Carbide resizing die scratching brass.

[Newberg]

I've had issues with 9mm resizing die causing scratches in the past, and I was completely baffled about why this happens.

Last night I had this with some 357mag cases - both nickel and brass. Brass are shown in my photos.

I spoke with both LEE and Dillon about this issue.

Apparently in the past, lead was part of the brass case manufacturing process, and it helped to lube the case as it was resized. Perhaps not intentionally lubing it, but when the lead was removed from the MFG process in the last couple decades, and the increased use of Carbide in resizing dies, this issue crops up more and more.

Starts as a "rub", and as it picks up brass "sticking" to the Carbide ring, it eventually turns into grit and grows, sometimes fast.

LEE suggested sandpaper and some aggressive cleaning methods, but ultimately both agreed that this is something that happens and will compound if not cleaned out.

LEE also suggested that some cleaning methods are making brass too clean and without lube, this happens. This is why you read about suggesting corn cob media over steel pin cleaning.

Either way, Dillon recommends a lanolin based lube to minimize this from happening once the die is cleaned.

Photos below are from a Dillon resizing die, showing progression from a small rub, to a scratch to a full blown nightmare. I was "in the zone" and loading cases and projectiles and completely missed that this was happening for ~20 rounds. Luckily I didn't do a full run before checking.

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[arrowshooter]

Man! What does the inside of your dies look like?

 

[Newberg]

Man! What does the inside of your dies look like?

You'd be shocked but it wasn't immediately apparent. I'll take a photo of the small scratch left that starts this snowball effect.

 

[Member 34319]

That's really bad! Like tried to size brass covered in mud bad.

 

[Newberg]

That's really bad! Like tried to size brass covered in mud bad.

Wet clean/steel pin cleaned brass.

 

[arrowshooter]

My first inkling would be to send the dies back to have them repolished or replaced. RCBS has repolished a couple of mine, all for free of course.

 

[TTSX]

You got something in there building up material progressively. Probably started as a small scratch. I'd bet with a flashlight you could see it plain as day. Part of paying for premium dies is getting a premium warranty. I'd contact the manufacturer

 

[po18guy]

For years, I used crushed walnut shell with red jeweler's rouge and would size the brass exactly as it came from the tumbler. Never a problem. You may have to spritz the cases with something like Hornady One Shot dry lube before sizing. It is technically dry, but actually leaves a thin wax coating which has an aroma similar to crayons.

Tungsten carbide is extremely hard to the point of being brittle and it is nearly impossible to scratch. Thus, it seems that some sort of fouling has apparently built up over time.
EDIT: This would certainly be more of an issue on a progressive machine, unless it is cleaned every few hundred rounds.

 

[Caveman Jim]

Wet clean/steel pin cleaned brass.

Do you include a car wash/wax of some sort?
I use these ingredients with hot water and a cold rinse.



And I use this case lube exclusively.

 

[WillametteWill]

Man! What does the inside of your dies look like?

I'm thinking this...

 

[ruger45blackhawk]

Do you include a car wash/wax of some sort?
I use these ingredients with hot water and a cold rinse.

View attachment 1383239

And I use this case lube exclusively. View attachment 1383248

Is this before or after sex? Sorry I couldn't resist!

 

[Stomper]

For years, I used crushed walnut shell with red jeweler's rouge and would size the brass exactly as it came from the tumbler. Never a problem. You may have to spritz the cases with something like Hornady One Shot dry lube before sizing. It is technically dry, but actually leaves a thin wax coating which has an aroma similar to crayons.

Tungsten carbide is extremely hard to the point of being brittle and it is nearly impossible to scratch. Thus, seems that some sort of fouling has apparently built up over time.

Oh man…. The USMC is gonna make a run on the Hornady One-Shot now that you've let out that secret!

 

[bpyycpyy]

RCBS has repolished a couple of mine, all for free of course.

