on killing tanks

[rjmt]

a reference article from West Point War Institute

On Killing Tanks - Modern War Institute

I would rather be the hammer than the anvil. — Erwin Rommel Ever since modern tanks’ first appearance on the twentieth-century battlefield, infantry forces and their armored counterparts have […]

mwi.usma.edu

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[DirectDrive]

With Javelins around, I wouldn't want to be in an opposing tank.
Looks like currently, the Russians cannot defend against Javelin.

 

[arakboss]

With Javelins around, I would want to be in an opposing tank.
Looks like currently, the Russians cannot defend against Javelin.

Would our tanks survive any better against Javelins?

 

[wired]

Would our tanks survive any better against Javelins?

Nope. Tank warfare only works against 3 world countries. We should be supplying as many Javelines, Stingers, Tow's , tomahawks etc as we can as fast as we can get the Ukrainians half @ss trained.

 

[rjmt]

Would our tanks survive any better against Javelins?

if you read down in the article, the Israelis have developed a system to defeat the Javelin they have sold to the US

tanks were once intimidating opponents for infantry
interesting enough, the USMC has acquired several T72 tanks they use to train the Marines NOT to be intimidated by

 

[DirectDrive]

Would our tanks survive any better against Javelins?

I don't know.
The latest Abrams is at least a generation ahead of that Russian stuff we see all burned out on TV.
The Russians do have a new T-14 tank but I haven't seen it in any of the battlefield vids.

 

[ma96782]

RE : Anti-Tank Warfare
The old fashion Molotov Cocktail

I was watching YouTube the other night and I learned that modern Russian tanks and armored vehicles (when properly equipped and maintained) aren't as vulnerable as the tanks/armored vehicles of the old days.

Aloha, Mark

 

[rjmt]

I don't know.
The latest Abrams is at least a generation ahead of that Russian stuff we see all burned out on TV.
The Russians do have a new T-14 tank but I haven't seen it in any of the battlefield vids.

the Russians have 12 of them
the Oligarchs stole enough Russian defense funds to build hundreds of them
the Polish Army is building their own home grown upgrade to the T72 which is superior to the Russian T90

Polish Upgrade Programme for the T-72 Main Battle Tank | Defence24.com

defence24.com

as of news today, many NATO countries are transferring their old T72 to Ukraine

Ukraine update: NATO is ready to send offensive weapons to Ukraine. Let's look at some options

Yes! Finally ! The United States will work with allies to transfer Soviet-made tanks to Ukraine to bolster its defenses in the Donbas region, the New York Times reported on Friday, citing a U.S. ...

www.dailykos.com

 

[BrentN]

Armor is a simple asset, just as important as it has ever been. The quality of said asset and how it is used is the deciding factor. Assuming tanks are obsolete because of this particular invasion is short-sighted. Without the correct support, no single asset will rule a conventional invasion. Just my opinion, but the biggest lesson to be learned here is the failures of the command and control structure. Without getting into tangents and conspiracy theories, Russia clearly did not employ enough properly trained and equiped infantry to support the invasion.

 

[ma96782]

RE : Are tanks obsolete?
One view

Aloha, Mark

 

[rjmt]

Armor is a simple asset, just as important as it has ever been. The quality of said asset and how it is used is the deciding factor. Assuming tanks are obsolete because of this particular invasion is short-sighted. Without the correct support, no single asset will rule a conventional invasion. Just my opinion, but the biggest lesson to be learned here is the failures of the command and control structure. Without getting into tangents and conspiracy theories, Russia clearly did not employ enough properly trained and equiped infantry to support the invasion.

the USMC is eliminating main battle tanks from their TO&E
they find they no longer fit into their objectives

Goodbye, tanks: How the Marine Corps will change, and what it will lose, by ditching its armor

Commandant Gen. David H. Berger has said that should armor be needed by Marines, he would look to the Army to provide that capability.

www.marinecorpstimes.com

The Marines want to get rid of their tanks. Here’s why.

“We have sufficient evidence to conclude that this capability [tanks], despite its long and honorable history in the wars of the past, is operationally unsuitable for our highest-priority challenges in the future,” the report said about the divestment of Marine tanks.

www.marinecorpstimes.com

Marines to Shut Down All Tank Units, Cut Infantry Battalions in Major Overhaul

In the next decade, the Marine Corps will no longer operate tanks or have law enforcement battalions.

www.military.com

 

[pharmseller]

Can't we all just, get along?

 

[Stomper]

A tank crew's operational efficiency goes WAAAAAY down when you cause them to "button up"……

 

[rjmt]

RE : Are tanks obsolete?
One view

Aloha, Mark

I don't disagree with this assessment - unsupported tanks are dead meat - tanks need to be in a combined unit

the Russians learned this in WW2 - how did they forget this??

 

[BrentN]

the USMC is eliminating main battle tanks from their TO&E
they find they no longer fit into their objectives

Goodbye, tanks: How the Marine Corps will change, and what it will lose, by ditching its armor

Commandant Gen. David H. Berger has said that should armor be needed by Marines, he would look to the Army to provide that capability.

www.marinecorpstimes.com

The Marines want to get rid of their tanks. Here’s why.

“We have sufficient evidence to conclude that this capability [tanks], despite its long and honorable history in the wars of the past, is operationally unsuitable for our highest-priority challenges in the future,” the report said about the divestment of Marine tanks.

www.marinecorpstimes.com

Marines to Shut Down All Tank Units, Cut Infantry Battalions in Major Overhaul

In the next decade, the Marine Corps will no longer operate tanks or have law enforcement battalions.

www.military.com

Marines giving up on tanks? Lol.

 

[rjmt]

Marines giving up on tanks? Lol.

The Corps is getting rid of its tanks, so dozens of Marines are joining the Army

More than 450 Marines' careers have been affected by a forcewide redesign that was launched last year.

www.businessinsider.com

 

[BrentN]

A tank crew's operational efficiency goes WAAAAAY down when you cause them to "button up"……

Yep. And "buttoning up" was a standard response to an N.B.C. attack. And in that scenario, every asset on the battlefield has their efficiency reduced.

 

[BrentN]

The Corps is getting rid of its tanks, so dozens of Marines are joining the Army

More than 450 Marines' careers have been affected by a forcewide redesign that was launched last year.

www.businessinsider.com

Hope that isn't a woke decision.

 

[BrentN]

Have watched the video of the MI-24 taken out by the stinger multiple times. Is the attack helo dead?

 

[wired]

Have watched the video of the MI-24 taken out by the stinger multiple times. Is the attack helo dead?

If the Ukrainians have stingers or stinger equivalents or better then yes.