Striker fired pistols

[spengo]

Spengo, that is a good explanation between the two. I don't quite understand the comment there is no stored energy until the trigger is pulled, has to be stored energy as the Glock does not function like a true D/A pistol. I am very curious about the Taurus and Kimber systems, just using a single lever, plus the fact the Taurus has the double strike capabilty. I like the idea that Smith and Kimber have a thumb safety. Not interested in the "safety is between your ears" or other devisive testosterone fueled comments. Spad

As TErickson explained in his second post, there is stored energy in all hammer springs, by no stored energy he just meant there was not enough stored energy to cause the primer to go off if the hammer/striker inadvertently dropped. In glocks at least, where the striker is not cocked all the way. The striker dropping inadvertently should be impossible due to the other safety mechanisms on glock pistols though.

S&W pretty much only put safety levers on their M&P line of pistols as a "feel-good" thing for people who don't feel comfortable without a manual safety. Though the striker is cocked all the way, there is no way for the gun to fire without your finger being actually on the trigger deliberately pulling it due to the internal safety bar blocking it. If I got an S&W M&P, I would get one without the manual safety and treat it exactly like a glock which is how they were meant to be used. Keep your booger hook off the bang switch and it's fine.

By the Kimber system, I assume you mean their new solo carry striker fired gun? Now, I'm not too sure on this but I *believe* it functions exactly the same was as a 1911, just with an internal striker instead of an external hammer. The striker is cocked all the way when the slide goes back, and there are no internal safety mechanisms at all to prevent it from firing. Instead it has an external manual safety. I am guessing it has a very short, crisp trigger also like a 1911. I would treat this the same was as a 1911 and carry it cocked and locked. With such a short, light trigger pull and no internal safety mechanisms, true SAO pistols are not safe to carry without the safety on.

I don't know anything about Taurus pistols I'm afraid, but if they have double strike capability they must have true-DAO fire control groups. I don't know why anyone would put a safety on a true-DAO pistol except as a feel-good measure.

 

[jordanvraptor]

Striker fired pistols aren't really anything new. My P08 Luger uses a pre-cocked striker/firing pin. The only thing revolutionary about the Glock was its safety on the trigger. This is kind of like having your parking brake release on the accelerator of your car... I've owned 8 Glocks so I'm not a hater.

As for the Glock not having inertia energy to fire a round without pulling the trigger... I know this is not true because I witnessed a Glock 19 go fully automatic due to a polishing job on the internals... Not to mention the Glock 18 which is designed to fire as long as you hold the trigger back... How does this happen if there is no stored energy capable of firing a round if you are not releasing and cocking the trigger back?

 

[spengo]

Oh I don't know, Tennifer, successful wide use of polymer construction and manufacturing techniques were also quite revolutionary.

It was, but you are crediting the wrong company. HK was the first to make a successful polymer pistol.

One of my friends has one of these. The semi-auto only model of course. Terrible trigger.

 

[Spad]

Seems research on the Taurus the striker fired pistol with the second strike capability is called a "pre-set hybrid". This is an interesting concept as the the regular pre-set has no second strike capability until you rack the slide. Spad

 

[jordanvraptor]

Oh I don't know, Tennifer, successful wide use of polymer construction and manufacturing techniques were also quite revolutionary.

I was actually kind of joking about the trigger. The idea of putting a safety on the trigger is revolutionary because it shouldn't be there. Other than that its an automatic pistol, whether it is made of plastic, aluminum, nickel or tennifer plated, it is still just an automatic pistol. Revolvutionary is the first revolver or automatic pistol. Variations on a theme don't make a firearm revolutionary. The Metal Storm machine gun is revolutionary, too bad civilians will never see it...

 

[spengo]

The Metal Storm machine gun is revolutionary, too bad civilians will never see it...

MEAT STROM is great...

