guns in employer parking lots law....

[The B]

I'm totally OK with employers prohibiting people from having guns on their property. I'm also totally OK with people ignoring their employer's prohibition. I'm also totally OK with employers demanding to search their employees vehicles. I'm also totally OK with employees telling their employers to bubblegum off, and driving away unsearched.

God bless freedom.

 

[billyinfinity]

I ban firearms from my company property in my employee handbook. I carry everyday. I simply wrote it in to keep insurance premiums lower. If something should happen on property involving firearms, insurance likely won't cover it since they're not allowed on property, as stated in the employee handbook. Oh well. I guess we'll eat the cost if it happens. I imagine there's a number of companies out there just like us.

 

[etrain16]

What's getting lost here is the fact that in Portland, the courts have ruled that YOUR PERSONAL CAR is a public place. As long as laws like that are on the books, we're still a step behind...

As I recall, it was not just Portland, but the Multnomah County Commission that declared vehicles to be "public places". That means, when I'm in Multnomah County, my private car is a "public place", at least with respect to their backwards rules on firearms. Thankfully my employer has no stated exclusion for possession of a concealed firearm, and I know there are more than a few who do carry.

Unfortunately such "laws" are often easily adopted do to the foolishness, ignorance and apathy of Joe and Jane Public.

 

[Ratfink]

You need to update your thinking. The laws changed with regards to National Parks

Visitors may possess firearms within a national park unit provided they comply with federal, state, and local laws.

http://www.nps.gov/gate/learn/management/firearms-in-national-parks.htm

I was speaking "past-tense"which was evident in the "Couldn't" verses "Can't" ..but thanks

 

[Deebow]

What's getting lost here is the fact that in Portland, the courts have ruled that YOUR PERSONAL CAR is a public place. As long as laws like that are on the books, we're still a step behind...

Yeah, they can try that, but it ain't gonna work out so good for them.

I am not asking for a "by your leave" from my employer. I don't need a law to carry my gun in my car when I pull up to my job and park.

If I was concerned about it, I wouldn't keep it in my car. I would get a deep cover holster that works for NPEs (Non-Permissive environments) and keep it on my person.

It is a whole new ball game when the employer wants to search your person.

 

[Ratfink]

I don't think an employer would/should ask you to give-up your 4th amendment rights by engaging in their employment. At least I would hope not. I know work is hard to find but I think I would look elsewhere if they did. I think they might have a tough-time under scrutiny of a judge for "wrongful termination" if push came to shove...but then, I'm not a civil attorney nor do I pretend to be...

 

[scrandall01215]

I'd support a law like that. My vehicle is my property, If Im honoring their damn in house anti firearm policy the least they can do is allow you to store it in your effing vehicle.. Again.. "If" you follow their policy and are playing by their rules.

This is how my employer is handling it came to work one day and there's all these no poss. Of firearms allowed signs at the gates and all door entrances. Of coarse all us concealed carriers were complaining and they said as long as you store it in your vehicle nothing will be said.
( I think they said this after talking with there corp. legal dept ) Not that a sign has stopped anyone anyway!!
Stacy

 

[Riot]

If the employer, ie. Boeing, owns the property, they can legally prohibit activities on their properties. Doesn't matter that a base is federal.

So the company should have the right to segregate? Search you and your vehicle?

Lets bring up the difference between a military base and Boeing, shall we?

You pull up to a gate at Ft. Lewis...you are directed to the far right to be searched. You cannot refuse, you are hereby detained until further and if you attempt to leave you will be treated as a potential hostile. If you still leave, military police will pull you over and detain you, search you and your vehicle, and you'll be interviewed as to why you refused the directives.

Boeing (not on the airport, mind you), you can do whatever you want against their policies. Even if they call the cops the most they can do is terminate you and trespass you (charge you if you return).

If you bring a gun on a military base, you can be charged with a crime...if you bring a gun in Boeing you'll probably be fired.

True, Boeing has the right to ban whatever the heck it wants on their property...drugs, tobacco, alcohol, weapons...but they don't have the right to waive your 4th Amendment rights to unwarranted search and seizure. They can't search you or your car without your consent...they can't even call a cop to come down and do it, either.

