police shootings

[PaulB47]

Good cops or bad cops, that is a question. I think cops are basically just like other people, and other people in the same situation would end up just like them. It's the job that corrupts them - the ability to bully and kill people with impunity, the power, the opportunities for monetary gain and bribes from drug dealers, the protection money, etc. If cops had a different job, they wouldn't be the way they are. Even if they had cop-like positions (e.g. "rent-a-cop" or bodyguards), and worked in the free market like the rest of us, they wouldn't end up the way they are. The anti-social incentives are missing. You don't read about these huge problems with rent-a-cops.

If a wife is with an abusing husband, she needs to take responsibility for herself and leave. Or her brothers and friends need to talk to the guy, maybe beat him up. Or she can contract with her local rent-a-cop. Or she can get a gun -
"Be not afraid of any man
No matter what his size
When danger threatens, call on me
And I will equalize."
If women want equality then they need to take care of themselves. Yeah, it's on her, not me. There are many women who called 911 and lived to regret it.

Imagine a country with no War on Some Drugs, no traffic enforcement and civil asset forteiture aka "highway robbery", no need for "protection" because neighbors look out for each other, no welfare creating vast numbers of broken and dangerous people, no enforcement of gun control laws. What would there be left for cops to do? What small remnant could not be handled informally by ordinary citizens, or by the free market? Even these days, with this gigantic government on our backs, there are way more disputes handled by (free market) arbitration than in the courts.

So the rational is no matter what shoot first and ask questions later? even if the situation doesn't warrant death?

You mean like cops do now?

I am not saying that anyone should just lay down and not stand up to bad cops but there are a lot of good ones too.

Standing up to bad cops? Sounds like a good way to get killed, and that by both good cops and bad.

have the courage of your convictions and if something {God forbid} should go bad don't blame the cops for not being there or not helping.

You are acting as if they actually supply some service, some good. I'm telling you I don't want their "help". I'm not happy when I look in my rear-view mirror and see one behind me. I won't blame cops for not "helping" me, trust me. You can rest your mind on that point. If they'd let me off from paying taxes to support them, and not steal from me on the highway, even better.

Here, read this:
<broken link removed>

 

[JRuby]

So because we have bad cops you support breaking laws. The laws are not the problem how those laws are enforced by LEO's is. By following your train of thought why even have laws
Laws are to protect societal norms not the individuals who think they are better than everyone else.

 

[bmtm09]

Nope don't want cops arresting drunk drivers ...I want those drunks on the road with me so I can't go home and see my family, nor do I want them to stop the idiot that is doing 100 miles per hour ...I would rather him hit me cause me to flip my truck so I can spend the rest of my life in a wheelchair.
For some of your points I agree..being able to seize property is dead wrong but they do have their place among us and are necessary. Having out neighbors look out for us is such a great thought but when they decide to cross into the dark side and steal a package off my porch I guess I should just come home and arm up and wage war with them????? Human nature is the problem, and it's not just because of a badge it's because people as a whole are capable of evil at a moments notice. With no fear of punishment what would society devolve into. Think about wrol situations we all fear it because we know what it would be...roving gangs of turds murdering raping looting and all sorts of evil....yes we have guns yes we should take care of ourselves I get your point...but how many can you kill before you get killed? How can you always be there ..you are only one person.

 

[bmtm09]

And the "like cops now" comment.....there are over 1000000 cops on the street if they were all killing with impunity...there would be alot less of us....
With 1000000 cops out there, 1000000 guns out to get us, if cops were the problem we would know it.
Maybe if people were not so stupid and do dumb stuff they wouldn't have to worry about cops

 

[JRuby]

You mean like the mental health worker who did everything the officers asked of him and still ended up getting shot. He was laying on his back with his arms in the air and they shot at him three times. When asked why he was shot the police officer said " I don't know". Sure doesn't take very many incidents to question LEO's.

 

[bmtm09]

Well again you can't blame the institution or the other 999999 cops for the stupidity of the few orb the one...

Let's just do this....agree to disagree...I personally feel they have their place in our society if you don't...that's fine and that's your opinion.
Bad stuff is going to happen to good people. When God wants you to come home you will.
Without cops IMHO the United States would collapse in on itself in very short order.

 

[bmtm09]

if someone does come to my house with a evil in mind I will most definitely be taking care of it myself. I will call the cops and tell them to come pick up the body if you did away with cops you would have to dig your own hole.