...until you are ready to reload

 

[Spad]

The Metal Storm, isn't that the one that fires a million rounds a minute? Could sure get spendy if you had a stuck finger. Wonder if it has a safety on the trigger. Ha, Spad

 

[cyclesarge]

Spengo, that is a good explanation between the two. I don't quite understand the comment there is no stored energy until the trigger is pulled, has to be stored energy as the Glock does not function like a true D/A pistol. I am very curious about the Taurus and Kimber systems, just using a single lever, plus the fact the Taurus has the double strike capabilty. I like the idea that Smith and Kimber have a thumb safety. Not interested in the "safety is between your ears" or other devisive testosterone fueled comments Spad

I HOPE you meant, "I understand that the safety between my ears is the MOST IMPORTANT safety, and no amount of manual safeties on any firearm can replace common sense and safe gun handling procedures, but I'm interested in a thumb safety or other manual safeties anyway." Not that the "safety between your ears" is nothing more than a devisive testosterone fueled comment.

 

[Spad]

Cyclesarge, The safety between your ears is number one, period. I am and do like manual thumb safetys. Very interested in the different varietys and functions of the newer striker fired pistols out there. Spad

 

[pioneer461]

Relying on a mechanical safety to prevent unintended discharge while touching the trigger, may not be a good idea. Anything mechanical can fail. It is always a good idea to follow basic safety rules, such as keeping your finger off of the trigger until you are ready to shoot, along with the safety rule that says we should always be aware of our target and what is behind it.

I bought a Glock 27 when they first hit the market (mid 90's), wanting a small concealable .40 caliber off duty gun, and detective carry gun. From the very first I noticed the gun did not fit my hand, but I tried to overcome that problem and "get use to it" to no avail. After a very scary near unintended discharge, I got rid of it because of it's lack of a positive safety. I used it in a trade and ran home to S&W's DA/SA system that I had been carrying many years. I just did not like, or trust the Glock. Many people swear by them, but for me it just didn't work.

About 6 months ago, I decided to try again, although for different reasons. Being retired, I was simply looking for a powerful, compact, carry gun. This time, there were many different makes and models to choose from. After much shopping around and research, I bought a Springfield XD sub-compact .40. I could not be more pleased. I carry it in full confidence and it fits my hand as if it were custom made for me. The pistol works 100% and the quality and workmanship is top notch. Accuracy is fantastic.

I'm still not totally sure how striker pistols work, but I know that mine works very, very well.

 

[hapuna]

Oh ohhhh... It turns out that the manual safeties don't work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Spad what to do?

An off-duty police officer went to an outpatient imaging center . . . to have an MR imaging examination. . . The officer was carrying a model 1991 A-1 compact.45 caliber semiautomatic pistol (Colt’s Manufacturing, Hartford, CT).

The officer notified the technologist that he was carrying the weapon before entering the MR dressing room. The technologist told the officer to take the gun with him. The technologist intended to meet the officer in the MR patient waiting area before the examination and secure the weapon in that room, where he felt it would be safe. However, the officer apparently misunderstood and took the gun into the MR suite. The technologist was entering the officer’s personal data into the computer and did not see him entering the MR suite.

Once the officer was inside the MR suite, the gun was pulled from his hand as he attempted to place the gun on top of a cabinet 3 ft (0.9 m) away from the magnet bore. The gun was immediately pulled into the bore, where it struck the left side and spontaneously discharged a round into the wall of the room at the rear of the magnet. Fortunately, no one was injured. . . The weapon’s thumb safety was reportedly engaged when the gun discharged.

An unsuccessful attempt to remove the gun from the magnet resulted in the gun being pulled to the right side of the magnet (Fig. 1). The decision was then made to power down the magnet to remove the gun. Examination of the weapon by a ballistics laboratory concluded that the force of the magnetic field was responsible for the firearm’s discharge.

 

[Spad]

I guess next time try a Grock.On the serious side those of us having to go and have MRI's ( I just had one not to long ago) might take heed of this incident, if true, I think it is.(no figure 1 etc.) I make sure my wife has the weapon I carry when having that kind of procedure and stays away. Interesting that this has been brought up. Would a firing pin block have stopped this or would it have been moved even in a plastic pistol?:huh: Spad