Anyone loading coated bullets in their .30-30 lever gun?.....

[Mikej]

Just picked up a model 94 in .30-30. Now comes the loading for it. This will be a first. First time I haven't bought factory to shoot and then reload that brass for it in the future. A quick glance at the usual online ammo suppliers has .30-30 Win at $1.75 a round! You can get 6.55x55 Swede for $1.50.
Anyway, question is, who's used coated bullet in they're lever gun? These look pretty good and they're a great price.
https://missouribullet.com/results.php?category=6&secondary=36 I don't push anything I load to max velocities. Is there any issues with extra cleaning from the coating?

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[Hueco]

I haven't used them in a lever gun as yet, but have for 9mm in both handgun and PCC. They shoot clean, from what I've noticed.

 

[RVTECH]

Been loading coated in .45 ACP and .38/.357 and will be in .30-30 as well when i'm ready for more bullets, and will probably try the Missouri bullets !

 

[Mikej]

Been loading coated in .45 ACP and .38/.357 and will be in .30-30 as well when i'm ready for more bullets, and will probably try the Missouri bullets !

Do you notice any kind of fouling from the coating? Cleaning a rifle barrel is way more work than cleaning a pistol barrel. And cleaning copper fouling out of a rifle barrel really sucks. I'd think anything left by the coated bullets might be easier to get out than both lead and copper?

My Lyman book shows cast loads gas-checked, and .309" dia. I'll presume the coating eliminates need for gas checks?

 

[RVTECH]

No fouling noticed out of either pistols or in the rifle shooting the .357s but they are pretty mild loads.

Yep no need for gas checks but there are still velocity limitations.

 

[DizzyJ]

I'd check the velocity you're wanting to push them at. The bullet manufacturer should have max speeds avail for powder coated Bullets.

 

[Mikej]

I'd check the velocity you're wanting to push them at. The bullet manufacturer should have max speeds avail for powder coated Bullets.

That's a good point. Looking at their site I don't see mention of velocity. They do have the brinell hardness at 18. I know that's bordering on harder rather than softer. My Lyman book only shows 170-173 gr #2 alloy in lead. Looking that up it says #2 alloy is roughly 15 on the scale. In that book they're pushing those to roughly 1200-2300fps. Running pressures 19000-36000 CUP. I only did lead ONCE for a few, and it didn't work for me, so I sold everything. But what I get from the MB site and the book, tells me there should be no issue. Looks like you might want to be careful of running them to slow even? You'd know better. If you're a regular user of lead bullets, that is.

 

[CLT65]

I did quite a bit of testing powder-coated bullets in a Winchester 30-30 a couple years ago. I had recently gotten the rifle, from someone here, and was enjoying working up loads for it. I bought a Lee 170gr bullet mold and worked up a load for it.

A good friend of mine couldn't find 30-30 ammo anywhere, and he uses it for work (wildlife control). He's a lifelong friend so I told him I'd load him a few, but couldn't even get jacketed bullets. Long story short, I tested the Lee 170gr powder-coated, gas-checked bullet to essentially the same load as jacketed, same powder, same velocity, full power load. He has since used it on bear and says it works fine.

My experience with cast bullets in rifles, anything above very light loads, is that a gas check helps significantly with accuracy. I didn't try any unchecked bullets in this rifle though.

 

[Mikej]

I did quite a bit of testing powder-coated bullets in a Winchester 30-30 a couple years ago. I had recently gotten the rifle, from someone here, and was enjoying working up loads for it. I bought a Lee 170gr bullet mold and worked up a load for it.

A good friend of mine couldn't find 30-30 ammo anywhere, and he uses it for work (wildlife control). He's a lifelong friend so I told him I'd load him a few, but couldn't even get jacketed bullets. Long story short, I tested the Lee 170gr powder-coated, gas-checked bullet to essentially the same load as jacketed, same powder, same velocity, full power load. He has since used it on bear and says it works fine.

My experience with cast bullets in rifles, anything above very light loads, is that a gas check helps significantly with accuracy. I didn't try any unchecked bullets in this rifle though.

"Accuracy"? What's that? Even with glasses my eyes are hard pressed to get good groups at 50 yards! I usually can't tell if it's the load or an issue with the trigger puller.

 

[Certaindeaf]

For lead bullets, gas checked or not, you'll want to flare the necks using a Lee universal expander or a Lyman M die.
Powder coating alone might do it but if you also use gas checks you'll likely have zero problems, especially at max loads.
You can shoot gas checked bullets without checks successfully.. especially at less than max loads.

 

[RVTECH]

Accuracy"? What's that?

This is what you can expect from a good load in a .30-30 at 50 yards!

 

[Pepe-lepew]

I always wanted to try these, Bear Creek

Their pistol bullets are great. They left a layer of moly in the barrel and never required bore cleaning, even in polygonal rifled Glock barrels. And best of all, they are cheap bullets that did not lead the bore or smell like burning plastic.

