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Say you do have to defend your life...

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by Vaultman, Jul 23, 2011.

  1. Vaultman

    Vaultman Clackamas Co, Oregon Active Member

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    I have been thinking about this today... Say you are by yourself in a non populated area (maybe on a bike path, in a park...) and someone attacks you and you have to use deadly force. The attacker is knocked down, either dead or wounded (shot by you) and you have your cell phone... who do you call AND what do you say?

    I assume the answer to part one is the police or ambulance, but what do you say? Anyone ever thought through this, or asked a law expert???
     
  2. ta2er

    ta2er Oregon Member

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    Unless you did something wrong, I would assume you say exactly what happened to the letter. If you DID do something wrong, I guess make sure they're EXTRA dead so there's only 1 story to tell....
     
  3. Stomper

    Stomper Oceania Rising White Is The New Brown Silver Supporter

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    +1
     
  4. Teufel_Hunden

    Teufel_Hunden Albany, Oregon Active Member

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    They WOULD'NT be wounded!
     
  5. pchewn

    pchewn Beaverton Oregon USA Well-Known Member

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    Dial 911

    Ask for ambulance/medical help for the wounded/dead (you cannot declare him dead, only a doctor can). That's all. You don't need to make excessive statements about what lead to the person being injured.
     
  6. Redcap

    Redcap Lewis County, WA Well-Known Member

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    I may or may not call and say something.
     
  7. Asp

    Asp Oregon, the promise land. Active Member

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    I would ask for a Pepsi and a Snickers.

    Of course realistically this would be after I had dialed 911 for the police and EMTs, demanding their presence.
    If possible I would like to never experience anything like this, but like most days I have no idea what the future is going to bring.
     
  8. Vaultman

    Vaultman Clackamas Co, Oregon Active Member

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    That is what I would like to think I would do. But I have called 911 before and they do ask a lot of questions, and I wasn't sure what I would say. But I think this is probably the best approach.
     
  9. ta2er

    ta2er Oregon Member

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    Even if the 911 dispatcher doesn't ask any questions at all, the police who arrive on scene sure as heck will. Best to have all your ducks in their proverbial row.
     
  10. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Go watch this video right now and do not talk to the police.
    Call your lawyer first,let HIM call 911 He won't be full of adrenaline and tell the cops whatever they want to hear
    Like most of us would


    ‪Dont Talk to Police‬‏ - YouTube
     
  11. Thebastidge

    Thebastidge 10411 NE Fourth Plain Blvd Vancouver WA 98662 Well-Known Member

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    What MJBSKWIM said:

    Ask for an ambulance, and tell them a person has been shot. If there's is further risk to you, let them know that you believe there may be further attackers in the area. Then shut up.

    Do NOT answer any questions the dispatcher may ask: anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. On the other hand, nothing you say to a police officer can be used for exculpatory evidence by the defense.

    The more detail you give, the more likely it will be used against you. You will be in shock, confused, and scared. Do not say anything that may in fact be inaccurate or subject to misinterpretation. Don't say anything that is untrue. Don't say anything at all.

    Call your lawyer before the cops arrive, if you can. If the cops "need a statement" let them know you will give a statement when you are "feeling capable" and call your lawyer to draft your statement.
     
  12. Thebastidge

    Thebastidge 10411 NE Fourth Plain Blvd Vancouver WA 98662 Well-Known Member

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    "Unless you did something wrong, I would assume you say exactly what happened to the letter. If you DID do something wrong, I guess make sure they're EXTRA dead so there's only 1 story to tell.... "

    This second sentence is precisely the sort of thing a prosecutor would use to hang you.

    Take the high road and the honourable path. Don't encourage anyone to do anything illegal or unethical. As gun owners we should be above reproach in our attitude towards interpersonal violence and self defense issues.
     
    HollisOR, blindfox, mjbskwim and 3 others like this.
  13. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Give an address and hang up.
    You gotta listen to how the cop made some guys admit to breaking into a house.They learn how to ask questions to get convicting answers.No convictions mean their numbers are down ,what have they been doing?
    Remember,the cops are on the prosecutor's side.They are working with him to convict someone,anyone for this shooting.
     
  14. Asp

    Asp Oregon, the promise land. Active Member

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    +1
    But for myself I would add that if I were to use lethal force I would have to genuinely believe from fear that my life was going to end or I was seriously going to be injured or maimed, or someone else.

    While it's not totally on topic, I think the problem today with the anti-gun community is that they think that everyone who uses lethal force are just numb towards feelings altogether. It's not okay for them to paint us as uncaring, sociopathic people.

    Everything (ideally) is on a case by case basis.
    And as always there are exceptions.
     
    Thebastidge and (deleted member) like this.
  15. 22many

    22many PNW Well-Known Member

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    I don't agree with not talking to the police. I have nothing to hide but if I sense one bit of the police trying to coerce me into anything then that when I would stop all communication.
     
  16. Ben Beckerich

    Ben Beckerich NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    you can't call your freaken lawyer when somebody is lying in front of you bleeding by your hand- you call 911.

    now i'm 100% opposed to putting yourself at risk for legal considerations- chosing less effective and less "scary" loads/calibers/weapons because you think they'll make you MORE liable, etc. but calling your lawyer before you call for medical assistance just plain stoopid- do you have any idea how that's going to look during the civil trial? they're gonna wipe the floor with you. besides- human life is more important than far-fetched legal theory.

    just freaken call 911, then call your lawyer, and if the cops get there before your lawyer does, calmly tell them you were in fear for your life, and that you don't want to say anything else till your lawyer arrives shortly. that's the smartest way to handle it, and any halfway decent cop will respect that.
     
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  17. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    You might want to check that fact since it is not a fact. I know lots of people that can declare someone dead, I do it quite often and I dont have Dr anywhere near my name.
     
  18. Vaultman

    Vaultman Clackamas Co, Oregon Active Member

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    I have seen this video before and it is probably a portion of what got me thinking about this issue.

    And the BOLD part above is what got me really thinking. Seems like that would look so bad in any trial.

    So my follow up question is... How many of you have a lawyer in place, that you have a business relationship with for his type of thing? We (gun owners) talk about "call your lawyer" but if you don't have one in place it doesn't help.
     
  19. darkminstrel

    darkminstrel PDX Well-Known Member

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    To 911; A person has been shot (rattle off address)

    To lawyer; I just shot someone in self defense, the police are on their way (rattle off address and ask advice)

    To police; Officer, I want that (man/woman) arrested! My lawyer is (on the way/on the phone) and will give you all the relevant details.
     
  20. Thebastidge

    Thebastidge 10411 NE Fourth Plain Blvd Vancouver WA 98662 Well-Known Member

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    Any lawyer will tell you not to talk to the police. It CANNOT help you legally. You are presumed innocent until proven guilty. The right to remain silent is important it was enshrined in the constitution. The probability of mis-speaking under the stress of the situation is too great to risk it when the outcome could put you in prison for the rest of your life.