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Do all modern firearms need to be cocked before firing?

Discussion in 'Handgun Discussion' started by gunnails, Mar 12, 2014.

  1. gunnails

    gunnails Hillsboro Active Member

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    Having a discussion with a federal LEO on my favorite Jets site that claims you can not cock a Glock.

    I say BS of course you have to cock a Glock, maybe we are arguing semantics?

    Thoughts anyone?
     
  2. elsie

    elsie Way over there on the left Well-Known Member

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    Definitely semantics. As you pull the trigger, the striker is pulled back to its 'cocked' position then released to fire.


    elsie
     
    RicInOR likes this.
  3. RicInOR

    RicInOR Washington County Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    What is your "friend" saying that "racking the slide" does on modern striker fired weapons, like the Glock?
     
    mjbskwim likes this.
  4. BEN LILLY

    BEN LILLY Lincoln City, OR NRA LIFE MEMBER Bronze Supporter

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    Yes, of course a gun must be cocked to fire. Ask the LEO to explain to you how he thinks a gun fires. Probably a failure to communicate.
     
  5. Certaindeaf

    Certaindeaf SE Portland Well-Known Member

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    "He's" probably an eleven year old girl that just trolls sports sites for a thrill.
     
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  6. Classic

    Classic Federal Way WA Well-Known Member

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    Without racking the weapon, the ammo never gets chambered from the magazine (including a Glock)
     
  7. Certaindeaf

    Certaindeaf SE Portland Well-Known Member

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    Remington makes some EtronX electric primers and makes a Model 700 EtronX rifle with no "hammer" etc.. it just uses two electric poles.
     
  8. Reno911

    Reno911 Hillsboro Well-Known Member 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    He is an idiot.

    Sadly he is a federal agent. I guess I should not be surprised.

    What he is referring to is single action/double action. Or how there is no external hammer on a Glock therefore you can not "cock the hammer" which is true. What he doesn't know, which in my opinion is a little terrifying as I would hope that the government would train those that they give guns to about the guns they give them, is that Glocks are always "cocked" as the sear is engaged with the striker at all times once the slide is racked. Then the trigger pulls the striker further back and pulls the sear downward.

    Did I mention I am a bit scared to hear that a federal agent knows nothing about the gun he probably carries? Seriously, they want to take the guns away from us and they give them to monkeys.
     
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  9. gunnails

    gunnails Hillsboro Active Member

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    Thanks for the feed back, this guy is a dork, always has something contrary to say.

    I have never handled a Glock, What happens when you load an empty magazine, rack the slide and pull the trigger? I am sure the gun goes click, what I am uncertain of is the gun capable of re-striking without racking the slide again?
     
  10. CJ1089

    CJ1089 Aloha, Oregon Marveling at the world.

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    That is called double strike capability. Some of the striker fired pistols (Taurus) have it and some don't(Glock). All DAO and DA/SA pistols have this defining characteristic.
     
  11. Reno911

    Reno911 Hillsboro Well-Known Member 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    Glocks are "double action only".

    Therefor one pull of the trigger cocks the striker and releases it. There is no way to reset this action unless the slide is cycled.

    Single action is like a 1911, where the hammer can be cocked, yet pulling the trigger only drops the hammer it does not cock the hammer back.

    Then there is single action/double action. Like the M92. You can pull the trigger and it will cock and release the hammer. You can also cock the hammer and then the trigger will only drop the hammer, becoming single action.

    Either this guy is arguing that there is no external hammer to cock, which is true. However being a striker fired DAO pistol. Racking the slide is "cocking" the Glock. So yes Glocks can be "cocked" and no they can't at the same time. I'm guessing both of you need a good tour on youtube and wikipedia.

    Glocks are labeled DOA, but they also have a preset trigger. The preset has to be cocked. That's why I say they can be cocked, yet they can't because in theory of a DAO, its cocked when you pull the trigger.
     
  12. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    I believe the striker fired weapon is cocked when you rack the slide,not when you pull the trigger
    You are only releasing the striker as you pull the trigger
     
  13. XSubSailor

    XSubSailor SW WA Active Member

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    Not exactly...most striker-fired pistols operate as you describe; however, Reno911's description above of how a Glock operates is correct. Racking the slide partially cocks the striker, and pulling the trigger pulls the striker further before releasing it.
     
  14. Reno911

    Reno911 Hillsboro Well-Known Member 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    You just defined a single action trigger.

    Some striker fired pistols are single action. IE when racked the sear holds the striker to the fully rearward position. Then when you pull the trigger you only drop the sear and the striker flies forward.

    Glocks and many other pistols that take design after the Glock, have a preset trigger DAO. When the slide is racked the sear engages the striker but not at the fully rearward position. If the sear were to disengage at this preset nothing would happen. So the trigger performs two actions. It pulls the striker the rest of the way back, then disengages the sear. Two actions = double action. One action = single action.

    As to the guy bugging the OP. He is right and wrong depending on how you look at it. If he knew what he was talking about he would know that a Glock has a preset trigger DAO and by racking the slide the gun is "cocked"

    In other words Glocks shouldn't be defined by the trigger definition DAO. They should be defined as a preset DAO. To alleviate any confusion.
     
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  15. gunnails

    gunnails Hillsboro Active Member

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    Again thanks to all who have responded, in particular Reno.

    This has always been the best thing about this site, talking about guns and all the different nuances, thanks for the education.
     
  16. 2506

    2506 Seattle Well-Known Member

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    When I pull the trigger on my S&W model 19, it goes bang every time. But then again, all you youngsters probably figure it's not a modern firearm.
    And get off my lawn!
     
  17. Silver Hand

    Silver Hand Southern Oregon Coast Well-Known Member

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    They still make them, Don't they?
    Silver Hand
     
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  18. Will

    Will Everett Active Member

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    Semantics yes, I expect he is thinking of hammer fired pistols and the ability to cock the hammer.
     
  19. Hook686

    Hook686 Northern California Active Member

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    hmmmm the question concerning a 'gun' comes up and whole hatfull of folks jump in with comments on auto loading pistols. Double action revolvers do not need to be cocked. Actually I do not think my DAO pistol needs to be cocked. What does 'Modern' mean ?
     
  20. Certaindeaf

    Certaindeaf SE Portland Well-Known Member

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    It must be magic.