Reloading .357 Magnum 158gr XTP H110 (Richard Lee Second Edition)

[JRuby]

One thing to consider is that some manufacturers may have access to powder that you dont. I use H110 or Winchester 296 - the same powder different branding. Unless I can find a posted load I am very reluctant to exceed the cartridge loads I find in the books. Over the years the loads have become more conservative and are a bit more mild. I have load books that go back 50 years and they reflect this - the question becomes how close is the powder to what it was 50 years ago - I dont know. Another consideration is the availability of chronographs that were scare in the past. I have to believe we know more about are rounds today than they did back then. I shoot a model 28 highway patrolman - so its plenty strong I just dont feel the need to push it hard.

 

[Cerberus Group]

Is there a reason you want to push the bullet that fast?

 

[iron_road]

Is there a reason you want to push the bullet that fast?

To bridge the gap between a pistol caliber carbine and it's pistol counterpart. Looking to hit hard and penetrate deep. Had I known my book bases their loading data off of Hodgdon's data which uses a 10 inch barrel instead of a 4 inch barrel that I assumed it used much like Minuteman Ammo (Sporting Systems) advertises in their ammo catalogue I would have been impressed rather than disappointed after chrono graphing my handloads.

For example Minuteman has a 125gr and 158gr load traveling at 1600 and 1500 feet per sec respectively, giving the 125gr load a muzzle energy of 710 foot pounds and the 158gr muzzle energy of 592 foot pounds. In contrast my hand loads are around 1158 feet per second hitting around 470 energy foot pounds at the muzzle. No doubt that is a lot, but personally anything below 500 energy foot pounds my preferred threshold. For crying out loud there is factory Underwood 9mm ammo that hits just as hard as that. Had I done my research on what the Richard Lee 2nd edition bases their loads off of. I probably would have opted for a different book.

I know it seems like I am asking bit much of my 686 considering its barrel length and the cylinder gap on all revolvers and just begging for a catastrophic failure. And I don't. I just don't want a slow, but accurate hand load (which has been my experience thus far) or a fast but a wildly inaccurate load (which has been my experience with commercial loads) I want a fast and accurate load which I know is obtainable as I've seen the old timers handload and do so with consistent results.

 

[Cerberus Group]

First off, the 686 won't take a steady diet of that type of load before it implodes itself. Meaning it will have timing problems, cylinder gap will come out of spec, end shake etc.

The Model 19 and 586/686 weren't made heavy enough for high pressure rounds. The model 27 and 28 N frames will take that easily.

Contrary to popular belief, one doesn't have to load the 357 to Mach 25 to get top performance.

I agree, you want penetration over expansion...but if you can get both...time to celebrate.

I run my 357 158gr XTP loads at 950 out of a 3" Python, and still get 20" of penetration in a calibrated gel block, and get expansion as well.

Model 19s and 686s love the load, so will your hand...not abusive to neither gun nor anatomical feature.

 

[orygun]

So I have been reloading for sometime now, still new to it. I have a Lee single stage press and RCBS carbide dies. I recently made a batch of reloads and this being my 3rd or so try I am still not getting nearly close the advertised velocity of 1591 feet per second for my 16.7 grains of H110 powder. Is there anything I could be doing wrong? Maybe case length is too long or cylinder gap is causing a high velocity drop? My current five shot average velocity is 1158.4 feet per second right now. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

The very first lesson reloading taught me was, those numbers (fps) in the book are nearly unattainable with a revolver. The only one I had which was close had a barrel 10.5" long! No kidding.
I had a 686+ 4" and chronoed some "top end" loads that I made. Some were Blue Dot, some H110. What I learned there was, 1200 is safe, 1300 is probably too hot!
Go purchase some healthy 158gr jacketed factory ammo and chrono it. See how close you are to that before thinking your ammo sucks.

I just looked in my Hornady manual. S&W 8 3/8" revolver, 16.5gr H110, 1250 fps. That seems like a reasonable number to work off of.

 

[Certaindeaf]

The very first lesson reloading taught me was, those numbers (fps) in the book are nearly unattainable with a revolver. The only one I had which was close had a barrel 10.5" long! No kidding.
I had a 686+ 4" and chronoed some "top end" loads that I made. Some were Blue Dot, some H110. What I learned there was, 1200 is safe, 1300 is probably too hot!
Go purchase some healthy 158gr jacketed factory ammo and chrono it. See how close you are to that before thinking your ammo sucks.

I just looked in my Hornady manual. S&W 8 3/8" revolver, 16.5gr H110, 1250 fps. That seems like a reasonable number to work off of.

Yea, the touted 1600fps /158gr out of a 4" you don't even want to go there.

 

[solv3nt]

H110 is a very slow burning powder. By no means am I recommending loading beyond max, but I'd be very surprised if you could blow up a gun with H110 due to the burn rate. Even with the 7.5" Super Blackhawk, there was still a considerable ball of fire at the end of the barrel from unburnt powder.

Don't exceed published loads, but also don't go below recommended with the H110 or W296.

 

[Certaindeaf]

H110 is a very slow burning powder. By no means am I recommending loading beyond max, but I'd be very surprised if you could blow up a gun with H110 due to the burn rate. Even with the 7.5" Super Blackhawk, there was still a considerable ball of fire at the end of the barrel from unburnt powder.

Don't exceed published loads, but also don't go below recommended with the H110 or W296.

It depends on the gun. Ruger Only loads aren't for lesser guns.

 

[oremike]

On a side note the Bain and Davis gun shop back in the day decided to make the 1600 FPS 158gr "factory"'' load. The did it by necking down a 44 Mag case.

Reloading Data .357-44 Bain & Davis - Pistol (Hodgdon Data) Metallic

.357-44 Bain & Davis - Pistol (Hodgdon Data) reloading data with 20 loads. Using bullets from Hornady Jacketed Hollow Point, Sierra Jacketed Soft Point, Speer Jacketed Hollow Point, Nosler SP, Hornady XTP. Powders include Hodgdon

loaddata.com

 

[iron_road]

Yea, the touted 1600fps /158gr out of a 4" you don't even want to go there.

It appears I was referencing minuteman ammo's load data on website their website wrong. See attached.

 

[JRuby]

Wonder how well those shoot when it is a hundred degrees out with humidity in the 90s.

 

[orygun]

Don't exceed published loads, but also don't go below recommended with the H110 or W296.

I had some 41 Mag loads that were slightly under book Max that were probably too warm. However, the case was pretty full and I agree it would be a hard to overcharge too much.
BUT! The second part of the quoted sentence is super important. WW296 and H110 are likely to cause a KaBoom if loaded below minimum. These are not the powders for "soft" shooting ammo.