Do you always obey the law?

[dmancornell]

I would expect that chance of mechanical failures increases with increase of speed. Culture plays a role in a way that while there is no legal speed limit, few Germans drive above recommended 130KM/h.

Really? Not when I picked up my BMW from there.

I didn't even mention that if your car does fail because of mechanical failure, it's still considered an accident, regardless of how fast you were going.

German folk has to go to driving school for 3 months before they get a license. Wouldn't you call that another unnecessary government bureaucracy ?

Good one, but the fact that local governments here would hand a license to anyone, then slap arbitrary and pointless speed limits to every single person, that is entirely a failure of government. If the government has to exist, then they should at least do their stated job instead of lying and stealing from people.

Don't take laws in general, take homicides (other than self-defense). Or maybe we should legalize them ?

Strawman, laws against murder aren't idiotic, and one of the few that aren't.

Technically that's not allowed. At least in California where I initially got licensed and actually studied for the test. Is it different in Oregon ?

That's an example. They can be going 45 or 50 with the exact same effect downstream.

NFA laws had some societal interest when they got passed. Those interests are long gone, so we have to revisit those laws.

Hahahaha, good luck on that, just like trying to revisit speed limit laws. Reasons are twofold. Too much money to be made, and the state loves to demonstrate its power, and hence will rarely relinquish it, if ever.

 

[mat33]

I don't think it's a good idea to admit to breaking the law here...

NSA Chief Denies, Denies, Denies Wired's Domestic Spying Story | Threat Level | Wired.com

Oh, and Obama if you are listening, I'm still waiting on my Colt Python. Don tin foil hat after the beep.

 

[Redcap]

I don't think it's a good idea to admit to breaking the law here...

NSA Chief Denies, Denies, Denies Wired's Domestic Spying Story | Threat Level | Wired.com

Oh, and Obama if you are listening, I'm still waiting on my Colt Python. Don tin foil hat after the beep.

 

[fd15k]

Really? Not when I picked up my BMW from there.

I drove through entire Germany four times, and lived there for several months on another occasion. I really didn't see there so much road stupidity as I see here.
But you know, it's possible that you've experienced something different.

I didn't even mention that if your car does fail because of mechanical failure, it's still considered an accident, regardless of how fast you were going.

I was told otherwise by Germans - one assumes all liability going above 130KM/h, even if it is somebody else's fault.

Good one, but the fact that local governments here would hand a license to anyone, then slap arbitrary and pointless speed limits to every single person, that is entirely a failure of government. If the government has to exist, then they should at least do their stated job instead of lying and stealing from people.

To decide when something is pointless or not there are methods, and people to use them, and so on. I don't believe in general conspiracies of abstract bodies.

That's an example. They can be going 45 or 50 with the exact same effect downstream.

45 or 50 is also an example, I understand. But even that is not allowed

811.315 Failure of slow driver to drive on right; exceptions; penalty. (1) A person commits the offense of failure of a slow driver to drive on the right if the person is operating a vehicle upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing and the person fails to drive:

(a) In the right-hand lane available for traffic; or

(b) As close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway.

(2) This section does not apply under any of the following circumstances:

(a) When overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction under the rules governing passing in ORS 811.410 to 811.425.

(b) When preparing to turn left at an intersection, alley or private road or driveway.

(3) The offense described in this section, failure of slow driver to drive on the right, is a Class B traffic violation. [1983 c.338 §619; 1995 c.383 §57]

Hahahaha, good luck on that, just like trying to revisit speed limit laws. Reasons are twofold. Too much money to be made, and the state loves to demonstrate its power, and hence will rarely relinquish it, if ever.

Why good luck ? It's on the table, just not for immediate consumption. We will get there once we fix carry laws, assault weapon bans, magazine capacities, etc.

 

[DEADTIME]

I don't follow all laws all the time, I think many are silly and set up with the primary reason to provide cash flow to the city or state and to give the police something to do and a reason to pull you over. This doesn't mean I break big laws, I don't harm the innocent etc but silly crap like safety belts all the time and U turns when I'm out in the middle of no where, that kind of stuff .

 

[Father of four]

Rascals...you're right, speeding saves very little time. Generally uses alot more fuel, though.
I drive for a living, I drive the speed limit. It's liberating, not to worry about speed traps. Or stress if a LEO happens to be following me.
But, yes, it does irritate other drivers.

Would you PLEASE keep to the middle or slow lane then? Thanks!

 

[Redcap]

There are a lot of bullbubblegum laws I ignore.