 

[JRuby]

I actually support and respect good police officers. They are needed for society to exist. What society doesn't need are those that think the first thing to do is use deadly force.
They need to recognize that they serve the public and not the other way - they are to be shepherds and not an executioner unless there is no other option. Giving them a free ride for such things as shooting unarmed citizens only allows them to continue this behavior . We need to hold them accountable when they screw up and reward them for thier wins. Bad behaviour should be exceptionally expensive to those that think they are judge, jury and executioneer.

 

[wired]

I dont think they are trying to be judge, jury and executioner. I think they just panic and screw up.

 

[JRuby]

I dont think they are trying to be judge, jury and executioner. I think they just panic and screw up.

Then they need a different job immediately.

 

[bmtm09]

I totally agree that if they can't handle the job they should go find a different one and I do think the training needs to be improved

 

[Ura-Ki]

You guys think the LEO problem is bad, Try the Armed Forces!!! You want to see corruption of power, try there! However, you will also see swift and sever justice! I couldn't even guess at the number of people who have run amook and ruined their lives or their careers because of corruption and crimes! We had a good officer, had all the right creds, and every thing bright and rosy, He made a bad judgment and blew it all and is now a permanent resident in Leavenworth Kansas! I think the City Cop Shops need to be run like the Military, draconian penalties for actions that are not punished, and an oversight that activally polieces it's forces in an ongoing prosess! Yes, I know there is oversight, but it needs to be handled a lot better, Or I am going to be agreeing with PaulB47 A hell of a lot more if things don't change!

 

[No_Regerts]

Good cops or bad cops, that is a question. I think cops are basically just like other people, and other people in the same situation would end up just like them. It's the job that corrupts them - the ability to bully and kill people with impunity, the power, the opportunities for monetary gain and bribes from drug dealers, the protection money, etc. If cops had a different job, they wouldn't be the way they are. Even if they had cop-like positions (e.g. "rent-a-cop" or bodyguards), and worked in the free market like the rest of us, they wouldn't end up the way they are. The anti-social incentives are missing. You don't read about these huge problems with rent-a-cops.

If a wife is with an abusing husband, she needs to take responsibility for herself and leave. Or her brothers and friends need to talk to the guy, maybe beat him up. Or she can contract with her local rent-a-cop. Or she can get a gun -
"Be not afraid of any man
No matter what his size
When danger threatens, call on me
And I will equalize."
If women want equality then they need to take care of themselves. Yeah, it's on her, not me. There are many women who called 911 and lived to regret it.

Imagine a country with no War on Some Drugs, no traffic enforcement and civil asset forteiture aka "highway robbery", no need for "protection" because neighbors look out for each other, no welfare creating vast numbers of broken and dangerous people, no enforcement of gun control laws. What would there be left for cops to do? What small remnant could not be handled informally by ordinary citizens, or by the free market? Even these days, with this gigantic government on our backs, there are way more disputes handled by (free market) arbitration than in the courts.



You mean like cops do now?



Standing up to bad cops? Sounds like a good way to get killed, and that by both good cops and bad.



You are acting as if they actually supply some service, some good. I'm telling you I don't want their "help". I'm not happy when I look in my rear-view mirror and see one behind me. I won't blame cops for not "helping" me, trust me. You can rest your mind on that point. If they'd let me off from paying taxes to support them, and not steal from me on the highway, even better.

Here, read this:
<broken link removed>

 

[wired]

I was watching that footage of the cop shooting the guy in North Miami . That is a classic example that cops are just people who make incredibly stupid mistakes. There was no malice in that but the cop was in the process of wetting himself when he discharged his firearm 3 times and once into the unarmed man laying on the ground with his hands in the air. While it was a mistake I am sure I'm assuming that the cop will get fired/sued etc as he should be but I'm guessing his Union reps will have him back on the beat ASAP.

 

[bmtm09]

<broken link removed>

sorry for the victims....doesn't Japan have pretty stringent gun laws?

 

[PaulB47]

So because we have bad cops you support breaking laws. The laws are not the problem how those laws are enforced by LEO's is. By following your train of thought why even have laws
Laws are to protect societal norms not the individuals who think they are better than everyone else.

What makes you think so? Because you learned it in a government school?

Laws are here to keep the rulers in power, to protect their cronies from competition, and to suck up money from the productive class. Of course if you are a believer in the Government Religion you are just not going to see this. Try questioning what you "know" sometime.

