National Over 50 cal Destructive Device Rule ?s

[arakboss]

There seems to be a lot of exemptions to Destructive Device NFA rules.

This one in particular seems pretty vague.

"a rifle which the owner intended to use solely for sporting purposes"

Source: https://www.atf.gov/firearms/firear...-firearms-national-firearms-act-definitions-1


If I was to build a rifle with bore over a 1/2 inch but intended to only use it for target practice, is that legal?

How do modern 54 and 58 cal muzzleloaders escape the ban?

If I make a golf ball style launcher, for non lethal self defense with no rifling, would that be illegal since it is over a 1/2 inch bore and intended to be used as a weapon?

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[TTSX]

The can cannon AR upper says no, it (the golfball launcher) would not be a DD. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a nonsensical formula for determining how powerful the projectile is in someone's opinion to overcomplicate things beyond .50 cal.

Part of me wonders just how strict they are about the .50 part because my .50BMG uses .510 bullets do it definitely is larger than 1/2" even if just barely, yet I had to fill out no special paperwork

 

[arakboss]

The can cannon AR upper says no, it (the golfball launcher) would not be a DD. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a nonsensical formula for determining how powerful the projectile is in someone's opinion to overcomplicate things beyond .50 cal.

Part of me wonders just how strict they are about the .50 part because my .50BMG uses .510 bullets do it definitely is larger than 1/2" even if just barely, yet I had to fill out no special paperwork

I was thinking a bolo type golf ball load with two golf balls connected by a steel cable would be a fun load to play around with. To me the golf ball/can launchers seem little different than a grenade launcher? But what do I know.

 

[arakboss]

Another over 50 cal idea I have is to mod one of these 58cal Green Mtn barrels to fit an AR10 barrel extension and section of 308 barrel. Then muzzleload the projectiles like I did for the 50 Beowulf load. I think the exterior of the 308 barrel could be threaded with 3/4x16 tpi so it would thread into breech plug end of green mtn barrel? Turning down and threading the 308 barrel is beyond my skill set and would require paying for that work to be done. I am pretty sure it would be the only example like it, maybe in the entire country. I guess it would be legal if I only intended to use it for sporting purposes?

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Edit: After some thought I think the AR15 platform should work fine for this type of hybrid muzzleloader. Utilizing any barrel with .750 diameter would only require cutting barrel down to just near the chamber and threading it. 3/4x16 dies are readily available for pretty cheap. The green mtn barrel is not cheap. If I were to try this, I would try modding the AR barrel first before ordering the green mtn barrel.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

How do modern 54 and 58 cal muzzleloaders escape the ban?

As a general rule....

Most muzzle loaders if they are antique , or modern made replicas / reproductions of the same , are usually exempt from this sort of nonsense.

However....
It bears repeating...that is a general rule.
And....
The above may not always apply to more modern "In line" style "muzzle loading firearms , or modifications done to make a firearm a "muzzle loader".
Andy

 

[arakboss]

Another over 50 cal idea I have is to use a blown out and shortend 50 BMG case to launch a 12ga style slug or maybe even a .700 dia bullet out of a 12ga rifled slug barrel.

 

[SonicBlue03]

I was thinking a bolo type golf ball load with two golf balls connected by a steel cable would be a fun load to play around with. To me the golf ball/can launchers seem little different than a grenade launcher? But what do I know.

There used to be shotgun specialty rounds that did that very thing. They were very ineffective, but more showy like Dragon's Breath.

 

[arakboss]

There used to be shotgun specialty rounds that did that very thing. They were very ineffective, but more showy like Dragon's Breath.

I agree the performance was lousy from the 12ga Bolo shells as evidenced in this video:

I believe better performance could be obtained if one of the balls was lighter or less aerodynamic than the other. That should result in one ball moving faster than the other and that should stretch out the link between the two. It won't necessarily cause it to spin but having a stretched thin metal cable hit you at 1000fps won't feel good, not to mention the two balls.

 

[Ranb]

The 50 BMG barrel measures .500" at the top of the lands, so not greater than half inch bore. The .510" bullet matches the depth of the grooves. The .308 cartridges also match the depth of the grooves on 30 caliber firearms.

 

[CamoDeafie]

From memory
.


As long as it's a ...

Shotgun, smoothbore or rifled, fires a shotgun shell

37mm Launcher for flares, smoke, pyro

Any rifle/cartridge for "sporting use" (read, target or hunting but not meant/designed to use against humans), though .50BMG seems unique here considering it's origins as a machine gun round? (See .700 Nitro)

Any smoothbore launcher device for sporting purposes/fun


Also....

Antique firearms (made before 1898) and replicas thereof, including cannons and mortars apparently for certain devices (black powder cannons and mortars)

You're good to go.



The main thing seems to be..

"Used against people other than self defense or from shotguns or smaller than .50 caliber rounds" =Destructive Devices.


For example..

If you have 37mm bean bag, rubber baton, tear gas, high explosive, shot shell, or rounds intended to be used against people... then they are "Destructive devices" and require tax stamps and registration for each round. Unless of course you're a LEO or LE agency ( )

 

[arakboss]

From memory
.


As long as it's a ...

Shotgun, smoothbore or rifled, fires a shotgun shell

37mm Launcher for flares, smoke, pyro

Any rifle/cartridge for "sporting use" (read, target or hunting but not meant/designed to use against humans), though .50BMG seems unique here considering it's origins as a machine gun round? (See .700 Nitro)

Any smoothbore launcher device for sporting purposes/fun


Also....

Antique firearms (made before 1898) and replicas thereof, including cannons and mortars apparently for certain devices (black powder cannons and mortars)

You're good to go.



The main thing seems to be..

"Used against people other than self defense or from shotguns or smaller than .50 caliber rounds" =Destructive Devices.


For example..

If you have 37mm bean bag, rubber baton, tear gas, high explosive, shot shell, or rounds intended to be used against people... then they are "Destructive devices" and require tax stamps and registration for each round. Unless of course you're a LEO or LE agency ( )

The golf ball/can launchers could be used to injure humans. At what point would they become regulated destructive devices?

 

[CamoDeafie]

The golf ball/can launchers could be used to injure humans. At what point would they become regulated destructive devices?

Honestly? I'm not 100% sure. Intention? I mean.. like buying tear gas 37mm rounds or building baton rounds or some such. Unlawful misuse probably the main charge for golf ball and can launchers and then potentially "unregistered DD" depending on the Agent.

 

[Stomper]

Maybe it's because drinking the cans of soda cause WAY more death and destruction to society, than actually shooting the cans at them….

 

[wired]

There seems to be a lot of exemptions to Destructive Device NFA rules.

This one in particular seems pretty vague.

"a rifle which the owner intended to use solely for sporting purposes"

Source: https://www.atf.gov/firearms/firear...-firearms-national-firearms-act-definitions-1


If I was to build a rifle with bore over a 1/2 inch but intended to only use it for target practice, is that legal?

How do modern 54 and 58 cal muzzleloaders escape the ban?

If I make a golf ball style launcher, for non lethal self defense with no rifling, would that be illegal since it is over a 1/2 inch bore and intended to be used as a weapon?

Sporting purposes is generally defined as hunting use not target practice or self-defense. Sorry.

 

[wired]

Honestly? I'm not 100% sure. Intention? I mean.. like buying tear gas 37mm rounds or building baton rounds or some such. Unlawful misuse probably the main charge for golf ball and can launchers and then potentially "unregistered DD" depending on the Agent.

Golf ball launchers are muzzle loaders.

 

[Capn Jack]

Wonder if, .70 cal. "Glass Marbles" come in there anywhere?