What I find humorous is when companies try to pre-charge you with a crime. That after you sign an agreement, if you fail to adhere to said agreement- then you will be charged with criminal trespassing. That's like saying you'll be charged with drug possession if you pee in a cup and it's positive for drugs

 

[WasrNwarpaint]

As I recall, it was not just Portland, but the Multnomah County Commission that declared vehicles to be "public places".


If a car is a public place in Portland , couldnt the unscrupulous that cause lets say.... hit a run,.....claim, "I wasnt driving who the heck knows its a public place"
or how could one be charge with breaking & entering or grand theft, ITS PUBLIC
I realize no one would buy these scenarios but just the same just shows how retarded our political representatives are

 

[etrain16]

So the company should have the right to segregate? Search you and your vehicle?

True, Boeing has the right to ban whatever the heck it wants on their property...drugs, tobacco, alcohol, weapons...but they don't have the right to waive your 4th Amendment rights to unwarranted search and seizure. They can't search you or your car without your consent...they can't even call a cop to come down and do it, either.

One other consideration, at least for some of us, are those that drive a company vehicle, which I do. It's the company's property, not my own, so I think in that case you really have have no say about a search. The one possibly exception may be something like a backpack or lock box that is your own personal property.

I don't know how many companies actually do searches, I know I've never seen it happen with any employer I've worked for. Even back when I worked in retail, if they suspected an employee of theft, I never saw a personal vehicle get searched, even when they were being taken away by the police.

 

[Riot]

As I recall, it was not just Portland, but the Multnomah County Commission that declared vehicles to be "public places".


If a car is a public place in Portland , couldnt the unscrupulous that cause lets say.... hit a run,.....claim, "I wasnt driving who the heck knows its a public place"
or how could one be charge with breaking & entering or grand theft, ITS PUBLIC
I realize no one would buy these scenarios but just the same just shows how retarded our political representatives are

Does that include mobile homes? How about a single-wide still on wheels?



Vehicles have been essentially ruled "public" for a while...but only while actually on the road...otherwise they fall under the same restrictions of the 4th Amendment (needing warrant or cause to search). This was mainly decided so that people don't drink or expose themselves while in their car...

 

[RVTECH]

This was mainly decided so that people don't drink or expose themselves while in their car...

Yea that seemed to have worked out well........

 

[WasrNwarpaint]

This was mainly decided so that people don't drink or expose themselves while in their car...

frivolous laws and frivolous law suits......
where is the country headed?

 

[BoonDocks36]

Military Base= Federal Property....sooo

And we All Know, how safe it is on Ft. Hood, TX, Thank you major hason, for your practicing ~Jihad Spiritual Concepts~

Oh I forgot, the address err, 1600 Pennsylvania there in the District of Crininals.... It has been Real Secure there, as Well!!!!

Do we need more laws about Gun Owners and Where you can have them?

NO!!!! Just like that First Amendment... I carry My Pencil Anywhere, until they pry it out of my Arthritic Hands....

philip, on they way to Roseburg VAMC, to get a diagnosis about the pain in my eye... And I will travel there Drinking my Tea, with the Stiring Spoon still in it....

 

[Riot]

Also, I've been told that "no guns at work" is codified in OSHA (let's skip the discussion on the constitutionality of OSHA). Can anyone confirm that?

OSHA is a cop-out...otherwise there would be strict guidelines and exemptions for firearm dealers, armed security at businesses, gun shops, gun smiths or other places that deal with firearms (either directly as a primary business or indirectly with respect to possessing armed security or storage of firearms).

Even OSHA has come out, stating that workplace homicide involving firearms is on the decline with a 2006 response letter on banning firearms in all businesses.

https://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=INTERPRETATIONS&p_id=25504

Employers are encouraged to mitigate the risk of workplace violence...which means that they're supposed to protect their employees as much as possible. This could mean as simple as giving out pamphlets for anger management or as complicated as setting up a secure perimeter and hiring security.