Slow down people...breathe

[ScottyMac]

I've seen a lot of posts on many outlets about the coming doom of firearm legislation.

Get a grip people. If you're going to have a brain hemorrhage about everything the government and/or ATF is or might do…please don't read the rest of this post…you will be directed back to your regularly scheduled OMG the government is going take our rights, we're going to have to turn everything in or get it lost in a boating accident – thread.

If you decide to read on, insert some brass balls, I know it's a soft metal, but it's a start. I may lose some biz over this…but it's well past the sickening point.

Why are we worried so much about such things? We tend to get legally offensive on others about what they are doing…nit picking. People come to my trainings and ask…is it ok to bring a SBR, suppressor, full auto etc., what's the laws to cross a state line with such things? Then when they arrive ask if I want to see the paperwork.

I'm not the government or anywhere near the like. I'm a retired LE guy that doesn't have any free passes on such things. In the words of the movie character Monte Walsh, played by Tom Selleck…" You couldn't possibly know how little I care." All of us should look at that stance. United we stand, divided we fall…and we're falling fast…our group is getting smaller with such fear.

If you want to flame me...have at it, again...can't possibly know how little I care. I won't respond to sniveling finger pointing or degrading names etc., so please save it for the sake of others reading this post. Those that know me and have trained with me will better understand all this. Be well to all...

Lucas of T.Rex Arms has been putting out some posts that I think need to be out there for all to ponder. I don't care what you think of him...speeding up videos etc., bottom line…the man trains. 'nuff 'bout him.

Lucas' posts;



Some of you "pro 2A gun owners" are nothing more than compromising NRA sportsmen who are more concerned about abiding by unconstitutional regulations enforced by unconstitutional government agencies, than maintaining what little freedoms we have. You suck. You can't stand the thought of people out there with more gonads than yourself and living more free than you. If you get bent out of shape over a possible "illegal" SBR, there's no way you'll resist legitimate tyranny or evil as/when it grows. It's obvious you're an enemy of other people's freedoms. Again, you suck. That is all.



Throwback to carrying a gun in California without a permit. Lots of upset "pro 2A gun owners" in the comments because I was willing to "unlawfully" carry a pistol to protect two of my employees on a work trip. And no, a SOT doesn't give me special privileges to carry a pistol in California. Stop being upset at people who are willing to do more/take more risks than you in order to protect others. Maybe we've gotten to the point we're at with gun regulations and nonsense because we've policied our own more than the ATF has. Think about it.

View attachment 868622

This is the DUMBEST 2A Post I have ever read. As citizens it is our DUTY to confine the government to the limits of the Constitution. If they continue on their current track I will become a felon and give ANYONE my firearms bullets first if they show up to take them from me. I am not mistaken to assume that I will survive that encounter. I would rather LIVE FREE and DIE than capitulate to the governments current courses of action. I risked my life once when I Served, well guess what. That Oath never expires. Law enforcement better be wary of citizens like me because I will not bend. I love and respect my country not Police or government turn coats. I respect the rule of law but I will not under any circumstance obey any law that directly contradicts the Constitution of the United States in its CURRENT FORM.

 

[s1xty7]

This is the DUMBEST 2A Post I have ever read. As citizens it is our DUTY to confine the government to the limits of the Constitution. If they continue on their current track I will become a felon and give ANYONE my firearms bullets first if they show up to take them from me. I am not mistaken to assume that I will survive that encounter. I would rather LIVE FREE and DIE than capitulate to the governments current courses of action. I risked my life once when I Served, well guess what. That Oath never expires. Law enforcement better be wary of citizens like me because I will not bend. I love and respect my country not Police or government turn coats. I respect the rule of law but I will not under any circumstance obey any law that directly contradicts the Constitution of the United States in its CURRENT FORM.

I think you two are saying similar things in different ways. You are both saying the government doesn't control what you do. The choice is your own. I would recommend rereading the OP.

Edit to say: Welcome to the forum!! Don't let a lively discussion taint your perspective or sway your decision to hang out. Come on in. The water's fine! If you're going to bring your guns in the water too, make sure and clean/lube them after. Rust is the real enemy!