I've recently experienced a scratching issue with some Hornady carbide dies for my 45-70. Been going round & round with Hornady over it. Initially when started, they simply replied to return to their stuck die mailing address with $10. I complained about having to pay for polishing when the die shouldn't scratch that easily (always tumble brass first to clean before decapping/sizing). Their response was, "Now it's $15 due to shipping cost increases and that it takes an employee time to polish it". My response was I could understand that, but IMO the die wasn't made correctly and that I wouldn't pay anything to get it fixed. Last email response from them was:

"So just let me see if I understand you correctly. You believe the die is defective since you sized 50 pieces of (BRASS) in a steel die, and it now is making scratches on the cases? It would seem that something may have happened to the die during the sizing of the cases. We would be glad to repair or replace the die if you send this into us."

You can clearly see in the photo taken of the die internals, that there are some severe linear lines filled with the brass material it shaves off. Maybe I'm incorrect in my thinking but I don't imagine it's possible for brass to be hard/sharp enough to scratch a properly hardened steel material (I'm sure if I am, I'll get set straight).



Edit (3/20): Apparently after some email back and forth, the die doesn't scratch but will remove loose brass pieces and then get compressed onto the die surfaces under the tremendous pressures during resizing process. These compressed brass shavings are hard enough to cause the scratches. Upon further inspection of the die, they are not scratches but adhered brass on the surface.

 

[HighlandLofts]

You got something in there building up material progressively. Probably started as a small scratch. I'd bet with a flashlight you could see it plain as day. Part of paying for premium dies is getting a premium warranty. I'd contact the manufacturer

The Lee die is far from premium.

Carbide dies do not need lube so apparently the carbide was defective.

 

[Newberg]

My first inkling would be to send the dies back to have them repolished or replaced. RCBS has repolished a couple of mine, all for free of course.

LEE and Dillon both replaced or are replacing the dies. The Dillon die is a few months backordered.

The Lee die is far from premium.

Carbide dies do not need lube so apparently the carbide was defective.

I've had this happen with both a LEE "U" die in 9mm and now a Dillon Die in 357mag.

 

[TTSX]

The Lee die is far from premium.

Carbide dies do not need lube so apparently the carbide was defective.

Cool story. He said the photos were from brass used with a Dillon die so Lee doesn't really have relevance to my previous comment

 

[Snip]

Had the same thing happen on my .223 sizing die. I took an oak dowel and sized it to the inside of the die. Took some polishing compound and a drill and reamed out the die with the dowel. The dowel is not going to damage the die, but it did take out the brass that was sticking to the die.

 

[ageingstudent]

I've had issues with 9mm resizing die causing scratches in the past, and I was completely baffled about why this happens.

Last night I had this with some 357mag cases - both nickel and brass. Brass are shown in my photos.

I spoke with both LEE and Dillon about this issue.

Apparently in the past, lead was part of the brass case manufacturing process, and it helped to lube the case as it was resized. Perhaps not intentionally lubing it, but when the lead was removed from the MFG process in the last couple decades, and the increased use of Carbide in resizing dies, this issue crops up more and more.

Starts as a "rub", and as it picks up brass "sticking" to the Carbide ring, it eventually turns into grit and grows, sometimes fast.

LEE suggested sandpaper and some aggressive cleaning methods, but ultimately both agreed that this is something that happens and will compound if not cleaned out.

LEE also suggested that some cleaning methods are making brass too clean and without lube, this happens. This is why you read about suggesting corn cob media over steel pin cleaning.

Either way, Dillon recommends a lanolin based lube to minimize this from happening once the die is cleaned.

Photos below are from a Dillon resizing die, showing progression from a small rub, to a scratch to a full blown nightmare. I was "in the zone" and loading cases and projectiles and completely missed that this was happening for ~20 rounds. Luckily I didn't do a full run before checking.

View attachment 1383173 View attachment 1383174 View attachment 1383175 View attachment 1383176

Clean your dye out really well with some brake cleaner and a boar brush. polish the Daylights out of it with some flitz. Edit...bore brush. Stupid phone.

 

[Caveman Jim]

Mamas got a squeeze box she wears on her chest.

 

[ageingstudent]

Mamas got a squeeze box she wears on her chest.

Daddy never sleeps at night haha. Great song.