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Plane Shot Down Again...Thoughts?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by natef, Jul 17, 2014.

  1. natef

    natef Gresham OR Active Member

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    So I have been watching a little news this morning as well as researching a little on line and I'm thinking somthing is up with the plane that lost contact (shot down) this morning. My first thought is that it was Russia instigating to start a fight. I think they have alot to gain by starting a war.

    What are you thoughts on this? Do you think if they did shoot down this passanger plane as well as the one monday that it constitutes an act of war? Do you think we should have any involvment if it does lead to war?

    I lean towards we should mind our own buisness and stay out of theirs but with the world economy and global production what it is I wonder what would be the results of a full scale Country VS Country war again. If it did go to a full war situation I wonder if America would still have the production ability to produce our own war effort at home.

    thoughts?
     
  2. PiratePast40

    PiratePast40 Willamette Valley Well-Known Member

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    The talking heads are assuming that it was the Ukraine separatists using the Russian supplied SAMs, and not the Russians themselves who pulled the trigger. It's now an international incident and not just a territorial dispute. I can see the U.N. getting involved to stop the rebels from affecting innocent international travelers.

    As far as Putin, he's always a wild card. It's possible that he will take all the toys back from the separatists and make them stop, or perhaps he will decide that big brother needs to go into Ukraine to enforce peace.
     
  3. Norm0931

    Norm0931 Hillsboro, OR Sgt. Sheep Silver Vendor 2016 Volunteer

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    280 pax, 15 crew. 23 Americans on board are the reports so far. State Department is acting like they didn't really know that it even happened. I'll bet they are bargaining with the Russians about who we are going to blame.
     
    NoFlinch likes this.
  4. GrpCapMandrake

    GrpCapMandrake Vancouver Active Member

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    I think Malaysian airlines is going to have a rough go of it for a while. Even though being shot down is not (seemingly, as I don't know anything about their flight plan or alterations to it) their fault, it is still going to hurt the brand.

    I think shooting down two aircraft could be construed as an act of war. Especially since they were arguably inside Ukrainian airspace. Not responding to the now present threat would simply be a surrender of sovereign airspace and therefore supremacy. While I don't think the Ukrainians have to fly into Russian airspace, I think a reasonable forceful protection of your airspace would be prudent. They certainly need to do more to lock down that border with Russia though. I tend to agree that we should not get involved in a war between Russia and Ukraine though. Though you know the EU will stand by Ukraine and then we will in turn have to stand by the EU.

    As far as the US still being able to support a war effort. I have no doubt. I am however left to question though what Putin/Russia really has to gain by continuing in this way? It simply cannot be to see if the old adage is true to not get involved in a land war in Russia.
     
  5. natef

    natef Gresham OR Active Member

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    The lack on immediate infrastructure to produce war effort is my concern. I have no doubt that we have the spirit and the fighting will to bring it back I just wonder about the time frame to make it happen.

    Russia holds alot of the cards in that region in regards to fuel and natural gas. Going to war would drive the price of both up and they would be able to capitilize on that. Also there has been a growing feeling in alot of Russia with pride in country and wanting to take a stand for themselves. In my work we have a TON of russian customers (trucking industry) alot of them have said that they support Putin when he goes above and beyond to show Russuan supremacy all over the world. I think the guy is nuts. although i will give him that he isnt afraid to step on toes and when he says somthing good or bad he does it.

    kind of makes me go back a few years to when the line "let me get throught this election and I will have more flexibitly" was said. I wonder if this is part of that?
     
    GrpCapMandrake likes this.
  6. RVTECH

    RVTECH LaPine Well-Known Member

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    They ought to keep their mouths shut when in the US, especially about sensitive political issues relating to their own nutcase leader. Some people around might be kinda thin skinned........
    My experience with Russians was limited to having to hire a crew of them to sub on a big construction job many years ago and about the only thing I noticed 'supreme' about them was their ability to drink vodka (they often espoused this), their complete lack of responsibility (such as showing up on time - if ever), their inability to read a tape measure and to use this high tech device with liquid and a bubble in it.
     
