Peterson vs Nosler brass, starting over...

[Koda]

Been waiting 2 years for this... 2 years.

Supply chain issues has been my biggest hurdle in learning reloading since I started 2 years ago. I have dozens of email notifications still unfulfilled and have had to settle on almost all components. Last week I found out Grafs has Petersons brass in 280AI.... and a heavy weight of cognitive dissonance set in, as I had invested in 100 pcs (not cheap at all) of Nosler "Premium" brass and have a recipe with those delivering about 3/4moa... why change anything now. Long story short a few days of cognitive dissonance went by and I caved and bought 150pcs (again not cheap) of Petersons brass. So now I will find out.

New unfired, I measured 10 samples from each brand.
Peterson, average: 202.1gr, Extreme Spread: 0.7gr
Nosler, average: 178.34gr, ES: 1.9g


Question: how many grains of powder charge would you drop back to start over load development with new brass?

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[DizzyJ]

At least 10%

 

[Local Loader]

I'd say use the same charge and loading steps to establish a baseline comparison.
Then go from there and see what you should change.

 

[DizzyJ]

I'd say use the same charge and loading steps to establish a baseline comparison.
Then go from there and see what you should change.

You're not worried about decreased case capacity? The Nosler brass is a fair amount lighter which leads me to believe it may very well have more case capacity than the Peterson.

 

[Koda]

At least 10%

10% is well below my starting point I began with.

Current Nosler load uses 58.5g so -10% puts me at 52.5g starting. I started my Nosler recipe at 55g.

 

[Local Loader]

You're not worried about decreased case capacity? The Nosler brass is a fair amount lighter which leads me to believe it may very well have more case capacity than the Peterson.

Nope, not unless it creates a compression load, than I'll reduce it. But that's me, do what makes you feel comfortable.

 

[P7M13]

What's your powder and bullet?

 

[Koda]

What's your powder and bullet?

Bullet: 140g Absolute Hammer
Powder: H4350

Side note: I will also be starting the Peterson brass with a further out seating depth since I have plenty of room to get closer to the lands. So that should give me back a small amount of case volume. Not certain how significant that would be.

 

[Local Loader]

Bullet: 140g Absolute Hammer
Powder: H4350

Side note: I will also be starting the Peterson brass with a further out seating depth since I have plenty of room to get closer to the lands. So that should give me back a small amount of case volume. Not certain how significant that would be.

It's possible that that will cause a pressure drop and/or fps drop, but as always, results may vary.

 

[Koda]

It's possible that that will cause a pressure drop and/or fps drop, but as always, results may vary.

I tested a further out seating in my Nosler brass and was able to safely increase powder by 1.8g and gain velocity. Was going to adjust my Nosler recipe before I found the Peterson brass.
currently I think the safest start is to start over where I started with the Nosler brass. 55 to 58.5 is a 6.4% difference and Hammers dont line up with conventional load data and typically exceed load data.

 

[Local Loader]

I tested a further out seating in my Nosler brass and was able to safely increase powder by 1.8g and gain velocity. Was going to adjust my Nosler recipe before I found the Peterson brass.
currently I think the safest start is to start over where I started with the Nosler brass. 55 to 58.5 is a 6.4% difference and Hammers dont line up with conventional load data and typically exceed load data.

Did you test the further out without increasing the charge? If so, what was the results?

 

[Certaindeaf]

Been waiting 2 years for this... 2 years.

Supply chain issues has been my biggest hurdle in learning reloading since I started 2 years ago. I have dozens of email notifications still unfulfilled and have had to settle on almost all components. Last week I found out Grafs has Petersons brass in 280AI.... and a heavy weight of cognitive dissonance set in, as I had invested in 100 pcs (not cheap at all) of Nosler "Premium" brass and have a recipe with those delivering about 3/4moa... why change anything now. Long story short a few days of cognitive dissonance went by and I caved and bought 150pcs (again not cheap) of Petersons brass. So now I will find out.

New unfired, I measured 10 samples from each brand.
Peterson, average: 202.1gr, Extreme Spread: 0.7gr
Nosler, average: 178.34gr, ES: 1.9g


Question: how many grains of powder charge would you drop back to start over load development with new brass?


View attachment 1409235

Have you ever shot factory loads in that gun? It'd be funny if you got .5 moa with random factory loads.

 

[Koda]

Have you ever shot factory loads in that gun? It'd be funny if you got .5 moa with random factory loads.

Nope, I havent. Its a new gun and Im going straight to handloads.

I know it will shoot sub MOA with factory loads. Im not handloading to just improve my MOA, Im handloading because I can never find factory ammo with the bullet I want and the velocity I want. Im done with supply chain issues from now on.

 

[Koda]

Did you test the further out without increasing the charge? If so, what was the results?

I should have but didnt.
My current Nosler recipe is 58.5g. 3157fps, 3.345" COAL

I cant recall what my logic was but I loaded a seating depth test ladder but started that at 59g, 3.43" COAL. That gave me 3125fps. I didnt hit pressure until 60.6g 3221fps. My notes tell me to zero at 60.3g/3202fps at that new seating depth.

 

[Local Loader]

Little after the fact but you could load up 2 rounds and see what the results show. Might also give you a better idea of how the other brass might affect your results.

 

[Koda]

Little after the fact but you could load up 2 rounds and see what the results show. Might also give you a better idea of how the other brass might affect your results.

Not seeing the need knowing I can increase charge. I might load 3 at the new node to see how it groups and record velocity data.

But Im moving to the Peterson brass. If I had no actual data my research has me starting at the same starting point as I did the Nosler. There's no published load data for Hammer bullets they tell you to start at the closest lower weight cup and core.

 

[Dillon1000]

A gun is like a woman, each and every one of them like something different.
For my Bench guns, I have my own chamber reamers. And still each barrel
likes something different. The fact is your going to have to figure out what
your gun likes. It's everything cases, primers, bullet weight, powder burn speed,
seating depth. There is no free lunch with the Ackley, it started out as a wildcat
and it has not lost much of it's fur. You picked a hell of a caliber to start your
reloading career.

 

[Koda]

There is no free lunch with the Ackley, it started out as a wildcat
and it has not lost much of it's fur. You picked a hell of a caliber to start your
reloading career.

excellent, I cant wait to tame this beast...

 

[Koda]

You're not worried about decreased case capacity? The Nosler brass is a fair amount lighter which leads me to believe it may very well have more case capacity than the Peterson.

mulling this over is there any correlation with the weight difference and reduction difference in charge?

10% reduction sounds reasonable for a weight difference of 13.3%.

 

[DizzyJ]

mulling this over is there any correlation with the weight difference and reduction difference in charge?

10% reduction sounds reasonable for a weight difference of 13.3%.

There is always the reduction recommendation when changing components. Adding the fact that the Peterson is that much heavier, yes I think this is additional reason to err on the side of caution. That brass has to go somewhere and if the external dimensions are the same for that cartridge I think it's fair to assume the brass is thicker, therefore decreasing internal volume.