 

[Stomper]

This is the DUMBEST 2A Post I have ever read. As citizens it is our DUTY to confine the government to the limits of the Constitution. If they continue on their current track I will become a felon and give ANYONE my firearms bullets first if they show up to take them from me. I am not mistaken to assume that I will survive that encounter. I would rather LIVE FREE and DIE than capitulate to the governments current courses of action. I risked my life once when I Served, well guess what. That Oath never expires. Law enforcement better be wary of citizens like me because I will not bend. I love and respect my country not Police or government turn coats. I respect the rule of law but I will not under any circumstance obey any law that directly contradicts the Constitution of the United States in its CURRENT FORM.

I think that perhaps you're missing the point. What he is saying is, "quit wringing your hands together and crying "whoa is me"... standup, think and act like free men."

When Tyranny becomes law, free citizens have the DUTY to stand up and resist at all costs.

 

[Cerberus Group]

This is the DUMBEST 2A Post I have ever read. As citizens it is our DUTY to confine the government to the limits of the Constitution. If they continue on their current track I will become a felon and give ANYONE my firearms bullets first if they show up to take them from me. I am not mistaken to assume that I will survive that encounter. I would rather LIVE FREE and DIE than capitulate to the governments current courses of action. I risked my life once when I Served, well guess what. That Oath never expires. Law enforcement better be wary of citizens like me because I will not bend. I love and respect my country not Police or government turn coats. I respect the rule of law but I will not under any circumstance obey any law that directly contradicts the Constitution of the United States in its CURRENT FORM.

Amen brother! Apparently you didn't read my post thoroughly.

 

[msgriff]

After reading this post, I'm not sure whether it tastes great or is less filling. Screw it, I'm in.

 

[Lasers]

Remember the first mention of stabilizing braces being NFA'd? Man, was that the time to buy some SBA3's! People could wait to get their listing posted with an explanation of "I'm not changing my barrel so I guess this has to go"...

 

[Caveman Jim]

Remember the first mention of stabilizing braces being NFA'd? Man, was that the time to buy some SBA3's! People could wait to get their listing posted with an explanation of "I'm not changing my barrel so I guess this has to go"...

Too funny, I would have offerd a reasonable offer of $25, since they were going to be outlawed anyways... I should have done this for the bumpstocks too...








Not really...

 

[Knobgoblin]

Why can't my posts go over this good?

Lol.
Seriously, I've been living free since moms dropped me out the oven.

If I ever choose to live my life according to someone else's rules, I will no longer exist. Therefore I'm dead no matter what.

 

[titsonritz]

This is the DUMBEST 2A Post I have ever read. As citizens it is our DUTY to confine the government to the limits of the Constitution. If they continue on their current track I will become a felon and give ANYONE my firearms bullets first if they show up to take them from me. I am not mistaken to assume that I will survive that encounter. I would rather LIVE FREE and DIE than capitulate to the governments current courses of action. I risked my life once when I Served, well guess what. That Oath never expires. Law enforcement better be wary of citizens like me because I will not bend. I love and respect my country not Police or government turn coats. I respect the rule of law but I will not under any circumstance obey any law that directly contradicts the Constitution of the United States in its CURRENT FORM.

 

[Member 53328]

Why can't my posts go over this good?

Lol.
Seriously, I've been living free since moms dropped me out the oven.

If I ever choose to live my life according to someone else's rules, I will no longer exist. Therefore I'm dead no matter what.

YES!

 

[Andy54Hawken]

In regards to gun laws , bans and such....

The answer is same is always the same : Obey them or not , just be willing to accept the consequences of your actions.

Proposed gun laws , bans , etc....are seemingly always in the wings waiting to be issued.
This is nothing new.

It is my opinion , that until all gun owners understand , that what can happen to one firearm , can happen to all firearms , then we are as a group , only helping those who wish to do away with the 2nd Amendment.

Simply by being divided , we , again as a group , are easy to manipulate and be defeated.

