Safe Questions....

Stinkerbelle · May 25, 2010

I'm not sure if this is the right forum, but anyway.....

I'm trying to decide what safe to buy and would like some input. I'm thinking that any decent quality safe is going to deter most of your casual (re: crack head) burglers and that I should be more worried about fire rating than security, as long as I have a basic level. Is that a legitimate opinion? I've seen the video where the two guys pry open a safe in something like 2 minutes, so maybe I should be more worried about it. What are your thoughts?

Has anyone ever had their safe broken into?

Has anyone had their home burglarized, but their safe was intact with no attempted entry?

Has anyone had thieves attempt to open their safe and not succeed?

On the fire issue, what experience has anyone had with their safes surviving (or not) a fire? I plan to put any important papers in another small fire safe, inside the big safe. But as far as the guns go, how safe are they?

Thanks for any help you can shed on this issue. I want to be sure I buy something with enough quality to protect my collection, but I don't want to spend any more than I have too, since I could use that extra money to buy more guns....

unionguy · May 25, 2010

lots of good info out there, just google your questions.

I don't have personal experience to help you.

I bought a mid-level safe to deter quick grab and go burglars but have no illusions about a dtermined effort. Mine has 30 min fire rating, I think it works if the firefighters get it out quickly, otherwise i'm sol.

you get what you pay for in safes, so it depends a lot on your collections value, mine isn;t that big.

TonsOfOregonBrass · May 25, 2010

unionguy said:
you get what you pay for in safes, so it depends a lot on your collections value

Sorry i cannot help you more then that though. There is a lot of info on the google machine to help you decide. I went as big as my flooring would support. But my collection keeps growing. And you can never have too big of a safe.

alfack · May 25, 2010

You have to define what your budget is, first. I did a bunch of research, before I bought mine, and I ended up with an Amsec BF series. I had it boiled down to either Amsec or Sturdy. These two run ~$2000, give or take. Of course they make much more expensive safes like Graffunder, which are very tough, big and hard to get into. They run ~5 times as much though. I think Costco sells a halfway decent one for around $800, but can't remember the brand. It is a hard thing to make up your mind about. "Hmm.. For the price of this safe, I can buy 2 or 3 decent weapons." I think it is worth it in the long run.

Natty Bumpo · May 25, 2010

You might check out the info provided in this link:

http://www.6mmbr.com/gunsafes.html

TOVO · May 25, 2010

No matter what safe you get make sure that it can bolt to the ground. When I had mine delivered the safe company (Liberty) the delivery guy told me in the last six months they replaced 3 gun safe to them being completely stolen. He commented they were very large heavy safes. Whomever stole the first one put thousands of golf balls on the ground and tipped the safe over to roll it out. The second was tipped over onto crushed ice and pushed out. He could of be telling me a load of crap but its seems like this could work.

On a second note I have heard or read that keeping a gun safe in your garage is not considered to be a secure location by Insurance Companies. I would check with your agent before you place you safe in the garage. Good luck

madcratebuilder · May 26, 2010

I've been looking for a third safe, something that can hold thirty or more rifles. Prices have been 2-10K, I talked to a guy at the last gunshow I attended, he's out of K-falls. He sells a line of fire rated safes that are imported as are most of them. His pricing is substantially better than any other I have looked at. $1500 buys a huge safe with the average fire rates and choice of locks. He offer a wood cabinet that covers it and makes it look like a piece of furniture. They don't have their web site up yet and I can't recall the business name, but he attends all the gunshows. I'm buying from him.

Spitpatch · May 26, 2010

I'm trying to resist buying a 5th safe. They seem to fill up with guns.

Having said that, a metal box with a lock on it is a metal box with a lock on it. If bad guys know your guns are in a metal box with a a lock on it, they will come prepared to deal with a metal box with a lock on it. (Cutoff saw, torch, etc.)

Any claims by safe companies that "our locking lugs are blah blah hardened, and our combination has blah blah thickness of anti-drill plate" don't mean a hill of beans to a guy with a cutoff saw or a torch.

Your gun safe of even moderate quality will do exactly what the gunsafe of "high quality" will do. It will save your guns from the unprepared thief, and slow down (slightly) the prepared thief.

As for fire protection, most safes offering "fire protection" merely hang drywall on the interior. To get true fire protection requires much more, and you will pay much more. Check the manufacturers ratings: if they say its a fire safe, they have to post its ratings under a given temp and how long contents are protected at that temp.

Stinkerbelle · May 26, 2010

I agree totally with your quote (though I dont know how to make it show up here like other posters do.

)...

"Your gun safe of even moderate quality will do exactly what the gunsafe of "high quality" will do. It will save your guns from the unprepared thief, and slow down (slightly) the prepared thief."

With the sides being only 7 to 12 gauge material, a determined thief should be able to get in with a little bit of effort. What I'm really wondering is, has anyone on here ever had their safe broken into? My home is in a nice little neighborhood, but nothing special. It's not full of high dollar items. Theres really nothing to attract a prepared thief. I can't imagine anyone targeting me and coming prepared to spend that kind of time. Even my gun collection isnt worth that much. Im mostly trying to protect some sentimental items, guns that were gifts or hand me downs that have special meaning to me. I think I am probably more susceptible to the typical smash and run kind of burglary and think I probably should be more concerned with the fire rating.

Ive read a lot about safes and what to look for as there is a wealth of information out there. Im not really sure I am gaining anything by spending another $2000 to get the 7 gauge side and back walls over the 10 or 12 gauge. Mostly, I just wanted to know what the real world (NWFA people) experiences have been. Thanks for your input.

madcratebuilder · May 27, 2010

110 volt plasma cutters, no safe is safe. If someone knows you have guns and wants them bad enough they well get them.

longcolt · May 30, 2010

madcratebuilder said:
110 volt plasma cutters, no safe is safe. If someone knows you have guns and wants them bad enough they well get them.

I suppose, but most professional thieves, I assume would go after stuff that is a lot more valuable than a small gun collection. No real money there unless you have an old Winchester collection or something of real value.

If you are a pro using high end cutters and tools why not hit a place that has jewelry, cash, pharmaceuticals, etc.

The safe should work fine against the average teen meth heads that are in and out of your place in minutes.

A comment about a gun safe in the garage. I had a friend that had his safe bolted to the concrete floor of his garage. When he passed on and we sold off his gun collection, it was difficult getting that safe out of the garage to sell. So if its in the garage and bolted to the floor you are in great shape, in my opinion, provided you have a quality safe.

TyPercy · Jun 1, 2010

The lesson I learned is that a 10 gun safe won't hold 10 guns. After I put ammo in there and a couple of pistols in cases, I have room for 3 rifles. I seriously under-estimated the size safe I would need. Good luck!

cobra150 · Jun 15, 2010

Most of the problems I have encountered with my safes have been getting into them and my own use. Liberty uses S&G Electronic locks, these are a POS lock at any price!!! They use a motor and plastic bolt lift gear which will strip and leave you screwed. I have total faith in Amsec locks. Get a safe with mechanical lock or which uses an electromagnet as bolt lift! The things in your safe mean nothing if YOU lose access when you need it.

Just adding this post as the day to day use is what will separate a good safe from the others. As you can tell I am not a Liberty Safe fan. Overpriced. Would never buy another.