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My pick for the best: <broken link removed>
Over four years and trouble free.
Jury is still out on the value of Moblinkd and Aprsdroid.
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HAM Radio Starter Kit - Information for Beginners
- Thread Starter JackThompson
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Over four years and trouble free.
Jury is still out on the value of Moblinkd and Aprsdroid.
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Q: APRS depends on the network being up and operating - correct?
If there was just myself and my kids - is there any way they can send me their position info directly from a GPS enabled HT without a dependency on a network?
If there was just myself and my kids - is there any way they can send me their position info directly from a GPS enabled HT without a dependency on a network?
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You are correct that a network connection is needed to view a signal sent to a server via an APRS gateway. With a network connection you can view these received signals from an APRS server like APRS.fi
If you are looking for an independent system you will need your own gateway.
The <broken link removed> is the only off the shelf unit that I have head of, for what you are describing. It is not APRS though.
A few friends and I have been toying with independent APRS between vehicles for "expedition travel". It can be done many ways. I am not sure it is to the "simple stage" yet though. You do need a receiver that can set waypoints on a map for signals received. Keep in mind that these signals are also received by other APRS receivers, so everyone knows where you are
If you are looking for an independent system you will need your own gateway.
The <broken link removed> is the only off the shelf unit that I have head of, for what you are describing. It is not APRS though.
A few friends and I have been toying with independent APRS between vehicles for "expedition travel". It can be done many ways. I am not sure it is to the "simple stage" yet though. You do need a receiver that can set waypoints on a map for signals received. Keep in mind that these signals are also received by other APRS receivers, so everyone knows where you are
You can receive APRS packets and
decode them. No need for a net Gateway and internet access to view locations. We used this standalone setup when I worked as chase for a high altitude balloon photography project under a space grant consortium.
We used a laptop for maps display, but the old Garmin Nuvi 350 can be setup to take waypoint data in and show APRS near you. There are also dedicated displays like AvMap but they are expensive.
I've used Byonics TinyTraks for transmitting data in my own setup with a Yaesu FT-1500m but never for receiving as the space grant had a Kantronics full blown TNC. I think the newer Byonics models support waypoint output. The Argent Tracker2 though is a better deal for the features and upgradability and what I would use along with a Garmin Nuvi if I were to start from scratch today.
decode them. No need for a net Gateway and internet access to view locations. We used this standalone setup when I worked as chase for a high altitude balloon photography project under a space grant consortium.
We used a laptop for maps display, but the old Garmin Nuvi 350 can be setup to take waypoint data in and show APRS near you. There are also dedicated displays like AvMap but they are expensive.
I've used Byonics TinyTraks for transmitting data in my own setup with a Yaesu FT-1500m but never for receiving as the space grant had a Kantronics full blown TNC. I think the newer Byonics models support waypoint output. The Argent Tracker2 though is a better deal for the features and upgradability and what I would use along with a Garmin Nuvi if I were to start from scratch today.
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I like the "Network down" options. I mean, for me the whole idea of shortwave radio communications is the supplement during grid down situations.
I'll have to look into some of those.
For the most part, my family and I work on using actual maps to get places...
I'll have to look into some of those.
For the most part, my family and I work on using actual maps to get places...
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I like to use tech where I can use tech.
I don't want to have to fall back to smoke signals or mirrors.
This time of year up here on the mountain I can't see 100 feet most of the time.
I don't want to have to fall back to smoke signals or mirrors.
This time of year up here on the mountain I can't see 100 feet most of the time.
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Yeah, once you have the "Non-Tech" methods down, it's definitely convenient and quicker to use modern technology.
As a cyber-security specialist I have a love-hate relationship with technology. When my workday is done, I just want to drift back to a time when technology wasn't around running everyone's lives...
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So I took some practice tests for Tech.
I passed the first 5 times and got to the point where I passed it every time (just a few fails - usually something to do with Q codes or which bands allow which modes or that kind of stuff). Got 100% a couple of times and now I am over 90% every time.
So I could go ahead and take it now.
I think I will get an inexpensive Baofeng HT and wait until some of the APRS combined with GPS and digital modes progress to the point where they would work for position reporting simply by having the user push a button or automatically without having to deal with a network.
Or at least at the point where I understand APRS enough to make that work.
The Baofengs would be something I could put in my kids GHBs with a roll up Slim Jim, and a mag mount roof antenna, and then setup a pole antenna on their house, and program them for GMRS/FRS and they would only use them in emergencies. Then I could go ahead and get a Yaesu or iCom or something better.
I passed the first 5 times and got to the point where I passed it every time (just a few fails - usually something to do with Q codes or which bands allow which modes or that kind of stuff). Got 100% a couple of times and now I am over 90% every time.
So I could go ahead and take it now.