The Right to keeping and bearing Arms is ours .
With that in mind it would be wise to note that the 2nd Amendment does not say :
"...the right of the people to keep and bear Arms , but only Arms of certain types and for certain uses , shall not be infringed.
On the contrary it only states the word "Arms" without any qualifiers , exceptions or notations...is simply says "Arms"
This to me means that one can own whatever Arms one wants...without exception.
Others of course read and or "interpret" the 2nd Amendment differently.

And that is where the trouble is....
America is made up of millions of folks , folks who are able to vote , but think differently than each other.
Which in turn can make for more and more gun control bills , laws , requirements , restrictions , etc...
Andy

 

[NW Backpacker]

Excellent article and comments somewhat related to the OP:

The Reasons Why Leftists Will Never Successfully Disarm Americans - Alt-Market.us

By Brandon Smith Gun confiscation has always been the Holy Grail of totalitarian regimes. Without disarmament, fully centralized control of...

alt-market.us

 

[NW Backpacker]

Others of course read and or "interpret" the 2nd Amendment differently.

Ran across this today - pretty good article and comments:

Why We Can't Ignore the "Militia" Clause of the Second Amendment | Mises Institute

The Second Amendment is much more than a guarantee of private gun ownership. It was designed to decentralize and weaken the military establishment in the United

mises.org

 

[Ridge Walker]

Ran across this today - pretty good article and comments:

Why We Can't Ignore the "Militia" Clause of the Second Amendment | Mises Institute

The Second Amendment is much more than a guarantee of private gun ownership. It was designed to decentralize and weaken the military establishment in the United

mises.org

Some how I missed that one. Great article.

 

[Jonnyuma]

This is the part just before the regulatory-state devolves into an authoritarian police-state. The battle plan must reflect the changes and strategies need to be appropriately amended.

To this point, we fight on the battlefield of ideas with nuance and truth. When the devolution comes, ideas, rhetoric, and politics will have been lost and something more tangible is called for. Acquiescence and blind conformity/compliance have never made the list of approved armaments, now or ever... those actions (or lack of action) aid and abet the those who actively cheerlead your destruction.

For now, we do what we can to stem, or even turn, the tide of authoritarianism... legislativey, through activism, and civil disobedience.
Like Swayze said in that piece of Hollywood brilliance, Roadhouse; "Be nice... until it's time to not be nice".
... and pray the time to not be nice doesn't come... or at least that you and a few million of your closest friends recognize it and be ready.

 

[Ridge Walker]

This is the part just before the regulatory-state devolves into an authoritarian police-state. The battle plan must reflect the changes and strategies need to be appropriately amended.

To this point, we fight on the battlefield of ideas with nuance and truth. When the devolution comes, ideas, rhetoric, and politics will have been lost and something more tangible is called for. Acquiescence and blind conformity/compliance have never made the list of approved armaments, now or ever... those actions (or lack of action) aid and abet the those who actively cheerlead your destruction.

For now, we do what we can to stem, or even turn, the tide of authoritarianism... legislativey, through activism, and civil disobedience.
Like Swayze said in that piece of Hollywood brilliance, Roadhouse; "Be nice... until it's time to not be nice".
... and pray the time to not be nice doesn't come... or at least that you and a few million of your closest friends recognize it and be ready.

As somebody mentioned when I whined about the problem with Patriots was them not showing up to do Patriot Sh!t. I was referring to holding the PoSs in our Capitals and the District of Corruption's feet to the fire. As sometimes happens my written words jump to where my thoughts are and not track with the thread. He thought I was referring to more robust action and reminded me of the 'Bundy Ranch' incident.
It was a great point.

 

[GripItAndRipIt]

When it comes to firearms, there are only 4 rules I can think of that matter, in no particular order.
- Always treat every gun like its loaded.
- Never point a gun at anything you don't want to destroy.
- Keep your finger off the trigger until you're ready to fire.
- Always be aware of your target and what's behind/in front of/around it.

Follow those and you're good with me. The rest are really someone else's suggestions or opinions and it's up to you what you want to do with them.

Then again, life is what you make of it so you can ignore the 4 rules above, but be prepared for the consequences. Although that is true of all choices.

Fully agree.

Rule 5: Pick up your damn brass!