  7. natef

    natef Gresham OR Active Member

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    Its pretty freaking frustrating to say the least and it certinly doesnt help their parts price when they start going off about it. what amazes me is that the us gov bends over backwards to get these russian truck drivers jobs, even giving them money tax free to start up a buisness but regular joe American is not offered the same benifits.

    Its astounding how many imigrate here, then talk crap about it and how wonderful the country they came from is. if its so great go back. If I left the US to go to another country i would expect the same feeling from them when/if i was talking crap. but we are requiered to be so PC and not offend anyone we are losing ourselves.

    there was a term I heard a couple years ago that fits it perfet, "Dont be so open minded that your brain falls out"
     
    4Freedom and GrpCapMandrake like this.
  8. Doc In UPlace

    Doc In UPlace Tacoma-ish Well-Known Member

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    "Malaysian airlines is conducting an investigation"

    Swell. There's the bright spot for the families.

    The crooks never sleep and neither does Clouseau.
     
  9. RVTECH

    RVTECH LaPine Well-Known Member

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    [QUOTE"Malaysian airlines is conducting an investigation"][/QUOTE]
    Yea they did so well with the one they lost.
     
  10. Chee-to

    Chee-to Oregon Well-Known Member

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    The latest from MSMBC.........What a "dumbazz"

     
    Quacky88 likes this.
  11. Quacky88

    Quacky88 Oregon Active Member

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    Lolz:D
     
  12. RVTECH

    RVTECH LaPine Well-Known Member

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    Hey, the shot down plane might BE the 'lost' one.......
     
    cooper likes this.
  13. natef

    natef Gresham OR Active Member

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    Now that would be an interesting turn of events.... Can you imagine the conspiracy theories that could come out from that?
     
  14. cooper

    cooper molalla Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    That right there......deserves a damn PULITZER PRIZE . THE BEST LAUGH I HAVE HAD IN A WEEK.:D:D:D:D:D:):):) WE NEED TO GET THAT VIRAL
     
  15. RVTECH

    RVTECH LaPine Well-Known Member

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    Hey, think about it. Plane was hijacked and hidden in a remote location. Russians record some BS message on the black box suggesting something incredible, almost unbelievable, but hey it's on the black box so its got to be real right? Pilot and passengers are told they are going home and gladly get on the plane but the pilot is told which direction he has to go. Plane gets shot down in an area it is most likely never to be recovered so it cannot be identified and it is given a fake manifest, registration and flight # - hey this is a suspense novel in the making!
     
    GrpCapMandrake likes this.
  16. GrpCapMandrake

    GrpCapMandrake Vancouver Active Member

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    I cannot turn my back on a good conspiracy. Well done sir.
     
  17. clearconscience

    clearconscience Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    It's just a matter of time before all the missles we gave to any of the middle east countires or terrorists organizations ends up downing a plane or at very least getting used against our own military.

    To me there's just certain places you don't go or you should just expect to get thrown in jail or murdered.
    And flying over war zones is one of them.
     
  18. RVTECH

    RVTECH LaPine Well-Known Member

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    Agree - I was discussing just this earlier today. Kind of like the couple who decided to take a summer vacation and hike along the Iran-Iraq border and got taken hostage a few years ago - I mean really???
     
  19. Jamie6.5

    Jamie6.5 Western OR Well-Known Member

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    My thought is, that it won't be long until some loser leftist excuse for a journalist comes up with a way to blame the TEA Party, or at least make a TEA Party reference about the perpetrators.
     
  20. cookie

    cookie THE SOCIALIST STATE OF KALI - FORNIA Well-Known Member

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    Strange it is an Air Malaysia plane. Can't believe what ever the tv and government reports.