Had to pull a gun on someone today

[The Heretic]

Thanks for the 'teachable moment"
I'm curious. Where were the other 2 (the female and the 90 deg guy)? and what were they doing while the soda thrower was threatening you?
i.e.; did she get behind the wheel and was he trying to circle behind you?

I think I'll get one of those fisheye (ski boat) mirrors or a "third eye" mirror for my shooting glasses, so I can watch my back when shooting alone.

Here is another thought.

Some months ago I was out on my property trying out a new pistol I bought.

I was near my driveway, but I didn't hear a neighbor drive up to talk to me because I was wearing hearing muffs. It wasn't until I turned around and walked to the driveway that I knew he was there.

I now have hearing muffs with microphones and it is much harder to sneak up on me when I am doing something that requires wearing them.

 

[NoFlinch]

I went back out there yesterday to meet with the manager of the logging company (actually he works for the subsidiary of the subsidiary of of the subsidiary of a Major National Homeowners/Auto, etc. Insurance company).

To say I was "concerned" to return would be about right.

I'm meeting with the Sheriffs dept today.

I don't like the idea of law enforcement patrolling the woods any more than anyone else.

That is my "relaxing/get away from the crap of every day life" area.............or it USED to be.

But we have to make it very unpleasant for these guys to hang out here, so maybe a year from now they will leave and us "friendlies" can feel safe again.

I hope everyone is learning something with these posts. That is the reason for the OP.

I know I am. Thanks everyone.

 

[Koda]

I sometimes train alone on public lands and never shoot my gun dry or always have ready mags loaded. This year I started teaching my daughter to shoot and now I carry a BUG even if its not the weapon I intent o train with that day. I thought about this same scenario and people tell me its never really an issue but I never bought it, call me paranoid but your story says it all. Being alone in the woods is one of the worst tactical disadvantages you can be in if someone wants to do you harm, armed or not. Kudos to you for having situational awareness, being prepared AND handling the situation properly... excellent verbage and communication with the thugs. One of the few "I had to draw my gun today" internet stories I agree with.

Its also of high value to share these experiences when you can.... because one takeaway I gleened from this story is something I've never done, yet..., and that is training from inside my vehicle. Thank you for putting this on my radar. Next time Im out training in the woods I will practice (unloaded and safely of course) drawing and aiming while sitting and driving. This is essential if in your story the thugs were also armed when you were driving away, again excellent example of what to do.

 

[erudne]

I had a similar experience 4 years back 1 mile from home but I was unarmed fortunately it was 1 on 1 and I got to my rig where I had a rifle. Meth does make PPL crazy and that ghetto drink Szirrup, or Drank is just as bad inducing aggressive paranoia, the users often smoke pot at the same time. This drug has become the new favorite of rappers and gang bangers it causes heavy kidney damage but due to it's effects the bangers love it

 

[The Heretic]

And BTW - thanks all for sharing your experience.

I did not think about this much prior to this thread.

 

[SIG383]

And this is why I have a CCW on my whenever possible. I've had to pull my gun on two occasions off duty. The first was when I was living in Oklahoma and was in Tulsa. It was late and I was stopped at a light with my windows down. A man approached my driver's side window and produced a knife, telling me to get out of my truck. I had my Sig P220 mounted to my center console and leveled it on him. I actually was in the process of pulling the trigger when he dropped the knife and ran. I let off since he was no longer a threat and called the police. Responding officer told me I should of just shot the punk cause he will probably just find someone else next time that isn't armed.

The second time was when I was getting gas just off base at McChord at about 0200. I was filling up when three gangbangers walked out of the projects across the street and started demanding that I "helped them." When I politely told them I wasn't going to and to leave me alone they got closer and started posturing as if they had a weapon. I unholsterd mine and pointed it at the one talking and told them to leave me the f alone. They turned tail and ran back across the street, and I'm going to guess they had to change their pants when they got back. Law enforcement response on that was retarded though. No physical response since nothing actually happened. I was told I could file a report online if I wanted to...gotta love Lakewood, ugh.

 

[RumpleForeskin]

Not too long ago, after clearing a mag, I nearly pissed myself when I turned around to find the sheriff behind me just checking in. I didn't even hear his truck pull up or door shut...

Like Heretic was saying, I feel much safer when shooting alone now that I have a pair of impact sports. They really help to increase situational awareness. If I shoot alone, I will not go without them.

 

[AMProducts]

So by my reading of your story... the moment they tried to prevent you from leaving, you were within your rights in nearly every jurisdiction I'm aware of to shoot them all dead.

