Optimize bullet seating depth

[Koda]

What is the resolution for different seating depths, or what measurement do you notice a difference in precision? Is there much of a difference between .005" or is .010" more practical before noticing a difference?

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[Local Loader]

That really can depend on what you are loading and how precise you are trying to be. Need more info.

 

[Koda]

That really can depend on what you are loading and how precise you are trying to be. Need more info.

25-06 hunting load. Id like to get better than 1.5moa my factory ammo gets.

 

[Member 34319]

Depends really. Hard to know until you test it. It might, and, it might not. The point of trying different lengths and measurements is to try and find consistency in everything. More consistent, more better good results.

 

[Koda]

Depends really. Hard to know until you test it. It might, and, it might not. The point of trying different lengths and measurements is to try and find consistency in everything. More consistent, more better good results.

this is what I suspected, Im debating just how much different lengths I want to try not certain if I need to test in .005" increments. My initial pressure test was all at -.020" from the lands so I might just try some at -.010" off the lands to see if there is a difference and pick the best one and be done with it just wasnt certain if I need to also test -.015" and -.005" etc.
if that makes sense...

 

[Member 34319]

this is what I suspected, Im debating just how much different lengths I want to try not certain if I need to test in .005" increments. My initial pressure test was all at -.020" from the lands so I might just try some at -.010" off the lands to see if there is a difference and pick the best one and be done with it just wasnt certain if I need to also test -.015" and -.005" etc.
if that makes sense...

I've tried most if not all things reloading related. Especially with 223 back when I had a nice Remmy 700 test gun. After doing up my 2nd or so "bulk" load out run of 223 (2-3 thousand at a time with not much taken to ensure exact powder or seating depths etc), which shot minute of 6"x10" steel target at 500 yards every time, I realized a lot of the really specific reloading practices are more for hobby than anything else. There is definitely a realm of shooting that requires crazy lengths of precision, but if you don't live in that realm lots of stuff isn't needed.

 

[Koda]

but if you don't live in that realm lots of stuff isn't needed.

This...
this is what Im trying to decide, I just dont have any metric to seating depth being still very new to learning to reload. Some here will know my story this year, I just want a hunting load... certainly a hunting load doesnt need competition level precision and Im fine with that, but I just dont know if say a .010" difference in seating depth will make a huge difference in any application.
for example, if I test 2 strings .010" apart and it makes no practical difference than I call it good. But if it made a 1/2 moa or better difference then its worth taking the time.
I think you answered my question above though, "it depends"... the only way to know is to do it so Im putting too much thought into this now. I just need to load a couple strings at the different depts and pick the one that performs best and get that test over with.

 

[daved20319]

25-06 hunting load. Id like to get better than 1.5moa my factory ammo gets.

Which begs the question, how is 1.5 MOA not good enough for a hunting load? Not trying to be a jerk, it just seems most hunters would be ecstatic to be under 2" consistently. Different story if you're trying to make tiny groups at distance, but that's also a very different rifle than the one you'd take in the field, I'd think. I've played around a bit with seating depth in my 6.5 Creedmoor, frankly, it didn't make any appreciable difference with that particular combo of bullet, powder, etc. For my .223, I'm shooting a Mini 14, 2 MOA is about as good as that rifle will do consistently, which is plenty good enough for my needs, so I load to book COAL and call it good. Reno nailed it, "it depends..." Good luck, and enjoy.

Dave

 

[Member 34319]

This...
this is what Im trying to decide, I just dont have any metric to seating depth being still very new to learning to reload. Some here will know my story this year, I just want a hunting load... certainly a hunting load doesnt need competition level precision and Im fine with that, but I just dont know if say a .010" difference in seating depth will make a huge difference in any application.
for example, if I test 2 strings .010" apart and it makes no practical difference than I call it good. But if it made a 1/2 moa or better difference then its worth taking the time.
I think you answered my question above though, "it depends"... the only way to know is to do it so Im putting too much thought into this now. I just need to load a couple strings at the different depts and pick the one that performs best and get that test over with.

If it's just a hunting load. Start at the spec in the manual. See if that gets you better than 1.5" first before messing around with seating depths.

 

[Koda]

Which begs the question, how is 1.5 MOA not good enough for a hunting load?

1.5moa is fine for hunting, I just figured if Im taking the time to handload it can do better. Plus, in this caliber Im planning on an antelope hunt in the future and would like to start practicing out past 300 yds. I dont see any harm in trying to develope a more precise load if the rifle is capable of it.

 

[Pepe-lepew]

Erik Cortina and F-Class John has info on the YouTube channels that is useful if you want to play with seating depth.

I don't think messing with seating depth will be useful in improving accuracy in a hunting rifle. Most likely the mag length will control max cartridge length.

I played with seating once while trying to squeeze accuracy out of a 204 Ruger rifle. I tried all things that could impact accuracy, powders, bullets, brass type, FL vs neck size, primer type etc. I burned myself out and never have wasted that much time and money developing loads since.

For any load I develop, I pick an achievable accuracy target for the type of rifle and barrel I am using. For hunting, I target 5 rounds at 200 yards under 1 moa. Next, I see what powders, bullets, charge weights and any other variables are working well for others. I then use what working for others. I always get the accuracy I am looking for with this method without wasting load development time and money.

