NFA and remove Suppressors. Then revisit Gun Free Zones and mental health.

Since the "intent" of the Bump-stock is to simulate automatic weapon fire it could be easily categorized into a tiny box that doesn't use vague language or terms and wouldn't encompass any other trigger device. Items like trigger motors and other crap are already illegal so why not NFA a Bump-stock and call it done?

I know, slippery slope, surrendering ground, etc. Does anybody remember the KTW bullet fiasco and how far that set us back? Unfortunately, we gun owners have to be the adults in the room but rather than refuse and be "done too" and end up with crap shoveled on us, we could take the lead and drive it in the direction we want.

Let the flames begin.

 

[cowgirlkaboom]

Trump directs DOJ to craft ban on 'bump stocks' as shooting response evolves

Also a little reminder in there that in the past he has been anti-modern weapons in the past.. Yech.

 

[Wombat of Doom]

I don't see a bump stock restriction infringing on our rights.......any more than the 1928 NFA act did and much less. It is a minor issue that will help keep important ones. We used to be able to mail order Thompson's. The law that stopped that is the law you should be protesting.

The NFA should be a problem as well to be blunt.
It is to you a minor issue, but it is a slippery slope. We lose rights and never gain them. Every inch you give is an inch lost to future generations and an invitation to take more.

A bump stock is nowhere close to a legal definition of a machine gun in the NFA.

 

[Argonaut]

The NFA should be a problem as well to be blunt.
It is to you a minor issue, but it is a slippery slope. We lose rights and never gain them. Every inch you give is an inch lost to future generations and an invitation to take more.

That is not true either.......are you old enough to remember when all handgun ammunition had to be registered in a book when purchased? Or how about the Clinton assault weapon ban? I have no problem challenging the NFA act if that's the hill you want to die on.

 

[Wombat of Doom]

That is not true either.......are you old enough to remember when all handgun ammunition had to be registered in a book when purchased? Or how about the Clinton assault weapon ban?

I remember the assault weapon ban and I remember weird laws in various places I have lived with ammo restrictions. But once you lose something it is usually lost. Let's look at the NFA and machine guns.

Let's look at the NFA. (even though the legal justification s now long gone.)

 

[Argonaut]

As I said, if you want to attack the NFA, that is fine........but your time would be better spent attacking the wack job congressmen YOUR district sends to congress. Then we could get some real advancement in the country.

 

[DedPyro]

No one has even seen the proposal......that is deffinatly the old one......go back to the Jerry Springer program. Machine guns are defined by the 1928 NFA act that has been upheld by the Supreme Court, it isn't a reach to include bump fire stocks under the umbrella of that law. They were only excluded by a fluke ruling by the ATF. They are certainly within the spirit and scope of that 90 year old law. Like an auto sear or other modifications deemed illegal. Why don't you guys put this much energy and vitriol into something that really matters like defeating the idiot leftist politicians in your state.......that is where you could really do some good......but I know.....it is easier to sit on the sidelines and bubblegum than participate in any real work.

The fluke rulings you refer to are the result of abiding by the letter of the law. If they didn't want to stick to the letter, why define rifles, SBR's and pistols and shotguns with such specific language and specific measurements? Auto-sears and other modifications are deemed illegal because they are viewed using the specific measurements and language in the law, not because they mimic something illegal but because they actually allow the function of full-auto or select fire. Laws are easier to prevent than they are to repeal and what we're talking about is circumventing the law and re-defining a category of firearm to include accessories. In case you aren't paying attention, that's bad.
Why would you automatically assume that I sit on the sidelines? I thought I would help educate some people of how this isn't just about a specific stock or device. I call and e-mail and bubblegum to my "representatives" and petition and man I wish it was easier to kick out all of the idiot politicians here but even in the face of blatant corruption, Portland and Eugene keep voting for them. I think nay-saying this topic and trusting the government to do what's best will only help keep people complacent and allow our rights to be eroded without even a whimper from people like you.