As a few others have stated... the gangsters arn't afraid of your gun, they're only afraid of your intent to use it. In the case of meth zombies, they may not have that survival instinct.

At the same time, what you may want to consider doing is filing a restraining order against them. If you have to testify as to the crime they tried to commit against you (kidnapping, possibly robbery), I would definitely do this. That way, in 6 months when they get out of the county klink, you're within your rights to put lead on target and there won't be a court in the land that will argue with it.

I've only pulled my gun a few times, and fired it in anger only on animals. There was this one time with an aggressive pan handler in downtown LA, who had his change bucket on a stick, and would poke you with the stick until you gave him money. Funny how producing a handgun made him go away.

 

[Joe13]

I generally shoot right by my truck on a gravel road. So far I've been able to hear trucks, bikes/atv's and horses approaching. I've not yet had someone walk by, but I might go for a loaded weapon if startled by someone standing behind me.

 

[RVTECH]

the moment they tried to prevent you from leaving, you were within your rights in nearly every jurisdiction I'm aware of to shoot them all dead.

That kind of what I was thinking also - wouldn't that technically be kidnapping

Regardless I have been giving this a lot of thought and thinking in all the years I have been shooting in the woods I have never encountered anything like this - or even close to it. I suspect because of where I live I don't have to go too far to shoot - and that is still too close to town for undesirables to feel comfortable. They are out there though - I see evidence of it all the time.

 

[The Heretic]

A case could maybe be made for kidnapping, but it would be tenuous and it would be his word against theirs.

Even if there was a video, a good defense lawyer could probably get it pleaded down to criminal mischief, maybe acquittal, arguing that it was just a misunderstanding. It is pretty hard to prove intent in court without something more than somewhat ambiguous actions and words that could be interpreted various ways.

Not saying that wasn't their intent - we all know that probably was - at the very least they probably wanted to steal something by intimidation - most likely the guns. The OP was justified in his actions - no doubt about that, but I think he showed the correct level of restraint too. A little more, or a little longer, and it would have been a bad situation.

The restraining order may be a good idea - it would seem to me that a case could be made for it now without any further actions on the part of the tweakers, but maybe it requires more. IANAL.

 

[The Heretic]

Indeed, this sort of situation makes a good argument for a personal video device while out shooting like that.

Increasingly people are installing them in their cars, on their motorcycles, and so on, to document situations where they may have to argue a situation in court or to the authorities.

Often it is just enough to tell a person that you are recording them on video to get them back off - this is one of the reasons why LEOs who have these devices have seen a significant drop in their need to use force and in complaints about excessive force (I am sure the other side of it too is that cops know there is a video/audio record, so they themselves conduct themselves accordingly).

I have a GoPro - I used it to record motorcycle rides - but now I think I would use it while out in the woods like this.

Eventually such devices will become much smaller, much cheaper and ubiquitous - like the Google glasses.

 

[RVTECH]

The restraining order may be a good idea

Correct me if I am wrong but I THOUGHT in Oregon a restraining order could only be taken out against a relative.

 

[RVTECH]

The restraining order may be a good idea

Correct me if I am wrong but I THOUGHT in Oregon a restraining order could only be taken out against a relative.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Heck no. You'd still be on your own in about any situation regarding these cretins though. At least you have it on the books(?) that they tried some hinky stuff.

 

[Capn Jack]

WOW ! Other strange things you find in the woods......

 

[The Heretic]

Correct me if I am wrong but I THOUGHT in Oregon a restraining order could only be taken out against a relative.

You are wrong.

Not sure where that idea came from, but it is wrong.

If you can show good enough cause, you can have a restraining order against most anybody. Multiple people have a restraining order against my ex-wife, and she isn't related to any of them.

 

[SIG383]

Sounds like it's a good thing she's your ex-wife!

 

[The Heretic]

It's a good thing she doesn't know where I live, where I work and I changed my phone number. The people who have the restraining order against her live in the same complex as her - everybody else avoids her as much as possible.

She also does not have the resources to (i.e., internet access or the knowledge to use it) to find out where I live, and she has no transportation to get here either. So I am reasonably safe from her bothering me.

Not that she is a danger to me or anybody else really - just a bothersome annoyance with a tenuous grasp on reality.

 

[mjbskwim]

A case could maybe be made for kidnapping, but it would be tenuous and it would be his word against theirs.

Well kinda hard for them to talk with that gaping wound thru their chest