I think I will get an inexpensive Baofeng HT and wait until some of the APRS combined with GPS and digital modes progress to the point where they would work for position reporting simply by having the user push a button or automatically without having to deal with a network.
Or at least at the point where I understand APRS enough to make that work.
The Baofengs would be something I could put in my kids GHBs with a roll up Slim Jim, and a mag mount roof antenna, and then setup a pole antenna on their house, and program them for GMRS/FRS and they would only use them in emergencies. Then I could go ahead and get a Yaesu or iCom or something better.
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Pass the test and drop me a PM if you would like an older Kenwood mobile. Some incentive to get your ticket and a radio to get you started.
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I am a bit confused - maybe this was asked and answered, but if so, I don't recall the answer.
Can an HT, like the Kenwood TH-D72A, with built-in TNC, GPS and APRS, transmit position and/or simple text, directly to another APRS capable HT without going through various APRS nodes or the APRS network?
Could a person who received the position data then input this into a GPS map display to track the other person's position?
The goal here is to have position reports for members of my family if they have to evacuate, or I have to go get them, or a situation like that.
Can an HT, like the Kenwood TH-D72A, with built-in TNC, GPS and APRS, transmit position and/or simple text, directly to another APRS capable HT without going through various APRS nodes or the APRS network?
Could a person who received the position data then input this into a GPS map display to track the other person's position?
The goal here is to have position reports for members of my family if they have to evacuate, or I have to go get them, or a situation like that.
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I does apear that this one can even act as a digipeater. So yes, I would say that it can send and receive APRS transmissions.
I am sure it could if connected to PC APRS software or AVMAP. That could plot the position on a map. It may be able to read position data and weather if sent directly, but I have never played with one, so no first hand experience. Wouldn't it be simpler to just tell them in an emergency?
I can see where you are going and I like the idea. I think a vehicle with a mobile and PC onboard able to receive and plot APRS transmissions received would be a good solution. HT have limited range and operating time. In a real long term incident, conservation of that resource needs to be considered. I could see a ping for location and then shut down rather a continuing track. It will be interesting to see what you come up with.
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There are several scenarios I am thinking of:
1) My kids, who live about 15 miles away (13 miles as the crow flies), live on the edge of suburbia - the WA county growth boundary. Walking a mile to the west they would be in rural farmland and moving towards my "BOL" here on the mountain.
If they had to evacuate, I would really like to be able to get a position on them as soon as possible.
2) They both work. Their workplaces are about 10 miles from each other, and they have two vehicles. Their house is about halfway between their workplaces - each workplace being roughly in the opposite direction.
Again, if they have to leave work and get home, it would be useful if they could communicate with each other via radio if their cell phones would not be working. It would be helpful for them and me to know where they are.
They might have to take one of a number of alternate routes to get home or to my house. They may find themselves on foot.
3) In a non-SHTF but emergency situation they (or myself) may find ourselves outside of cell phone range (I live in such a spot where cell phone coverage simply isn't present about 50% of the time).
It would be helpful to send a position to anybody who could receive it. I am guessing that a digital transmission of position might be able to get out where audio might not. It might be possible to send "Emergency, emergency, emergency" and then beacon an immediate position. Just guessing on this one.
These would not be an ongoing situation, but I imagine rather something that would happen in the first few hours to days of an emergency situation.
Of course, it would also be nice to be able to use the GPS functionality to navigate, and to use it to rendezvous with someone.
A slight benefit of APRS would be that someone who doesn't have it would not know your position as easily as someone who does. This might be a slight security advantage. I am thinking my daughter transmitting a request for help and then transmitting her position audibly, might attract unwanted attention from the wrong people.
This is all hypothetical of course, but I am thinking it would be useful. Something along the lines of the Garmin Rhino GPS/FRS/GMRS radios but with the added functionality of a Ham HT and more power, would be useful.
1) My kids, who live about 15 miles away (13 miles as the crow flies), live on the edge of suburbia - the WA county growth boundary. Walking a mile to the west they would be in rural farmland and moving towards my "BOL" here on the mountain.
If they had to evacuate, I would really like to be able to get a position on them as soon as possible.
2) They both work. Their workplaces are about 10 miles from each other, and they have two vehicles. Their house is about halfway between their workplaces - each workplace being roughly in the opposite direction.
Again, if they have to leave work and get home, it would be useful if they could communicate with each other via radio if their cell phones would not be working. It would be helpful for them and me to know where they are.
They might have to take one of a number of alternate routes to get home or to my house. They may find themselves on foot.
3) In a non-SHTF but emergency situation they (or myself) may find ourselves outside of cell phone range (I live in such a spot where cell phone coverage simply isn't present about 50% of the time).
