Well that settles it then.
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on killing tanks
- Thread Starter rjmt
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- Thread Starter
- #22
watch the video of the British Starstreak missile taking out an attack helicopter - could be a game changer on the battlefield
they do Mach 4 and are laser guided - at present the Russians have no defense against this missile, just sent to Ukraine last month
Starstreak - Wikipedia
Manpad, fly at Mach 4, 3200 ' elevation, 2.5 mile range
I'm no expert. But I've gotten a few impressions from what we can see in the Ukraine war.
1. Russian main battle tanks appear to be of older basic design than Abrahms. So they are behind the curve on that.
2. Tracked personnel carriers that the Ukes have destroyed, when burned all that is left is a turret and a set of road wheels. Pretty flammable, must have fairly light aluminum hull. Basically, nearly all of their wheeled and tracked vehicles look just like the stuff they used in the Cold War, save a couple of newer-looking smaller personnel vehicles, equivalent presumably to the HUMMV.
3. Russian tank maneuver down roads, no interval, close together in file, very basic no-no of armor tactics, deadly to crews and equipment.
4. Cost effectiveness of gee-whiz anti-tank weapons vs. obsolescent east bloc armor. Yes, the Javelin is successful and deadly. At 80 grand a shot, the launcher is another hundred grand. I don't know what a Russian tank costs, but in an authoritarian state that still owns the main factory, there is no profit factor. No Raytheon to pay a profit to. So it is all well and good for the Ukes if well-heeled Western countries want to donate expensive AT weapons. But just remember, that $80K missile may be worth more than a Russian tank. I guess the trade-off is worth it, better to stop the Russ in Ukraine than wait until they get to the Rhein River.
5. What we see of video footage from Ukrainian cities that the Russians have run around in is shocking. The destruction looks like old pictures of cities and towns that the Russians and Germans fought of during WW2. And some of the very same ground. This is why your car insurance policy says, "No coverage for acts of war."
6. This is an excellent learning experience for Western defense officials and experts. Without having to ship coffins home to their own countries.
1. Russian main battle tanks appear to be of older basic design than Abrahms. So they are behind the curve on that.
2. Tracked personnel carriers that the Ukes have destroyed, when burned all that is left is a turret and a set of road wheels. Pretty flammable, must have fairly light aluminum hull. Basically, nearly all of their wheeled and tracked vehicles look just like the stuff they used in the Cold War, save a couple of newer-looking smaller personnel vehicles, equivalent presumably to the HUMMV.
3. Russian tank maneuver down roads, no interval, close together in file, very basic no-no of armor tactics, deadly to crews and equipment.
4. Cost effectiveness of gee-whiz anti-tank weapons vs. obsolescent east bloc armor. Yes, the Javelin is successful and deadly. At 80 grand a shot, the launcher is another hundred grand. I don't know what a Russian tank costs, but in an authoritarian state that still owns the main factory, there is no profit factor. No Raytheon to pay a profit to. So it is all well and good for the Ukes if well-heeled Western countries want to donate expensive AT weapons. But just remember, that $80K missile may be worth more than a Russian tank. I guess the trade-off is worth it, better to stop the Russ in Ukraine than wait until they get to the Rhein River.
5. What we see of video footage from Ukrainian cities that the Russians have run around in is shocking. The destruction looks like old pictures of cities and towns that the Russians and Germans fought of during WW2. And some of the very same ground. This is why your car insurance policy says, "No coverage for acts of war."
6. This is an excellent learning experience for Western defense officials and experts. Without having to ship coffins home to their own countries.
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With better and better missiles tanks, helos and ultimately ships and artillery will become obsolete on the battlefield.
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Haha. A T-14 costs $3.7 mil.
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one of the reasons the Russian tanks are maneuvering down narrow roads is it's Spring time in Ukraine - their spring mud stopped the Germans in WW2, the same with the Russians today
I live on property in the NW, once sank an F250 Diesel 4WD to the belly pan in our mud, the same with the Russian tanks in Ukraine
how did the Russians forget this from WW2?
the Mud stopped Napoleon on his way to Moscow
the Mud stopped Hitler on his way to Moscow
How did Putin forget this?
So that's why they aren't using any. They don't want to hazard any of them to loss.
If they are going to stick to the roads, they need to maintain an interval, very basic. Spreading them out reduces the Ducks in a Barrel Syndrome.
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they need the T14 to parade in Moscow to impress the citizens, don't wan to risk them in combat
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The Ukes could use some kind of a counter-battery system.
That Russian artillery is doing a lot of damage.
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the UK has announce it's sending artillery and Kamikaze drones to Ukraine immediately
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Remember, boys... All you need are paintball guns and a steady aim for the viewports... Lol
(if you missed out on the reference)
(if you missed out on the reference)
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They were going to have this wrapped up by April.
The secondary mission was Ukraine as a whole. The primary mission was always the Eastern Oblasts and joining in the Ukrainian civil war and keeping Ukraine out of NATO. They will probably succeed in that regard..
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MORE, More, more......
Consider it as.....
Some new real world testing on real tanks.
Aloha, Mark
Consider it as.....
Some new real world testing on real tanks.
Aloha, Mark
Interesting. I assumed Russia wanted a land connection to the penninsula, more or less the SE part of Ukraine. Anything more would be icing on the cake. A side effect would be ousting the nazi component. And yes, no NATO.
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RE : Post #22
Aloha, Mark
Aloha, Mark
One website says:
"Russian T-72 main battle tanks (MBTs) regularly sell for around $50,000 to $70,000 today" This is what they are worth, not what the Russian government may have paid for them. And, reported amount originally paid by the government may be rigged as numbers sometimes are in Russia. Year made also determines value.
T-72 is a common Russian main battle tank.
"Russian T-72 main battle tanks (MBTs) regularly sell for around $50,000 to $70,000 today" This is what they are worth, not what the Russian government may have paid for them. And, reported amount originally paid by the government may be rigged as numbers sometimes are in Russia. Year made also determines value.
T-72 is a common Russian main battle tank.
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Im going to have my son buy me a T-72.
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- #40
I told my family we were safe up here on the south ridge of the North Fork during rains because not even a Main Battle Tank can make it up our slopes in the mud
we have 8000 lbs rated logging ropes and chains combined with 4 6000 lbs snatch blocks for vehicle recovery and I've trained my son how to use them
it doesn't matter if you get stuck, as long as you have the knowledge how to recover
the Russian Orks are abandoning mud stuck vehicles, not attempting to recover them
every American soldier who ever served at Ft Lewis was trained in vehicle recovery
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