 

[GripItAndRipIt]

It has been established that our rights come from God, not from man and especially not from government. What God freely bestows, man seeks always and every where to take away. It should be obvious that law prevents nothing - it only punishes the violation thereof. Any society, but particularly free societies, depend on individual self-restraint. The constitution, in addition to establishing a loose framework for the governance of a nation, is huge on freedom and huge on restricting government, which is the enemy of freedom. Ever notice the the constitution does not restrict the individual, but restricts government?

When was the tipping point?

The Constitution is a nice manifesto with a lot of high-mined ideals, almost none of which have been attained. Without getting into a theosophical debate, frankly we get our rights solely from our willingness to defend them. Ultimately, the state has the power to crush the citizen into compliance with its imprimatur from the people, whose only requirement is bread and circuses. And now we have the oligarchs, the useful idiots in the Fourth Estate, and the proletariat spewing woke dogma and guzzling the endless supply of Kool Aid to contend with. Even Orwell could not have imagined this one.

A man far smarter than me once said "we get the government we deserve." What this means to me is it is our charge — we the rational plain dealers, the citizens of good will — to persuade "the people." Persuade them to absolutely pay attention to the man behind the curtain. I believe objective reason can win the day, but only if is delivered with the intent to build a bridge, not blow one up.

 

[CamoDeafie]

The FBI employs 35,000 people; not sure how many are Special Agents with guns or part of the FBI Tactical teams. The ATF have 5,082 employees, including 2,653 special agents and 760 industry operations investigators.
The US military have just about a million Active Duty personnel spread out over three main Branches, and globally, and a very small percentage are the "tip of the spear" combat troops.

For a population of 330 million, with lets just say about 100 million gun owners who are in no way unified ; I think depending on the situation on the ground... what was it? Over 15 million ARs having been sold in the last 30 years? Or some ridiculously high number? If certain Gun Rights groups would just mobilize their memberships, and send large numbers of fellow gun owners to certain areas for neighborhood defense and work with certain County Sheriffs and perhaps certain State governments (those that said "2A sanctuaries?") Maybe Ruby Ridge, Waco, Bundy Ranch, Malheur, and what went down in DC wouldn't be what to expect? The one good protest for 2A that happened... Virginia. Nothing happened. Thousands of heavily armed 2A supporters, fencing, police, etc... and not one shot fired as far as I know. The police and the Feds were afraid to do anything more than just stand around... because there wss an enormous mass of armed civilians around the town.

 

[GripItAndRipIt]

Gun owners divide themselves. You have Tacticool Operators. You have Fudds. They generally don't like each other and disagree often.

Fudds are ok with AR's, Plastic-Fantastic newfangled pistols and anything related to be voted away. As long as their trusty .30-06 is safe. And their shotgun. Who really NEEDS 30 rounds? Nobody, because if you can't drop that whitetail in 1 or 2 you should sell your rifle and be a vegan pansy.

Tacticool Operators like to OC their AR's slung at low ready, to show everyone how badarse they are or something. They won't listen to others opinions on the message they send and can't run to the grocery store without body armor and a pile of loaded PMags....you know....just in case they need to save the day or at least brag about it to their buddies.


Both groups kinda suck. And both groups need to realize that the other is NOT their enemy, just a brother from another mother. Until that happens, we will continue to see the divide and in turn no real "message of unity" from gun owners.

Sadly, we see members of BOTH groups ready to turn in their legally obtained personal property at the first sign of "trouble".

FYI, I consider myself a bit of both because...well.....I like both.

I think you've hit the nail on the head. If it goes "bang," we ought not care who's hands are on the trigger. At the end of the day, those we've sent to places like Salem, Sacramento, Olympia, Washington DC, to rule over us with our blessing, likely neither know nor care about the difference between a cerakoted Kel-Tec SUB2K with flip-up red dot and my dad's gorgeous 12 ga. Benelli over/under. They just know if it goes "bang," they can likely turn their animus toward it and its owners into serious political capital. Infighting in the gun community will ultimately be our undoing, in my humble opinion.

And your description of the tacticool operator was spot on.