It would be helpful to send a position to anybody who could receive it. I am guessing that a digital transmission of position might be able to get out where audio might not. It might be possible to send "Emergency, emergency, emergency" and then beacon an immediate position. Just guessing on this one.
These would not be an ongoing situation, but I imagine rather something that would happen in the first few hours to days of an emergency situation.
Of course, it would also be nice to be able to use the GPS functionality to navigate, and to use it to rendezvous with someone.
A slight benefit of APRS would be that someone who doesn't have it would not know your position as easily as someone who does. This might be a slight security advantage. I am thinking my daughter transmitting a request for help and then transmitting her position audibly, might attract unwanted attention from the wrong people.
This is all hypothetical of course, but I am thinking it would be useful. Something along the lines of the Garmin Rhino GPS/FRS/GMRS radios but with the added functionality of a Ham HT and more power, would be useful.
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First thing to organize is for them to get their amateur radio operator license. Not only does that make them legal, it shows their interest in the ham radios stuff and they learn a little about it too.
Next I would set up each of their vehicles with APRS. Nice help when a vehicle is stolen. No bonus points with my insurance carrier, but nice all the same. Being able to see where their vehicle is may be all you need in the beginning. I find it very useful. The MicroTrak RTG works great , I have been using it in my vehicle. Set yourself up to see where they are. I have been playing with that myself using the MicroTrak and a Moblink
I would not worry so much about privacy relaying your coordinates. If you are worried about it, just use points familiar to you. Meet south of "Joe's old shed" , or where "we cut the cottonwood tree". The other thing to think about is the bad guys are probably not listening to the frequency you choose. If you don't chat it up lots they won't find you. If you want to make it hard, have an agreed frequency change during communications. Our 4WD frequencies are agreed in the expedition. We can go up and down through the set of nine pretty easily. Only those in the group know our routine.
Hams on the whole are helpful, or seem to be. I don't worry about who is listening , but I do keep in mind that it could be anyone.
Remember KISS. Just learning to use and communicate via radio can be a chore on its own. Get really good at that first. You can add to it and complicate things when you get bored with good communications
Ever heard of hams doing a fox hunt? If you want to locate another HT that might be a skill worth learning.
Next I would set up each of their vehicles with APRS. Nice help when a vehicle is stolen. No bonus points with my insurance carrier, but nice all the same. Being able to see where their vehicle is may be all you need in the beginning. I find it very useful. The MicroTrak RTG works great , I have been using it in my vehicle. Set yourself up to see where they are. I have been playing with that myself using the MicroTrak and a Moblink
I would not worry so much about privacy relaying your coordinates. If you are worried about it, just use points familiar to you. Meet south of "Joe's old shed" , or where "we cut the cottonwood tree". The other thing to think about is the bad guys are probably not listening to the frequency you choose. If you don't chat it up lots they won't find you. If you want to make it hard, have an agreed frequency change during communications. Our 4WD frequencies are agreed in the expedition. We can go up and down through the set of nine pretty easily. Only those in the group know our routine.
Hams on the whole are helpful, or seem to be. I don't worry about who is listening , but I do keep in mind that it could be anyone.
Remember KISS. Just learning to use and communicate via radio can be a chore on its own. Get really good at that first. You can add to it and complicate things when you get bored with good communications
Ever heard of hams doing a fox hunt? If you want to locate another HT that might be a skill worth learning.
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thanks.
I thought about using the first letter of the road - such as "I am at the north end of road C" or "we just crossed road S west of the highway to your house".
But plans often go awry and voice takes more bandwidth than a few chars of data.
I am not concerned about hams, but there are a lot of people out there who have scanners.
I thought about using the first letter of the road - such as "I am at the north end of road C" or "we just crossed road S west of the highway to your house".
But plans often go awry and voice takes more bandwidth than a few chars of data.
I am not concerned about hams, but there are a lot of people out there who have scanners.
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You are right that there are people with scanners. Not so many that scan banks of frequencies though. Bearcat did make some scanning portables that would scan banks of frequencies. There are a few preban scanners out there that do 900 mhz too. Scanners are usually programmed with the frequencies to scan. It takes a very long time to numerically go through each frequency. Even with a very fast scanner more than a dozen channels scanned is a challenge. You tend to miss quite a bit. I have four radios scanning and still miss things on pre-programmed channels. Someone very good at scanning might be able to find and monitor "your" channel, but why? It would take time to narrow down the channel that you are using and then more to glean anything useful from what you are communicating. If you are up to something they are worried about, then maybe. I doubt your comms are important enough to follow if you are smart about it.
If you can stay simplex and not rely upon a repeater it is pretty easy to keep things private. You can always set up your own repeater if you need a little more range. Using someone elses repeater, you can count on someone listening in. It is nice to have that kind of range though. Use it like a party line. Everyone is listening to that frequency. That can be an advantage too.