 

[Burt Gummer]

Pertinent article on OP's subject - Overt Resistance is Futile, But Evasion is Still Possible

"Why shouldn’t the same go for other mule-headed laws such as the ones demanding full stops at stop signs in the middle of nowhere, when it’s clear there’s no reason (other than it being “the law”) to come to a complete stop? Why should we sit like cattle at lights that never change (or which take forever to change) when there’s no reason (other than it being against “the law”) to look, then proceed?

If enough of us began to treat with similar contempt the other laws – the many laws – that plague us but which are just as silly as “Drive 55″ (or Prohibition) we could shame and ridicule these laws into the history books. The stumbling block is overcoming the passivity and submissiveness that is now the American archetype. We didn’t use to be this way – and we don’t have to be this way forever. You say you’re sick of the suffocating, controlling New World Order that’s congealing all around you? Defy it! Not with bullets – but with initiative and common sense. And ridicule. These tools are still available to us.

If only enough of us were willing to pick them up… ."

 

[dmancornell]

I drove through entire Germany four times, and lived there for several months on another occasion. I really didn't see there so much road stupidity as I see here.
But you know, it's possible that you've experienced something different.

Actually I experienced the exact same thing. Since the US governments have decided to monopolize the roads, you figure they'd bear responsibility for driver education, which they failed miserably to do.

To decide when something is pointless or not there are methods, and people to use them, and so on. I don't believe in general conspiracies of abstract bodies.

It's not conspiracy, it's fact. They say speed limits are for safety, that is a lie. Which in turn makes speeding tickets nothing more than a money making scam.

45 or 50 is also an example, I understand. But even that is not allowed

811.315 Failure of slow driver to drive on right; exceptions; penalty. (1) A person commits the offense of failure of a slow driver to drive on the right if the person is operating a vehicle upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place

How many times have you seen the cops give tickets to people going 45-50mph in a 55mph zone, which is basically all highways in West Portland? Right, never.

Why good luck ? It's on the table, just not for immediate consumption. We will get there once we fix carry laws, assault weapon bans, magazine capacities, etc.

Let me know when NFA34, GCA68 and FOPA86 are abolished. Maybe then I'll take my flying car out and speed like a madman.

 

[hariph creek]

I'm shocked that some of you would even suggest, there could possibly be corruption in the government? And, to think there are laws that are dubios at best, how could that be?
I guess since things are not done, according to my or your conception of propriety, then all bets are off?
I suppose that gives me license to do as I please?
Of course, if somebody ''in charge'' breaks the rules, we can detest that. How can we hold ourselves to the same standard? It's ubsurd!

There are wrecks on the Autobahn, as well.

I assume those who say they don't adhere to this particular society's laws, are:
A) blowing alot of smoke
B) enjoying internet service from jail
C) actively working to change this corrupt land and it's tyranny of rules

 

[fd15k]

Would you PLEASE keep to the middle or slow lane then? Thanks!

That doesn't work either. Because when you're going 65 in 55 zone, there will be one that wants to go 70. When you slow him down,
he wants to maneuver to pass you (via "middle" or "slow" lane). When he maneuvers, changing lanes and changing speed rapidly,
chance of an accident increases dramatically.

In any case, I should probably state at this point that some of our speed limits are ridiculous, and I am in no way defending them

 

[dmancornell]

I'm shocked that some of you would even suggest, there could possibly be corruption in the government?

 

[dmancornell]

there will be one that wants to go 70.

That's me, and I actually want to go 80. So kindly get out of my way. Anyone who obeys the speed limit should stay home until they grow a pair and develop some minimal brain function.

Here's an idea, maybe if enough people treated bad laws with the contempt they deserve (i.e. Prohibition), they'd be abolished in a timely manner.

 

[fd15k]

26, 217 and 405 in West Portland all have 55mph "limits". Half that is 27.5, which is well below 45 or 50.

You're right, my bad. I copied Oregon law without reading, while only having checked the California one. It's different :

21654. (a) Notwithstanding the prima facie speed limits, any
vehicle proceeding upon a highway at a speed less than the normal
speed of traffic moving in the same direction at such time shall be
driven in the right-hand lane for traffic or as close as practicable
to the right-hand edge or curb, except when overtaking and passing
another vehicle proceeding in the same direction or when preparing
for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or
driveway.
(b) If a vehicle is being driven at a speed less than the normal
speed of traffic moving in the same direction at such time, and is
not being driven in the right-hand lane for traffic or as close as
practicable to the right-hand edge or curb, it shall constitute prima
facie evidence that the driver is operating the vehicle in violation
of subdivision (a) of this section.
(c) The Department of Transportation, with respect to state
highways, and local authorities, with respect to highways under their
jurisdiction, may place and maintain upon highways official signs
directing slow-moving traffic to use the right-hand traffic lane
except when overtaking and passing another vehicle or preparing for a
left turn.

