Vista Outdoors to sell ammo business

[saw2]

Hopefully its a slow good transition for the Vista ammo plants here. I also am concerned for the employees as I worked at the same large manufacturing facility for over 40 yrs. In that time there were 5 different owners. Each time with a new owner it got a little bit worse for the employees.

But I know in the early times of my years there employees with lots of experience were treated as assets then slowly over the years and new owners employees with lots of years there and experience were almost treated as liabilities with the amount of vacation and pension benefits they had accrued.

So now with the losses employees have taken new hires don't stay for a long time like in the past. Now when I talk to guys still working there they say the lack of experience is really making a negative difference in production and workers attitudes. But also I do know thats the new cooperate America.

 

[Caveman Jim]

Vista is no better when they fall for the Wokeism to appease the shareholders.
They are added to my list.

 

[Caveman Jim]

Hopefully its a slow good transition for the Vista ammo plants here. I also am concerned for the employees as I worked at the same large manufacturing facility for over 40 yrs. In that time there were 5 different owners. Each time with a new owner it got a little bit worse for the employees.

But I know in the early times of my years there employees with lots of experience were treated as assets then slowly over the years and new owners employees with lots of years there and experience were almost treated as liabilities with the amount of vacation and pension benefits they had accrued.

So now with the losses employees have taken new hires don't stay for a long time like in the past. Now when I talk to guys still working there they say the lack of experience is really making a negative difference in production and workers attitudes. But also I do know thats the new cooperate America.

Bean counters have destroyed once lucrative businesses, loyalty to their workers has long been lost due to the greedy bottom line.

 

[Provincial]

Bean counters have destroyed once lucrative businesses, loyalty to their workers has long been lost due to the greedy bottom line.

The short-term bottom line. This kind of thinking ends up costing the company in ways the bean-counters don't consider. Management, which is also not thinking about the long term, is more concentrated on creating a resume that looks really good, for when they jump to the next job/victim.

 

[saw2]

The short-term bottom line. This kind of thinking ends up costing the company in ways the bean-counters don't consider. Management, which is also not thinking about the long term, is more concentrated on creating a resume that looks really good, for when they jump to the next job/victim.

Fact, well said.

 

[terdog]

What's this now? REI wouldn't carry their products because a shooter used one of their ammo brands?? I musta missed that one.

If true... that sounds to me like REI is the one that needs to go broke.

REI is about as Liberal as can get IMHO. I stopped buying from them decades ago.

 

[terdog]

No mention of it, but I assume that CSG will probably keep the factories here in the USA. I guess we shall see.

I do care about CCI, Speer and Federal - they each make good ammo and CCI/Speer make good reloading components.

And CCI is made in Lewiston Idaho. I like that.

 

[TTSX]

I have a $100 REI gift card and I STILL couldn't stomach the prices, despite being free to me.

Sure hope vista isn't selling because I really like standard velocity CCI .22LR and I'd be super bummed if the recipe got messed with and cheapened

 

[Yarome]

And CCI is made in Lewiston Idaho. I like that.

Yeah.... CCI is gonna break my heart.

I have no doubt they will keep the U.S. factories going. It would make utterly no financial sense to mess with them... but my concern is mainly them shipping in sub par components/alloys, basically turning the US factories in assembly plants of foreign products and hurting the US economy piping all the profits out of the country.

If they did pull up stakes or move the plant... that would put around 2% of the Lewiston population out of a job.

 

[Dungannon]

America has to be the best civilian gun market in the world. For a foreign company to buy up Vista's firearms business looks good to me for two reasons: they are insulated from America's woke crowd, and they're doing this to EXPAND their existing ammunition and defense industry businesses.

 

[Tlock]

Yeah.... CCI is gonna break my heart.

I have no doubt they will keep the U.S. factories going. It would make utterly no financial sense to mess with them... but my concern is mainly them shipping in sub par components/alloys, basically turning the US factories in assembly plants of foreign products and hurting the US economy piping all the profits out of the country.

If they did pull up stakes or move the plant... that would put around 2% of the Lewiston population out of a job.

I go threw 10k rounds a year(at least)of 22 cci in the subsonic 40 gr hp. Guess a should stock up now

 

[Lazyfaire]

I've been boycotting REI since before it was cool to do so - because of their extremely high prices. I went in one once and was appalled at what they were asking. That was probably over 30 years ago.

They have put their stores into high income communities. They are expensive but they're not in my usual store rotation. I did see that they sold their big store up on NW 14th & Lovejoy. Expensive store (rent) I'm sure along with lower sales per sq/ft.

 

[Bobbygun]

I did see that they sold their big store up on NW 14th & Lovejoy. Expensive store (rent) I'm sure along with lower sales per sq/ft.

Rent may have had nothing to do with it. From a KGW news article:

In a letter to members, REI said its Pearl District location saw its highest number of break-ins and thefts in two decades last year, despite adding security.