 

[techieguy]

I played with some 130 coated bullets with my son's 30-30 from MO Bullets, because I could find any max velocities I went with a power puff load using Unique power, we played with loads from 8 grains upto 11 trying to find a load it like for plinking. Seems to me it was about 10.5 grains on the 130 grains it grouped best with. Rifle didn't even feel like a 22 with that load... Would be great for Cowboy action shooting or pest control or shooting tin cans out to 50-75 max

 

[CLT65]

This is what you can expect from a good load in a .30-30 at 50 yards!

View attachment 1148507

Nice! I wish my rifle could do that. I tried everything: jacketed, cast, different powders, scope, etc.. About the best I could do, as I recall, was around 2.5-3moa, which I finally decided was good enough for what it is. I've often heard people talk about 1moa lever-action rifles, but I've never owned one.

I have a bunch of bullets that I've used from time to time in 30-30. I bought several thousand of them many years ago, for next to nothing. They're an orange plastic 13gr bullet with a copper base/gas check. I was told they were pulled from some kind of foreign military crowd-control ammo or something. A few grains of fast burning pistol powder gets them going really fast, reasonably accurate out to 50 yards or so. Being so light, energy drops off fast after that. I'd think they'd be good for things like squirrels and rabbits at fairly close range in an area where you didn't want the bullets to overshoot.

 

[gmerkt]

Loading a cast bullet in a rifle case. If you don't already know this, you are well advised to flare the case mouth slightly before seating the bullet. As with a Lyman M die, or the Lee Universal Expander die. As you would a pistol or revolver bullet. If you already know this, you're golden.

If you don't have a dedicated die for this, in a pinch you can do it by hand using a tapered center punch. Carefully done yields an acceptable result.

 

[RVTECH]

Nice! I wish my rifle could do that.

I have always seemed to have pretty good luck with accuracy with all the .30-30s I have owned.

Having always reloaded for them for the most part I think has been the reason for my fairly good accuracy out of them. I'll admit there had been a few times when loads didn't perform as expected but for the most part I have always been pretty satisfied with my 'ol lever actions!

Bottom line? Load for accuracy and light recoil. Bear busting loads in a .30-30 are not always the most accurate - nor are they in most guns.

 

[RVTECH]

Loading a cast bullet in a rifle case. If you don't already know this, you are well advised to flare the case mouth slightly before seating the bullet. As with a Lyman M die, or the Lee Universal Expander die. As you would a pistol or revolver bullet. If you already know this, you're golden.

If you don't have a dedicated die for this, in a pinch you can do it by hand using a tapered center punch. Carefully done yields an acceptable result.

This is true and I only learned it when I started using cast bullets (in .30-30) just a couple years ago!

I made a 'flaring die' out of an old 9mm expander punch and it works pretty well.

 

[DizzyJ]

That's a good point. Looking at their site I don't see mention of velocity. They do have the brinell hardness at 18. I know that's bordering on harder rather than softer. My Lyman book only shows 170-173 gr #2 alloy in lead. Looking that up it says #2 alloy is roughly 15 on the scale. In that book they're pushing those to roughly 1200-2300fps. Running pressures 19000-36000 CUP. I only did lead ONCE for a few, and it didn't work for me, so I sold everything. But what I get from the MB site and the book, tells me there should be no issue. Looks like you might want to be careful of running them to slow even? You'd know better. If you're a regular user of lead bullets, that is.

Correct. Not too much pressure but enough to make the bullet obturate and swell to seal off the gasses pushing the bullet from behind.

 

[CLT65]

I have always seemed to have pretty good luck with accuracy with all the .30-30s I have owned.

Having always reloaded for them for the most part I think has been the reason for my fairly good accuracy out of them. I'll admit there had been a few times when loads didn't perform as expected but for the most part I have always been pretty satisfied with my 'ol lever actions!

Bottom line? Load for accuracy and light recoil. Bear busting loads in a .30-30 are not always the most accurate - nor are they in most guns.

The rounds I loaded for my friend were accurate enough, considering they were literally bear busting loads.

The only lever guns I own are the Winchester 30-30 and a Marlin .44 Magnum. I've spent many, many hours testing, loading, shooting- everything from light loads to bear busters, with iron sights and quality scopes. The best accuracy I ever attained from either, consistently, was maybe 2.5moa. I've even tried adjusting, inletting, bedding the forearm, everything. I've failed in attaining superior accuracy. I think that's just all these guns are capable of. I'm also OK with it, plenty good enough for what they are.

Many years ago a friend let me shoot his .243 Model 88. It was very accurate; I was impressed.

 

[RVTECH]

The rounds I loaded for my friend were accurate enough, considering they were literally bear busting loads.

The reason I mention loading for a lighter recoil is for the potential effects of flinch in a light rifle (especially a mod 94 Carbine) with heavy loads.

I really started to see improvements in my .30-30 accuracy when I began to experiment with lighter loads and bullets as well.

With regard to sights you mentioned having used scopes and still only getting maybe 2.5 MOA as you mentioned. I could understand this with stock buckhorn sights but I would expect better with a scope. I am using WIlliams receiver/peep sights which work very well with me.

Also I am getting my best accuracy out of one of my 26" octagon barreled 94s. My 20" shoots nearly as well and it is octagon also so maybe the extra weight is accounting for the better accuracy - as well as the potential of a 'flat' top barrel giving improved sighting conditions.