Let me know when NFA34, GCA68 and FOPA86 are abolished. Maybe then I'll take my flying car out and speed like a madman.

They likely won't be abolished as a whole. Supreme Court stated that some regulation is permissible, and it is unlikely that Congress would strike them down in full either. But we should be able to open machine gun registration, and remove SBS/SBR from the NFA, and perhaps suppressors as well.

 

[fd15k]

That's me, and I actually want to go 80. So kindly get out of my way. Anyone who obeys the speed limit should stay home until they grow a pair and develop some minimal brain function.

Here's an idea, maybe if enough people treated bad laws with the contempt they deserve (i.e. Prohibition), they'd be abolished in a timely manner.

Perhaps we don't need any traffic laws at all ? Let's drive like they do in Egypt, or India

 

[dmancornell]

Perhaps we don't need any traffic laws at all ? Let's drive like they do in Egypt, or India

Your strawman question actually reveals a nugget of truth. I read in a science magazine recently that a Norwegian (I think) university performed a experiment in a busy downtown intersection where they removed all traffic signs for cars and pedestrians, and just let the traffic loose. Result: no accidents, because the people and cars autonomously negotiated their way.

Introduce some common sense to traffic rules, simplify them instead of using them as a money making scam to fund the state, and the roads will be far safer. And I'd have one less reason to despise the cops.

 

[fd15k]

Your strawman question actually reveals a nugget of truth. I read in a science magazine recently that a Norwegian (I think) university performed a experiment in a busy downtown intersection where they removed all traffic signs for cars and pedestrians, and just let the traffic loose. Result: no accidents, because the people and cars autonomously negotiated their way.

Introduce some common sense to traffic rules, simplify them instead of using them as a money making scam to fund the state, and the roads will be far safer. And I'd have one less reason to despise the cops.

When you say this, it feels like you haven't actually driven in Europe (Germany) US traffic rules are the simplest, and have more common sense in them than in any other country.

 

[dmancornell]

When you say this, it feels like you haven't actually driven in Europe (Germany) US traffic rules are the simplest, and have more common sense in them than in any other country.

Implying a 55mph speed limit in 3 lane highway is "common sense".

Actually I'll concede the road rules here are "simpler" than say, the UK (never driven there but observed the madness), but that doesn't change my point regarding the thieving nature of US speed limits.

 

[fd15k]

Implying a 55mph speed limit in 3 lane highway is "common sense".

Well, you've driven in Germany. In many areas, the moment Autobahn approaches a large city, there are speed limits posted, regardless of the number of lanes.
Also, we have places with 80MPH limit, don't we ? And if you do a comparison to other countries, Germany kind of stands alone with their system. Most other nations in Europe have 80MPH (130KM/h) on select highways (similar to our freeways), and most other highways are 55MPH (90KM/h) or 50MPH (80KM/h) . So I'm not really sure how to define common sense here. On one hand I don't feel like going 75MPH past Blythe on I-10 East, on another hand 50MPH on 26 in Portland seems somewhat appropriate.

 

[dmancornell]

Well, you've driven in Germany. In many areas, the moment Autobahn approaches a large city, there are speed limits posted, regardless of the number of lanes.
Also, we have places with 80MPH limit, don't we ? And if you do a comparison to other countries, Germany kind of stands alone with their system. Most other nations in Europe have 80MPH (130KM/h) on select highways (similar to our freeways), and most other highways are 55MPH (90KM/h) or 50MPH (80KM/h) . So I'm not really sure how to define common sense here. On one hand I don't feel like going 75MPH past Blythe on I-10 East, on another hand 50MPH on 26 in Portland seems somewhat appropriate.

As I recall, the speed limits in the autobahn auto-adjust based on congestion, as opposed to the arbitrarily set, static limits that we have.

Perhaps the real distinguishing point of Germany's system is that they are honest enough not to use their roads as a money-making scheme then have the audacity to lie and say that it's for motorist safety.

Also, 50mph on any part of 26 is pure insanity unless you drive a Yugo or Geo Metro. And speaking of 26, if road safety were the goal, why do I see cops camped out on 26 at midnight when the road is completely empty? Do they think I'll slam into the concrete divider because I'm going 20 over (i.e. 75mph, or a barely adequate speed)?