How much rifle crimp?

[Koda]

Notes: Im crimping in a separate operation for now using my 30-30 Redding seating die and following their instructions for a taper crimp.

Its pretty straight forward except, how little can you go to assure a good crimp in a lever gun tubular magazine?


Heres a pic, one on the left is crimped pretty good, one on the right is not crimped at all. Both have the same seating depth.

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[Member 34319]

Pull the bullets via a puller and you will know shortly how much crimp.

 

[Koda]

Pull the bullets via a puller and you will know shortly how much crimp.

IOW we dont really need much crimp at all?

 

[ma96782]

IMHO (and a simple rule for me is)......
Tube magazine. So.....
If you're getting "telescoping".......
You're NOT doing it right.

Aloha, Mark

PS.....test it. It's NOT only about loading through the loading gate and/or filling the magazine to "full capacity". Recoil.....also plays with the success or failure.

Some people will just push the bullet tip against the table.

You can be the Judge of .........How much is too much?

A bullet with a cannelure (or without one) and crimping into the cannelure (or not) will also throw another factor into your equation. BTW....crimping "so hard" as to deform the bullet. Well, that is also NOT looked upon as accuracy-inducing either.

 

[fredoesway]

Notes: Im crimping in a separate operation for now using my 30-30 Redding seating die and following their instructions for a taper crimp.

Its pretty straight forward except, how little can you go to assure a good crimp in a lever gun tubular magazine?


Heres a pic, one on the left is crimped pretty good, one on the right is not crimped at all. Both have the same seating depth.
View attachment 1248768

looks like a good crimp to me.

 

[fredoesway]

too much crimp is when you collapse the case shoulder. really your crimp looks good enough but a little less would still probably work fine.

 

[Koda]

IMHO (and a simple rule for me is)......
Tube magazine. So.....
If you're getting "telescoping".......
You're NOT doing it right.

Aloha, Mark

PS.....test it. It's NOT only about loading through the loading gate and/or filling the magazine to "full capacity". Recoil.....also plays with the success or failure.

Some people will just push the bullet tip against the table.

You can be the Judge of .........How much is too much?

A bullet with a cannelure (or without one) and crimping into the cannelure (or not) will also throw another factor into your equation. BTW....crimping "so hard" as to deform the bullet. Well, that is also NOT looked upon as accuracy-inducing either.

I think then I will back off just a tad next time I reload a batch. It doesnt take much of a turn on the die to go from nothing to a lot it seems. Im aware of recoil and will test as I go as long as I dont measure any setback Im good but would rather be on the lighter side of a crimp, I think...

 

[Going Tits Up]

A heavy crimp or too much will increase pressures, if your load is borderline too hot bad things can happen , max loads in hot weather too. Careful….

 

[Koda]

A heavy crimp or too much will increase pressures, if your load is borderline too hot bad things can happen , max loads in hot weather too. Careful….

Yup, Im working up from the very bottom for this reason. Starting at min. I will also chronograph any summer load this winter to see any velocity or POI difference.
I always figured it was safer to work up a load in summer for this reason?

 

[arakboss]

A heavy crimp or too much will increase pressures, if your load is borderline too hot bad things can happen , max loads in hot weather too. Careful….

I always wondered if a heavy crimp could be used to raise pressure in loads where too slow of powder is being used in a cartridge. That could be combined with seating bullet into the lands.

 

[Member 34319]

IOW we dont really need much crimp at all?

Pretty much. 30-30 has a long neck and lots of bullet contact. Unless your sizing ball is wildly off or you are doing something horribly wrong, it's not entirely needed.

 

[po18guy]

Load 3-4 dummy rounds with differing crimps. Run them through the lever action a few times for some real-time function testing. For best brass life, use the least crimp that works. For max everything else toss a medium-heavy crimp on it, knowing that case life will be shortened.

The tubular mag is the only issue. A lot of bench rest shooters seat their bullets using finger pressure.

 

[DizzyJ]

Measure OAL of each cartridge and write it in sharpie on the side of the case. Then cycle the rounds and measure again to see if you have any movement.

Also do this with the remaining cartridges in the tube after firing a few.

How much neck tension do you have?

 

[Koda]

Pretty much. 30-30 has a long neck and lots of bullet contact. Unless your sizing ball is wildly off or you are doing something horribly wrong, it's not entirely needed.

I will experiment with this, thank you.

 

[Koda]

Measure OAL of each cartridge and write it in sharpie on the side of the case. Then cycle the rounds and measure again to see if you have any movement.

Also do this with the remaining cartridges in the tube after firing a few.

How much neck tension do you have?

I will check for setback, as for neck tension.... I have no idea how to check that or what to do with that information...?

 

[DizzyJ]

I will check for setback, as for neck tension.... I have no idea how to check that or what to do with that information...?

Measure the OD of the neck of the sized case. Then measure the OD of the neck after the bullet has been seated. The difference is your neck tension. .0025" - .003" is usually plenty to hold a bullet firmly in place.

 

[Koda]

Measure the OD of the neck of the sized case. Then measure the OD of the neck after the bullet has been seated. The difference is your neck tension. .0025" - .003" is usually plenty to hold a bullet firmly in place.

I will definitely do this next load session. I have a feeling I dont need to crimp or just barely which is good. Id rather not crimp at all if I can get away with it.

 

[P7M13]

For almost all bottle neck cases, a properly sized neck ID should provide ample neck tension, giving more than enough grip when the bullet is seated.
I crimp AR rounds such as 223 / 7-08 / 308 and 300 Savage because the autoloading mechanism and feed ramps is pretty violent in my guns that shoot those calibers.

 

[amusicman2]

What my 30-30 look like. Haven't had any issues with them.

 

[Mikej]

I don't understand, why the question? Everything I've read about loading, .30-30 specifically, for a lever, tube fed rifle, says roll crimp. It was really easy. Not that expensive, and smooth as, well, stuff through a goose.
You would likely have enough neck tension with a taper crimp, but that's not recommended unless you were shooting in a bolt gun. And unless your trim lengths are real close crimp won't be uniform.

https://www.amazon.com/LEE-PRECISION-Factory-Crimp-Die/dp/B000NOSGWW

Less that $20.00 with Prime. And at your door in a couple of days.