 

[dangerranger60]

I have a fairly new 223 Savage Axis that right out of the box shot a 3/4" group with 55 gr Remington FMJ ammo.
My first try at reloading for it got me a 7/8" 5 shot group using a hunting bullet.
This will be a Coyote gun, and for that purpose I locked down my die settings, and called it good. If it had shot anything over an inch I may have played with the load to see if I could do better. But I'm as happy as I can be with this load.
It does not always work out that way. I have a 94 Win in 30-30, that will shoot Remington 150 gr CorLoc ammo into 1 1/4" easily. But every handload I have tried ended up closer to 2" groups. I finally gave up and just hunt with Rem ammo.
You just have to decide what result you are going to be happy with.
On to your question about seating depth,
It really depends on the bullet you are using. I live in CA and have to hunt with Lead Free bullets. They seem to do better with 50 thou or more off the lands. My guess is the harder bullet needs a little jump to get started down barrel. But I also shoot a target rifle that uses a lead bullet and shoots best with the bullet right against the lands. Your rifle will tell you what it likes.
The target rifle, I'm constantly testing ideas to improve its performance, The hunting guns not so much once I find a good load. Good Luck DR

 

[DLS]

It doesn't hurt to try a few seated longer and shorter, and .005 inch increments is reasonable.

With non-match bullets, chamber, bedding, and barrel don't be expecting much (if any) improvement but you may get lucky.

You won't know unless you try. And, since you posted on this in the first place I'm betting it will bug you forever if you don't give it a try.

 

[Koda]

It really depends on the bullet you are using. I live in CA and have to hunt with Lead Free bullets. They seem to do better with 50 thou or more off the lands.

The bullet im using is a Nosler Partition, but Im also going to develope a load using a TTSX lead free bullet. I havent started that one yet and will need to do a pressure test first to work up the powder charge.

 

[Koda]

You won't know unless you try. And, since you posted on this in the first place I'm betting it will bug you forever if you don't give it a try.

ha, yes... and thats what gets me down an endless rabbit hole chasing information. Being very new to reloading Ive chased my tail on this already a bit and would like to just be done with it.

 

[drstrangelove]

What rifle are you using? Things that make a rifle most accurate…
Undamaged crown, proper torque-down of action to stock and scope to rifle, free floated barrel, rifling that has been properly cleaned of copper buildup, a light trigger, a scope you can see the target well with that is mechanically in good shape, and proper rest or bipod.
All before you get to ammo… if handloading, you need to make a load ladder of your available powders to find the sweet spot or "node". 3 rounds of each powder weight should be tried with proper barrel cooling between stages. I know of people that bring ice watered towels to speed the process. Once you find your best powder charge, write it down in your journal then try another powder. The internet is your friend. Look up "most accurate handload 25-06" keep cut and paste notes, buy well regarded powders. One powder in my Varmint rifle prints .25" groups. Another powder opens it markedly. Driving yourself batcrap crazy trying to figure out the best land jump isn't going to be appreciable at hunting distances.
The biggest pill to swallow is that your rifle may not be up to your expectations or desires. Tikka is arguably the best affordable production rifle for accuracy ever made… every group is sub MOA in the one I shot. A 1982 rack production Remington or Ruger or Browning is 1.5" on a good day no matter what.

 

[Koda]

What rifle are you using? Things that make a rifle most accurate…
Undamaged crown, proper torque-down of action to stock and scope to rifle, free floated barrel, rifling that has been properly cleaned of copper buildup, a light trigger, a scope you can see the target well with that is mechanically in good shape, and proper rest or bipod.
All before you get to ammo… if handloading, you need to make a load ladder of your available powders to find the sweet spot or "node". 3 rounds of each powder weight should be tried with proper barrel cooling between stages. I know of people that bring ice watered towels to speed the process. Once you find your best powder charge, write it down in your journal then try another powder. The internet is your friend. Look up "most accurate handload 25-06" keep cut and paste notes, buy well regarded powders. One powder in my Varmint rifle prints .25" groups. Another powder opens it markedly. Driving yourself batcrap crazy trying to figure out the best land jump isn't going to be appreciable at hunting distances.
The biggest pill to swallow is that your rifle may not be up to your expectations or desires. Tikka is arguably the best affordable production rifle for accuracy ever made… every group is sub MOA in the one I shot. A 1982 rack production Remington or Ruger or Browning is 1.5" on a good day no matter what.

Rem 700. Ive done all that except I havent looked up what others are using. Issue there is I want to use a Nosler Partition, and as for powder and other components I am SOL for having a choice and am lucky to have what I acquired. Ive actually done really well IMO with quality components and powder popular for this caliber but regardless it will be impossible to switch to anything better since they have not been available in a year. If I did find something Im too invested in the powder I have to switch now since everything this last year has been price gouged.

 

[drstrangelove]

If you are free floated and everything thing is right, tight, and clean of copper, PM me your powder list and bullets and I can help you work out a good starting point.

 

[Koda]

If you are free floated and everything thing is right, tight, and clean of copper, PM me your powder list and bullets and I can help you work out a good starting point.

Im floated and bedded and everything is right and tight and good quality. I dont know if Im clean of copper though but recently bought some Pro Shot copper solvent and will give that a go before I hit the range next to test these seating depths...

 

[drstrangelove]

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