I would say that while voice does take more bandwidth, the human brain is much better at discerning what is useful and what is not. The current algorithms for digital are ok in a perfect world, not not good at all when things get sketchy. A scratchy voice communication can be understood, but data is all or nothing.
If you can stay simplex and not rely upon a repeater it is pretty easy to keep things private. You can always set up your own repeater if you need a little more range. Using someone elses repeater, you can count on someone listening in. It is nice to have that kind of range though. Use it like a party line. Everyone is listening to that frequency. That can be an advantage too.
I would say that while voice does take more bandwidth, the human brain is much better at discerning what is useful and what is not. The current algorithms for digital are ok in a perfect world, not not good at all when things get sketchy. A scratchy voice communication can be understood, but data is all or nothing.
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There is a repeater up the mountain I live on. Not sure if I can connect up to it though as the terrain is uneven between it and my property so it might be hidden. I need to take the test and get an HT and start seeing what is what for my location.
I am in a position where I could place my own repeater here - but it will only be good for looking to the north as that is the side of the mountain I am one and I would need to go up another 400 feet in elevation to get over to the south side of the mountain. Fortunately, my primary concern is my daughter and her husband who are to the north northeast of my location.
They are a bit down in a hole where their house is, but once they get up on the hill between us they should be able to talk to me, and they should be able to see the repeater on the mountain, so if I can see it too that would be good - but I would setup my own base here with a repeater so I can have that as a backup. Fortunately I can put up pretty much any antenna I want on my property, within FAA regs (there is a nav beacon on the top of the mountain and aircraft fly over my property all the time, but I could put up something about 100 to 150 ft. high if I want - just have someone put something in the top of my trees).
By less bandwidth I meant that it is possible that low bandwidth digital will reach out farther, and it can be repeated until acknowledged automatically. Then there is also CW.
I am in a position where I could place my own repeater here - but it will only be good for looking to the north as that is the side of the mountain I am one and I would need to go up another 400 feet in elevation to get over to the south side of the mountain. Fortunately, my primary concern is my daughter and her husband who are to the north northeast of my location.
They are a bit down in a hole where their house is, but once they get up on the hill between us they should be able to talk to me, and they should be able to see the repeater on the mountain, so if I can see it too that would be good - but I would setup my own base here with a repeater so I can have that as a backup. Fortunately I can put up pretty much any antenna I want on my property, within FAA regs (there is a nav beacon on the top of the mountain and aircraft fly over my property all the time, but I could put up something about 100 to 150 ft. high if I want - just have someone put something in the top of my trees).
By less bandwidth I meant that it is possible that low bandwidth digital will reach out farther, and it can be repeated until acknowledged automatically. Then there is also CW.
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Lots of options. I crossband repeat with my truck. Hiking the canyons I park it on top with good reach into a linked repeater. In the canyon I can hit the truck UHF and get out. Makes a nice mobile repeater.
I keep hearing that a good J pole is the way to go. http://www.hamuniverse.com/jpole.html I really need to make one so that I can say I have done it. I think it is a good skill to have. I hate to say that I have not been very involved in antenna building. I have tuned in a few , but it has all be off the shelf stuff. I have a multi-band dipole for HF that still needs some refinement, but works. Big towers can be quite a project. The tallest I have done is 75' and that is plenty high enough for me I have been offered a retractable tower. I really do need to get a hold of that. I am in a flight path for the air port here, so I may be limited for height even though I am a few miles away.
I keep hearing that a good J pole is the way to go. http://www.hamuniverse.com/jpole.html I really need to make one so that I can say I have done it. I think it is a good skill to have. I hate to say that I have not been very involved in antenna building. I have tuned in a few , but it has all be off the shelf stuff. I have a multi-band dipole for HF that still needs some refinement, but works. Big towers can be quite a project. The tallest I have done is 75' and that is plenty high enough for me
I have been offered a retractable tower. I really do need to get a hold of that. I am in a flight path for the air port here, so I may be limited for height even though I am a few miles away.
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Looking to take a class for getting HAM license. I have a VX7R, and have listened, but would like to be able to use it. Any place close to Rock Creek Beav/NW Port to take a class and take test?
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Find a place to take the test:
http://www.arrl.org/find-an-amateur-radio-license-exam-session
Practice exams:
http://www.eham.net/exams/
<broken link removed>
http://aa9pw.com/radio/
http://www.arrl.org/find-an-amateur-radio-license-exam-session
Practice exams:
http://www.eham.net/exams/
<broken link removed>
http://aa9pw.com/radio/
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You should be able to do the practice exams on qrz.com and do quite well. You can take the test at Hillsboro Fire Station # 3 Ronler Acres first Saturday of every month at 10 am.
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