 

[Argonaut]

The fluke rulings you refer to are the result of abiding by the letter of the law. If they didn't want to stick to the letter, why define rifles, SBR's and pistols and shotguns with such specific language and specific measurements? Auto-sears and other modifications are deemed illegal because they are viewed using the specific measurements and language in the law, not because they mimic something illegal but because they actually allow the function of full-auto or select fire. Laws are easier to prevent than they are to repeal and what we're talking about is circumventing the law and re-defining a category of firearm to include accessories. In case you aren't paying attention, that's bad.
Why would you automatically assume that I sit on the sidelines? I thought I would help educate some people of how this isn't just about a specific stock or device. I call and e-mail and bubblegum to my "representatives" and man I wish it was easier to kick out all of the idiot politicians here but even in the face of blatant corruption, Portland and Eugene keep voting for them. I think nay-saying this topic and trusting the government to do what's best will only help keep people complacent and allow our rights to be eroded without even a whimper from people like you.

I put my body life and limb on the line for over a decade for your rights. And spend tens of thousands of dollars a year supporting people that continue to both in the military and in government. What have you done. I know all my congressmen personally, support the good guys and fight the bad ones. Have you ever met one of yours?

 

[Unka-Boo]

1934

 

[CountryGent]

For whatever it is worth, there is a running thread on this development here. Cheers.

 

[Jcon268]

The most ridiculous thing about all these gun control idiots is they make it look like they are the only victims and the political right are the aggressors....when reality it's some screw job trying to upset the masses who is the aggressor and we could ALL be victims. Pretty sure the Vegas shooting victimized Republicans, gun owners, military etc. We're all the same people and we're not monsters

 

[Sawdust]

How about public execution of the school shooter? Would that deter would be criminals?

Not likely.

But i wouldn't mind of they used a guillotine ..............and started at his feet till they finally cut off the head.

 

[billdeserthills]

Going on Safari and having a Guide hand you a big bore rifle and being told to hold whatever Mils and fire does not equate to being a gun guy. It equates to going on an expensive vacation.

With that being said, I actually agree with you. I could care less about bump stocks one way or the other. The simple fact is, that yes the nation is coming for your guns. Because kids keep shooting up schools. It sucks, but that is the hard truth of it.

The shootings in schools are primarily because they are 'gun free' zones--democrats know this and purposely keep the schools that way, supposedly for the 'sake' of the kids--What about the 300,000+ aborted babies from last year?
Looks like those don't count...

 

[RVTECH]

are you old enough to remember when all handgun ammunition had to be registered in a book when purchased? Or how about the Clinton assault weapon ban?

And Waiting times for handguns in Oregon?

 

[Argonaut]

@Sawdust.......I grew up in Spokane, in the courtyard of the existing court house, they used to have public whippings and hangings. A cousin of mine General George Wright put an end to the Indian wars in the area by forcing the Chief's personally to surrender to him and hanging all of them within 30 min. We had few problems with them after that and my cousin got a military fort named for him and hangman Creek was named for the site where it happened. My mother always thought that public flogging was a great inexpensive punishment.

 

[Member 34319]

I wonder if he realizes this jeopardizes any chance at 8 years.

 

[albin25]

The following is just my opinion.
I don't expect you to embrace it as gospel, just as one (old-ish) guy's opinion.*

I have always considered my guns as serious, dangerous, tools for my personal/community defense, survival, and my god-given right to keep and bare in a responsible, mature, thoughtful manner. I never felt treating them as toys fell into that responsibility. Yes, I believe you can derive satisfaction and pleasure from developing and perfecting the skills necessary to handle a deadly weapon (ie. shoot for fun and practise).
I have never liked the more recent trends and hair-splitting ATF work-around, that seem to hold such attraction for the "fan boys", "mall ninjas" and their thrill-seeking ilk. Things like exploding targets, bump stocks, binary triggers seem to attract some that are "into guns" to satisfy the wrong urges.
These few are unfortunately becoming the public face of American gun owners whether we like it or not, and turning fine rifles like the AR (and equivalents) into accessorized Barbie dolls is one reason that it attracts the wrong type of attention and people.
Reminiscences in threads about days-gone-by from our youth, of guns in our truck at school, hunting/plinking on the way home, shooting with dad, etc.... never have mention of rapid fire ammo-dumping, explosions, trashing ranges or destroying trees. If it did, it was followed by "when Dad got wind of It, he took my guns away for a year!". One thing we kids had was respect, one thing we kids didn't have was money to just piss away ammo.


* I don't much care for "smart" phones either... they seem to be causing "stupid" people.