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Active shooters in schools: The enemy is denial

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by Kevatc, Apr 14, 2013.

  1. Kevatc

    Kevatc Oregon Well-Known Member

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  2. kumabear17

    kumabear17 Issaquah Active Member

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    I thought it was an excellent article. Thanks. I'll send it to my politicians even though I realize their minds are closed. Persistence is the key to wearing anyone down - I hope.
  3. Misterbill

    Misterbill Yakima County, Washington New Member

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    And no where in that article, unless I missed it, was the notion of letting people who carry every day in all other locations, do the same thing at work, which happens to be a school.

    Look, our federal budget is already in massive deficit. And I don't know about your town, but we've been doing eeverything, including several tax raises, to keep our already small police and sheriff depts from having to lay off cops. There are about 16 public schools in my town. We couldn't get an extra 16 cops to save our lives. If it could be done, we'd already have them...on our streets.

    But there's this notion that ONLY a police officer is "qualified" to use a firearm in self-defense in a public space, even though citizens do it in environments just as crowded and just as chaotic as a school all the time.

    It costs about $70-100k a year for a cop, including salary, overtime, benefits, equipment, the works, depending on the area. You could send every teacher in every school who has a CPL to the Washington Criminal Justice Training Center for a week of firearms training (as good as any cop gets) for about $1,200 a pop plus ammo and per diem.

    You don't have to pay them extra, you don't have to hire extra bodies and the only necessary annual cost is a re-qual and whatever annual training budget you want to have.

    Hell, a membership at a local gun club and free ammo would do for most people!

    But this is somehow crazy. and the numbers the speaker in that article include ALL sources of school violence. an amed cop at the school doesn't stop someone from doing a drive-by of the parking lot or a knifing in the bathroom.


    We're having a freaking debate about spending BILLIONS of dollars to save 48 lives? And whatever you do, you're only going to get a fraction of those prevented or stopped.

    Folks, we lose probably 10 times that number due to traffic accidents on the way TO and FROM that same school.

    I'm sorry, it's a tough world out there.

    Life is not risk-free.

    We make schools more dangerous than they have to be by no-guns policies for teachers and classified personnel. But even then, they are INCREDIBLY SAFE compared to damn near anywhere else.

    If anyone is all-fire-up to spend money, offer free firearms training to teachers. But frankly, we could just take away the gun-free policies and we'd be better off than we are now and it wouldn't cost a dime.
    accessbob, jfw, Norm0931 and 7 others like this.
  4. Bigfoot

    Bigfoot Clack Co. OR Well-Known Member

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    Yes, ostensibly.
  5. accessbob

    accessbob Molalla, OR 2A Supporter

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    Misterbill, you are spot on. And it amazes me how like just yesterday a 9 year old girl was killed here by someone who claims to have been "cleaning his gun" when it went off and striking her as she was outside. The outrage that was there on the news story comments against guns and gun owners was just as scathing as ever. But then the next story was about someone killed when they were hit by a car. And no outrage in the comments. So it really bothers me that they are so focused on a specific type of death and don't care about others, especially when the other causes way more deaths than firearms. And when there is, statistically, a very, very, very low percentage of deaths due to firearms in comparision to other means. Dead is still dead.

    And, it fries my bananas that the anti gunners can't see that we should be educating our kids in schools at all ages of the proper use and care of firearms so that if they some across someone acting in an unsafe manner they can either say so or get the heck out of Dodge. They educate sex but not about something which can kill you, or someone else, faster if not handled properly. Personally, I think the "while cleaning my gun" is a lame excuse and the person was goofing off but at the minimum they were not following the safe rules of firearm handling otherwise someone should not get hit if it does discharge. It makes me extremely irritated every time I hear that excuse.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2013
  6. deen_ad

    deen_ad Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Latest published story is that he was practicing "fast draw" for his upcoming job as a security officer. Practicing "fast draw" with a LOADED weapon?
  7. HahnsXD

    HahnsXD Battle Ground WA Active Member

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    He didn't flat out say it, but I think it was implied

    "Armed citizens can help. Think United 93. Whatever your personal take on gun control, it is all but certain that a killer set on killing is more likely to attack a target where the citizens are unarmed, rather than one where they are likely to encounter an armed citizen response."

    Nobody disagrees with you. But if the anti-gun whiners are going to make such a big deal about school shootings, it's up to us to point to an actual solution.

    And it was also worth noting that school fires haven't killed a single kid in the last 50 years and nobody thinks you're paranoid for having preventive measures in place for fires. Yet having an armed response to violence, something that actually does kill children at school, makes you paranoid.
  8. Kevatc

    Kevatc Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Good post. There was a time I argued against armed teachers. Fortunately, I saw the short comings in that line of thinking. Unfortunately, I don't see armed teachers becoming a common thing anytime soon.