Washington AR kit trick to by-pass I-1639

[conmcb25]

Yes, that part has never been a problem. At least not yet. You do have to be 21 to buy one as they are "other" but they are not an "assault" weapon yet.

Thanks, I asked that question from one of my local FFL guys last fall and he seemed to think 1639 applied.

 

[Alexx1401]

Thanks, I asked that question from one of my local FFL guys last fall and he seemed to think 1639 applied.

The problem with this and a few other laws like this is how they are written. They are often so poorly done many are not sure how the hell to take them. Some will then chose to error on the side of caution since they are afraid of some state personal coming after them otherwise

 

[Sporting Systems]

Thanks, I asked that question from one of my local FFL guys last fall and he seemed to think 1639 applied.

that's part of the problem, FFL's are so disconnected to the changes in the law, they don't know this crap! "Oh we're to busy", "We cant find the information" "I heard on the internet..." All BS responses.

 

[Bushman]

everyone should just do their own 80 lower and not have to deal with the BS state unconstitutional garbage laws.

they wont know you have it. obey the law and have no worries about it

I don't disagree with you, but one traffic stop or shooting pit visit and any suspicion that the gun is one of those dreaded ghost guns they confiscate it and charge you later, no?

 

[cookie]

A local FFL is selling complete lowers and complete uppers. And alot of them match.

How so?

 

[arakboss]

How so?

I'm guessing the uppers and lowers were received at the FFL assembled together and the FFL separated them so lower could be sold as other. Seems a bit risky but if it's legal it would be great way to avoid I-1639 BS.

 

[cookie]

Can the upper be matched in any way to the lower? there is as far as I know no serial number attached to the upper..

 

[arakboss]

Can the upper be matched in any way to the lower? there is as far as I know no serial number attached to the upper..

Probably not but FFL would have received lower in to his books as rifle or pistol and if FFL sends out lower as "other" that might cause problems.

 

[arakboss]

I'm guessing the uppers and lowers were received at the FFL assembled together and the FFL separated them so lower could be sold as other. Seems a bit risky but if it's legal it would be great way to avoid I-1639 BS.

Personally I don't see how this would be much different (opposite of) than a person buying a lower receiver adding an upper and down the road selling it as a rifle. The difference would be that the FFL had the intent to sell product as a business and the person did not. The FFL could be considered as manufacturing a firearm without an 07 license but who knows, these rules and regs don't always seem black and white.

 

[rdb241]

I don't disagree with you, but one traffic stop or shooting pit visit and any suspicion that the gun is one of those dreaded ghost guns they confiscate it and charge you later, no?

The burden of proof is on LE. They have to prove when it was built. As far as they know it was built a year and a half ago. You don't have to show proof of when it was built. That's their problem. If you don't leave a paper trail on all the parts you bought. How do they know when is was put together. Buy parts from gun forums and gun shows. No trail. Just don't post on Facebook saying "look what I just built"..........If Oly get their way and changes the definition of "other" for receivers. From then on out. What ever platform it may be. 80%ers will be the only way to go until they close that door.

 

[Ops]

its up to you. and by the time you do you could have your whole life ruined.

 

[slimmer13]

I'm guessing the uppers and lowers were received at the FFL assembled together and the FFL separated them so lower could be sold as other. Seems a bit risky but if it's legal it would be great way to avoid I-1639 BS.

Yeah, no. I'm talking abou matching furniture, not separating complete rifles. For example the FFL orders 20 Aero lowers with FDE furniture and 20 uppers with FDE furniture rather than 20 complete rifles that take the extra paperwork.

 

[Decoy]

If they came to him as complete rifles, he's doing it wrong.

That is incorrect.

The ATF has stated that a AR or any other firearm that the lower and upper come apart can be dissembled and sold as parts.
(AR's, Glocks, 1911 etc.)

The fine line in one of the above comments was if you sold both the upper and lower to the same person to make a full gun. That is treading water.

Uppers are not controlled so they can be sold anytime to anyone.

 

[wired]

That is incorrect.

The ATF has stated that a AR or any other firearm that the lower and upper come apart can be dissembled and sold as parts.
(AR's, Glocks, 1911 etc.)

The fine line in one of the above comments was if you sold both the upper and lower to the same person to make a full gun. That is treading water.

Uppers are not controlled so they can be sold anytime to anyone.

The ATF has also said that once a rifle always a rifle unless it started as a pistol.

Got in a little tuff with G&R the other day about lowers they were selling SBR lowers from guns they had split up and were selling as parts. I wanted to transfer the lower as a title one firearm it was legally and they wanted to transfer as an SBR ...which as a stripped receiver it wasnt. They wanted to charge me restocking fee of 25 % and I told them to pound sand I'd contact the ATF . It was 30 ish emails before I think they finally realized they didnt have any legal ground to stand on and gave me a full refund..

 

[Commonsense]

Give your SBR a hug for me!

 

[Stomper]

Two armed "hugs", anyone?

 

[SUPER X]

The ATF has also said that once a rifle always a rifle unless it started as a pistol.

Got in a little tuff with G&R the other day about lowers they were selling SBR lowers from guns they had split up and were selling as parts. I wanted to transfer the lower as a title one firearm it was legally and they wanted to transfer as an SBR ...which as a stripped receiver it wasnt. They wanted to charge me restocking fee of 25 % and I told them to pound sand I'd contact the ATF . It was 30 ish emails before I think they finally realized they didnt have any legal ground to stand on and gave me a full refund..

If a registered. pistol lower is used to make a rifle (16 " barrel with stock ). If it were ever tranfered . Does it transfer as a pistol or rifle

 

[bennngeeee]

So can you avoid 1639 on a private transfer if you separate the upper and lower and only transfer the lower?

 

[Cerberus Group]

From I've taken from all these pages and talking to the business in question...much ado about nothing.

Subject built said rilfes. Offers them as a whole package or buy separate which is legal.

 

[The Heretic]

If a registered. pistol lower is used to make a rifle (16 " barrel with stock ). If it were ever tranfered . Does it transfer as a pistol or rifle

The courts have said "it is what it is". If it has a stock on it, then it is a rifle. If it doesn't have a stock on it, then it is a pistol. It can go back and forth.