bad barrel? 9mm, help me troubleshoot my barrel

[Koda]

Also, do you own headspace gauges? That's the only real way to gauge if the chamber is tight or within spec. Remember, just using a set of calipers will get you the depth of the cut, not the headspace. Headspace is from the breach face of the slide to the case neck in the chamber.

This picture spells out many things to me, of which the chamber is none of them, it hasn't even seated itself in the chamber yet to alert me of chamber issues. This is other stacked intolerances.

I dont, but thats a good idea i will look into headspace guage.

Ive tried 3 brands of magazines, and several different recoil spring rates, no change.

My in spec ammo doesnt fit the chamber. Its the chamber. I dont think its a headspace issue, but that measurss small too... But its the diameter of the chamber thats really small. That acfects feeding into the chamber.

I think.
Always open to learn.

 

[Wombat of Doom]

Also, do you own headspace gauges? That's the only real way to gauge if the chamber is tight or within spec. Remember, just using a set of calipers will get you the depth of the cut, not the headspace. Headspace is from the breach face of the slide to the case neck in the chamber.

This picture spells out many things to me, of which the chamber is none of them, it hasn't even seated itself in the chamber yet to alert me of chamber issues. This is other stacked intolerances.

I had the issue in the pic in the past. A glock recoil spring fixed my issues. YMMV.

 

[Member 34319]

I dont, but thats a good idea i will look into headspace guage.

Ive tried 3 brands of magazines, and several different recoil spring rates, no change.

My in spec ammo doesnt fit the chamber. Its the chamber. I dont think its a headspace issue, but that measurss small too... But its the diameter of the chamber thats really small. That acfects feeding into the chamber.

I think.
Always open to learn.

Only going off that picture you posted, if all the failures look like that, I'm not thinking chamber specs. There are other things at play here.

Could be slide speed. Mag feed lips. Frame intolerance. Slide intolerance.

Could be as simple as the extractor not letting the round slide into the breach face.

You could remove the extractor and insert a mag. Rack the slide and see if it chambers easier.

If it does the same thing with out the extractor. Remove the mag from the equation. With extractor installed. Slide locked back, slide a round into the breach under the extractor, rack it and see if it chambers.

Did I say that blue markers were your friend?

Mark up the rounds while doing these experiments.

If you retrieve the rounds after the first experiment and there are 2 lines clearly on the case, it's rubbing really hard against the feed lips trying to get into the chamber.

Second experiment with a blue round should show marks where the chamber is tight on either the case or bullet.

 

[Koda]

I had the issue in the pic in the past. A glock recoil spring fixed my issues. YMMV.

Yes, while ive tested other spring rates unsuccessfully, im using a stock Glock recoils spring assembly for the remainder of troubleshooting this.

 

[Koda]

Only going off that picture you posted, if all the failures look like that, I'm not thinking chamber specs. There are other things at play here.

this pic?


to me thats a very bad chamber.

 

[Member 34319]

this pic?
View attachment 1419021

to me thats a very bad chamber.

That doesn't show headspace though. I don't plunk test on barrels. I use a gauge. This picture shows nothing really. Maybe a mildly unsupported round? Could need a deep cleaning. I don't know really. Could be a tight chamber. It's hard to gauge solely off a barrel plunk.

I was referring to the picture of the firearm malfunctioning. Where it failed to feed. That malfunction in that picture is not a headspace malfunction. A headspace malfunction would show when the action is about 95-98% closed.

What I see in this picture is the round not leaving the mag. Or perhaps not "control feeding" into the breech under the extractor. This picture is NOT showing a chamber issue, in my opinion.

 

[Member 34319]

Buy this. This tells you if your ammo is off, and where.

 

[Koda]

Could be a tight chamber. It's hard to gauge solely off a barrel plunk.

Im also judging by my caliper measurements both the chamber ID and the ammo OD.

But i agree a case gauge would be a good way to check the ammo but the subject Fiocchi ammo fits my Sig barrel fine.