"It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so."
-- Mark Twain

The laws are exactly the problem. Prohibition, be it alcohol or drugs or guns, is a disaster to any country. Traffic laws are for generating income for police departments, not for safety. Education laws and the taxes that accompany them are a jobs program rather than something good for kids. Licensing requirements are how cronies protect their monopolies from cheaper competitors. Mandatory insurance is just another scheme to bleed the peons. The legal handling of domestic disputes is a disaster for all concerned, except for the lawyers.

I actually support and respect good police officers. They are needed for society to exist.

I guess society just did not exist before 1850 then! There were no cops before then.

From that article I cited earlier:

At the time of Tocqueville's observations (in the 1830s), "the means available to the authorities for the discovery of crimes and arrest of criminals [were] few,"47 yet Tocqueville doubted "whether in any other country crime so seldom escapes punishment."48 Citizens handled most crimes informally, forming committees to catch criminals and hand them over to the courts.49

 

[bmtm09]

Prohibition, be it alcohol or drugs or guns, is a disaster to any country. Traffic laws are for generating income for police departments, not for safety. :

Ok wait a minute....So drugs shouldn't be illegal? Drunk driving shouldn't be a crime? Speed limits are just to make money? I'm confused....Last time I checked putting a drunk that just killed a soccer mom and her two kids in jail was a good thing. Yes we should protect yourself and all that but if you didn't see the drunk driving because you were at work while you wife and kids were out shopping when they got mowed down in the safeway parking lot at 100 miles per hour because some idiot went for a beer run drunk... I mean come on!!!! So crack should be legal too??? PCP??? The kinds of people that use them come into your house in gangs and kill you for your stuff. Good luck reaching your gun while in the shower, and even if you do chances are they will be so blazed out of their mind you will only get to stop one of the before the rest get you or your family.
There is a reason we prepare for WROL...it will be chaos and death and murder and rape and brutality. You want that? You want that for your family? I dont...
To each his own I guess but if thats the kind of world you want to live in ????????

 

[bmtm09]

if we didnt have law and law enforcement, people would join gangs for protection and what gang is strongest makes the rules. The rest would just have to be killed for not joining the right gang. people would have to pay tribute to the gang leader or get beaten and killed... I admit our system is flawed but it beats the alternative.....

 

[PaulB47]

Last time I checked putting a drunk that just killed a soccer mom and her two kids in jail was a good thing.

Somehow you have gotten the impression (I don't know where) that I think transgressions should not be punished. No, we agree on this point. Where there are actual identifiable victims, the perpetrators should be punished. Where we differ is that you think people should be punished where there are no victims.

As to drugs, it used to be that you could go into the grocery store and buy laudanum (heroin). There were no problem with this other than that a few people became addicts (just like today) - and even those could still function in society since the cost of the drug was not inflated by prohibition. No cops were needed, nor any laws about it. What was wrong with that? Do you prefer the massive corruption and trashing of inner cities and gangs and drive-by shootings that come from prohibition? How is that better?

If someone comes into your house to kill you, kill him first. Or if he gets you first, your survivors can go after him, or some voluntary association you belong to. Again, this is a crime with a victim, we don't disagree on this point.

Your argument gives great solace to gun prohibitionists. After all they believe in disarming people because some of them might do bad things with them. They agree with your notion of punishing victimless "crimes". If people stopped thinking like this, gun control would collapse instantly.

 

[bmtm09]

So you dont believe that arresting a drunk driver before he runs over a kid is a good thing? You theroy is wait until he does it?
My argument has NOTHING to do with the 2nd Amendment.... Nowhere in the constitution does it give you the right to be be drunk behind the reigns of your horse and trample someone to death. Yours is a reaching argument if I ever heard one. You cannot possibly correlate gun confiscation or restrictive gun laws to drunk driving or illegal drug use.
At the end of it all if you had your way our country would be over run with jihadists killing everyone in their way... yes fine we kill them but only after they shoot 80 kids in a school because if you shoot them before the crime you are wrong... How many crimes have been stopped by LEO? how many criminals have been put behind bars for the wrong they have done?
The first one you cant really quantify...the second one is easier..2,220,300 as of 2013

thats 2220300 a$$ holes I dont want to have around my kids......

WROL... Is a dangerous world ...be careful what you wish for