 

[Alexx1401]

Rent may have had nothing to do with it. From a KGW news article:

In a letter to members, REI said its Pearl District location saw its highest number of break-ins and thefts in two decades last year, despite adding security.

So left policies of allowing crime ran off another one. Sounds like a good one here as its the same people they support who hosed them right out of the area.

 

[Provincial]

The Czech Republic is probably the the best possible place from which purchase of a firearms centered company could have happened. Here is why (from Wikipedia):

Gun laws in the Czech Republic in many respects differ from those in other European Union member states (see Gun laws in the European Union). The "right to acquire, keep and bear firearms" is explicitly recognized in the first Article of the Firearms Act. At the constitutional level, the Charter of Fundamental Rights and Freedoms includes the "right to defend one's own life or life of another person also with arms under conditions stipulated by law".

In the Czech Republic, firearms are available to anyone, subject to acquiring a firearms license. Firearm licenses may be obtained in a way similar to a driving license; by passing a proficiency exam, medical examination and having a clean criminal record. Unlike in most other European countries, Czech firearms legislation also permits citizens to carry concealed weapons for self-defense; 252,245 out of 308,990 gun license holders have a concealed carry permit (31 December 2021).[4] The most common reason for firearm possession by Czech gun owners is for protection, with hunting and sport shooting being less common.[5] Additionally, people can join government endorsed advanced shooting training courses with their privately owned firearms and become civilian reservist.[6]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_law_in_the_Czech_Republic

And I should add Czech companies like CZ and BRNO.

 

[gmerkt]

they're doing damage control like Dick's Sporting Goods, getting rid of all gun related business.

I didn't have this thought. More like it was a reduction of risk appetite. There is potential liability is making something like ammunition.

It does seem surprising that they'd sell this side of the business off, what with only recently taking on Remington ammunition. But maybe that was just a flip job.

Another thing to think about. It's possible that ammo won't always be in high demand. Changes in US law could cause a significant reduction in demand; they may be looking farther into the future than most of us are. Example, what if mail order sales were banned federally? That would cut into the ammo business. Or some kind of gun ban might do it. Another facet of risk reduction.

It's not a good thing for many similar enterprises to keep getting folded into larger and larger units. Bigger doesn't necessarily mean better. Because often these mergers and acquisitions are just raids on the piggy bank, setting up the resulting firm for failure. "Too big to fail" has become a joke. Federal, Remington, CCI, and Speer, these are all major players in ammo and components. The legacy Remington firm was a big outfit too, until it wasn't.

We don't like to see "American" enterprises sold off to foreign buyers. In this case, however, it's just my instinct that being bought by a Czech company already in a similar established line of business might be a good thing. As opposed to being sold to some American capital management firm. Whose only interest is to squeeze the most juice out of the lemon, then take a powder. I see it as more likely than not CSG is interested in making money by making things, rather than making fast money by destroying existing companies.

 

[Longwalkhome]

Kinda odd, we have two wars we are involved in yet about 70% of our small arms ammunition companies are being sold to one foreign actor. Winchester lake city is government run and supply 30% so with the government shutting down commercial sales by Winchester it becomes in the hands of one man if we get ammo during war time.

 

[whiskeybill]

CZ Group purchased Colt Firearms in it's entirety in February 2021. Colt was purchased in part so CZ would be able to fulfill possible US Government contracts because of a "Made in America" clause. When Beretta won the contract for the M9, they had to build a plant in the states, they decided on Tennessee.

 

[Caveman Jim]

I didn't have this thought. More like it was a reduction of risk appetite. There is potential liability is making something like ammunition.

It does seem surprising that they'd sell this side of the business off, what with only recently taking on Remington ammunition. But maybe that was just a flip job.

Another thing to think about. It's possible that ammo won't always be in high demand. Changes in US law could cause a significant reduction in demand; they may be looking farther into the future than most of us are. Example, what if mail order sales were banned federally? That would cut into the ammo business. Or some kind of gun ban might do it. Another facet of risk reduction.

It's not a good thing for many similar enterprises to keep getting folded into larger and larger units. Bigger doesn't necessarily mean better. Because often these mergers and acquisitions are just raids on the piggy bank, setting up the resulting firm for failure. "Too big to fail" has become a joke. Federal, Remington, CCI, and Speer, these are all major players in ammo and components. The legacy Remington firm was a big outfit too, until it wasn't.

We don't like to see "American" enterprises sold off to foreign buyers. In this case, however, it's just my instinct that being bought by a Czech company already in a similar established line of business might be a good thing. As opposed to being sold to some American capital management firm. Whose only interest is to squeeze the most juice out of the lemon, then take a powder. I see it as more likely than not CSG is interested in making money by making things, rather than making fast money by destroying existing companies.

Opinions vary.

 

[Mono1]

REI is the epitome of WOKE. Since 2018 I have not graced their doors. I only bought 2 pair of sun gloves before that, they were the only store that sold them locally.

I have bought exactly ZERO from them since T=0.

They don't carry Guns far as I can see. WMT now the same.