Ill do more checking on these suggestions when I get off work...

 

[Koda]

Although not without a different issue, Its the barrel chamber.

So last week I ordered the cheapest barrel I could find, my logic was if it ran it would prove the Alpha Shooting Sports barrel was indeed bad and Id have a cheap barrel to run while I work with Alphas warranty service. I wasn't certain what to expect from a cheap barrel, I ordered the Swenson brand from Midwayusa. I think its their house brand, not certain....

I plunk tested the "in spec but larger" Fiocchi rounds in the Swenson barrel and they sat flush fine. I measured the Swenson barrel the same and its in saami spec unlike the Alpha barrel. I put it in the slide... super tight fit. Comparing it to the Alpha barrel it seems to measure a few thou larger in most all measurements. Seemed to stick or hang up getting onto the frame and right before into battery. Hand cycling the new barrel for a while seemed to make it smoother. Still a sticky spot at battery I decided to shoot it and see how it runs.

over 110rnds in a row down it no jams. (its the barrel). (compare, it would happen every mag or other mag with the Alpha barrel).

The day was not without a different issue, 3 light strikes and one classic stovepipe. Im not certain if the light strikes is due to barrel fitment or the ammo. I ran 2 brands, CCI blazer brass and Winchester ammo. CCI ammo ran flawless, the light strikes were all the cheap bulk Winchester ammo.... Not certain if its the ammo, or if its a barrel fitment issue as the new Swenson barrel is a little bit rough getting into battery if I slowly hand cycle the slide but how could that be an issue when thats not how the slide works firing.

A mini review of the Swenson barrel... the thing is every bit a tack driver as the Alpha barrel. Fit and finish are rough.

pic of light strike...

 

[RX-79G]

pic of light strike...

A light AND off-center strike. Which in a Glock usually means that gun fired something shy of being fully in battery. Which they can and will do if something is interfering with cycling.

On your bad barrel, did you ever try inserting fired cases of the different brands instead of just new rounds? I would be curious if the chamber is short or if the actual bullet ogive is getting wedged in the lands with the Fiocchi.

 

[Koda]

A light AND off-center strike. Which in a Glock usually means that gun fired something shy of being fully in battery. Which they can and will do if something is interfering with cycling.

On your bad barrel, did you ever try inserting fired cases of the different brands instead of just new rounds? I would be curious if the chamber is short or if the actual bullet ogive is getting wedged in the lands with the Fiocchi.

Yes, only the Fiocchi brand failed the plunk test in the Alpha barrel, and only that barrel. Ill dbl check again tonight, covered a Fiocchi round with a sharpie and the only marks are on the case. Plus, you can measure the headspace with a caliper tail and the Alpha barrel is too short.

I agree with you on the light strike, the new barrel is really tight. Was hoping it would break in on its own but feel there is a tiny bit of fitting needed.... Only problem is I have no idea where or how and cant find anything instructional online, not even a bubbafit job on youtube.

Comparing with the Alpha barrel i think i need to file the new barrels lug ramp where it slides over the front rail block in the frame, or the barrel hood lug maybe.... All a wild guess at the moment.

 

[FourTeeFive]

Another option might be to return both barrels and get a KKM or other premium barrel. Or original Glock.

 

[Member 34319]

Plus, you can measure the headspace with a caliper tail

You can?

Not to keep bugging you, but that is not headspace. That's chamber depth.

You can compare this barrel to barrel, but that is not giving you a headspace reading.

Headspace is from the breach, in a pistol that is the face of the slide that the round rests against, to the neck of the chamber.

That can be difficult to measure without headspace gauges. Also why headspace gauges come in pairs, with one over spec to tell you if your headstone is too long. If it's too short, the go gauge wouldn't fit.

If you have a comparator, you can size a piece of brass with in spec and find a piece of brass out of spec and use them as make shift headspace gauges. You'd need a comparator to see if the cases were with in headspace specs though.

You could get away without the headspace gauge on the comparator to measure your ammo, but it's a lot harder to measure a headspace on the barrel alone without a proper gauge.

 

[Koda]

Not to keep bugging you, but that is not headspace. That's chamber depth.

Noted. Thank you.
Then im measuring chamber depth.... Which is still short.
Im measuring that depth from the part of the barrel that contacts the breech face. Maybe its not a perfect way, but my Alpha barrel is too short and the new Swenson barrel is not.

 

[Koda]

Another option might be to return both barrels and get a KKM or other premium barrel. Or original Glock.

A KKM or similar quality barrel is an option if I can validate I dont need to fit it to the Alpha slide.

One of the reasons for getting the Swenson barrel, if it comes to it i can learn to hand fit it. But im not doing that with a premium barrel.

 

[NeoBlackdog]

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Just kidding, Koda. Hope you get it figured out.

 

[Member 34319]

Noted. Thank you.
Then im measuring chamber depth.... Which is still short.
Im measuring that depth from the part of the barrel that contacts the breech face. Maybe its not a perfect way, but my Alpha barrel is too short and the new Swenson barrel is not.

Barrels differ. The lock up to headspace can actually differ from barrel to barrel and from slide to slide. The hood on the barrel could be oversized or undersized. The slide breach could be oversized or undersized. Lock points could be off.

Just giving you thoughts to look at. Seeing as the 2nd barrel is now having issues.

If you're done with the barrel and have moved on just let me know.

If you're like me and need to know why things fail or don't do what they are supposed to do. I'll keep posting up thoughts.

I recall this being an aftermarket slide? Or frame? Could be lock up points of contact creating poor headspace?!?

 

[Koda]

@Reno keep em coming. I also like to know why things dont work (as id like to build another, these P80s are fun). Its super fun to shoot so im comitted to making it run, correctly.

I dont think some minor fitting is unreasonable for a cheap barrel. Right now thats my guess as to whats needed, i just need to learn how.

 

[Member 34319]

@Reno keep em coming. I also like to know why things dont work (as id like to build another, these P80s are fun). Its super fun to shoot so im comitted to making it run, correctly.

I dont think some minor fitting is unreasonable for a cheap barrel. Right now thats my guess as to whats needed, i just need to learn how.

If you plan on building more I'd highly recommend getting a set of go/no-go gauges.

I used to think ARs were the Lego set of grown up Americans until I had a kaboom due to poor headspaced barrel and bolt combo. I didn't have gauges before the kaboom, the kaboom was the reason I bought a set in 223. It could have been other things, but I'm fairly certain the headspace was off on that barrel or bolt or the combo. I would get all sorts of stuck cases and even a case separation. Which also required a tool purchase I'd never own!

Sure most manufacturers should be to "mil-spec" but that doesn't beat the insurances of having a set of gauges to verify.

These Glock clones are very similar now. They are a set of Legos made by hundreds of different companies. There ain't no "mil-spec" Glock to go off, so specs are likely all over the map. Maybe if someone termed "Glock-spec" things might get better!?!?

Mixing parts can certainly get spicy!

I've seen a lot of headspace issues, frame fitment issues, slide issues, barrel to slide fitment issues, you make it, due to mixed parts Glock builds.

Seeing the type of jam you are having makes me think frame to barrel fitment issues, which could also mean poor headspace. It's really hard to tell without headspace gauges honestly!

 

[Koda]

If you plan on building more I'd highly recommend getting a set of go/no-go gauges.

I used to think ARs were the Lego set of grown up Americans

Can I get away with just buying a go gauge?
I think I agree now with the lego analogy, I was wondering about this with pistol builds.... but ignored this question because it seems like, so-many-people are building custom pistol builds these days I assumed headspace issues were worked out with pistol builds.

Note: I'm still not certain if my new barrel has a headspace issue vs some other fitting issue, still investigating the light strike issue. But I can see how checking and eliminating a headspace question would be part of the fitting process.