Obama Nominates Rabid Anti-gunner to Head the ATF

[KomradRazvan]

So you are going to wait until executive orders are signed, or this guy decides that the ATF has a "duty" to step on our constitutional rights before you will oppose him?? Then what, wait for the NRA or the GOA to take him to court?

Gee that's so logical,... Wait for the appointee to do something wrong.
No wonder you lefties vote in the clowns you do. In your mind they can do no wrong,...
Until they've already done it and it's too late.
HEY!! Komrad WAKEUP!! That's why we have Senate confirmation hearings!!
So the nominee's suitability for the job can be judged beforehand.
If the guy was really suitable, Obama wouldn't be trying to push him through during the lame duck session,...

Are you sure you are a gun owner/advocate?? You don't sound like one.

This isn't pre-crime, buddy. You can't accuse someone of doing something they haven't done yet. I am a gun owner/advocate. But that's not all I am. I am also an advocate of truth. Disseminating false information and propaganda (no matter which side does it) does not serve the good of the American people. Do you agree with this? I like to look at hard facts, and not make assumptions about what someone will do in the future. The mentality expressed in your post, of accusing someone of doing something before they've done it, is the same mentality that anti-gunners use to enact gun control, touting that " if someone owns a gun, they might commit a crime, so stop them before it gets to that point. Or do you want them to kill somebody before they are taken to court?"

 

[KomradRazvan]

Komrad, I myself can't point to anything other than the M1 thing that Obama has done to step on our firearms freedom specifically. I would point out that the framework is being put in place. This appointment shows his intentions. We have always known from his voting record as a Senator what his thoughts on the 2nd amendment is, we are just waiting for it to happen.

But that did NOT affect our firearms freedom! We can still purchase M1's. Just not THOSE M1's.

Is it your position that you believe he has no intentions on coming after the 2nd amendment?

My position is that while as senator, he was very anti-second ammendment. I will always have my doubt about him. But as president, he has done nothing, as of yet, that would affect our second ammendment rights. Stating otherwise is just ignorant. As to what his intentions are, i don't doubt that there are some gun-control issues he would like to bring to the table, but right now there are way too many other pressing issues for him to deal with. like the economy, unemployment rates, inflation, housing market, poverty levels. Gun control is one of the least important things to him at the moment.

 

[KomradRazvan]

And still no one has come forward to defend his appointment with any argument in favor that is coherent or sensible,... You're just willing to accept him cuz "the one" says so.

Is that crickets I hear??

I better not hear the word "sheeple" out of any of you lefties.

Are you blind?!?! or do you not comprehend the english language? No-one, not even me, has defended his appointment.

 

[Jamie6.5]

Then why do we hold confirmation hearings with two representatives from each state voting to approve or disapprove??

Seems odd when you have it all figured out!

If Bush wanted this guy you'd be screaming as loud as the rest of us.

 

[KomradRazvan]

Then why do we hold confirmation hearings with two representatives from each state voting to approve or disapprove??

Seems odd when you have it all figured out!

If Bush wanted this guy you'd be screaming as loud as the rest of us.

wow.. you remind me of LEAD!

I. AM. NOT. SAYING. HE. IS. THE. RIGHT. PERSON. FOR. THE. JOB.

I never once disputed your guys' claims to that. What I DID dispute, if you look at the beginning of the thread, is the misguided and misinformed notion that Obama's Presidency has done something to limit our second ammendment rights or our firearm freedoms. Infact, the way I see it, fears aside, under Obama gun rights have thrived. With many states passing pro-gun legislation.

 

[Jamie6.5]

Are you blind?!?! or do you not comprehend the english language? No-one, not even me, has defended his appointment.

No, I'm not blind. Or maybe I am,...
I keep looking for a leftie gun owner with NADS enough to stand up and say their Presidential pick has screwed the pooch this time.

But apparently either I am blind or those people don't exist,...
Yet you insist on arguing with those that oppose him publicly, relishing the idea that Obama hasn't done anything detrimental to gun rights,... YET!!

So you are either supporting Obama and his pick, or what? You just want to argue??

 

[KomradRazvan]

No, I'm not blind. Or maybe I am,...
I keep looking for a leftie gun owner with NADS enough to stand up and say their Presidential pick has screwed the pooch this time.

But apparently either I am blind or those people don't exist,...
Yet you insist on arguing with those that oppose him publicly, relishing the idea that Obama hasn't done anything detrimental to gun rights,... YET!!

So you are either supporting Obama and his pick, or what? You just want to argue??

read my previous post.

As for my personal opinion of Obama. I dont like him. He is the one who doesnt have the nads to do anything. Everything he has said he would do during his campaign, he has done half-assed. I don't want to stereotype, but he is african american... and u know what that stereotype is.... just sayin. When he had the majority, he should have taken a page from the republican playbook, and gone forth with his plans, rather than wait for bi-partisanship. Bush and Cheney didn't care about bi-partisanship, and they got what they wanted. But that is neither hear or there, and it is completely off-topic. If you want to discuss all these other issues with me, please feel free to PM me, or we can meet up for coffee sometime and just have a good natured political discussion. Sound good?

 

[Jamie6.5]

wow.. you remind me of LEAD!

I. AM. NOT. SAYING. HE. IS. THE. RIGHT. PERSON. FOR. THE. JOB.

I never once disputed your guys' claims to that. What I DID dispute, if you look at the beginning of the thread, is the misguided and misinformed notion that Obama's Presidency has done something to limit our second ammendment rights or our firearm freedoms. Infact, the way I see it, fears aside, under Obama gun rights have thrived. With many states passing pro-gun legislation.

Oh for chrissake go back to class.
Just because we aren't willing to sit on our hands and do nothing until it's too late, doesn't mean we are saying he's already done it.

But from all angles that I can see, he is surrounding himself with anti-gun people in critical places.
Those of us that are 2ndA advocates don't like that.
The OP posted a link that advocates a letter writing campaign. You apparently took offense to that and started railing about how nothing's been done,... YET!

We don't want to have to fight to get it back, we want to prevent a loss by heading off a bad appointment to a critical position.
Got that? I sincerely hope so.

 

[MA Duce]

Gotta admit there's a bit of a double standard. For example, Ronald Reagan actually did by far more to infringe upon gun rights than did Obama. Yet Obama is referred to as the most anti-gun president that has ever been and plenty of people will allege Reagan was pro-gun. Reagan gave lip service to the 2nd amendment, but in practice was often a strong opponent of gun rights.

That's something I will never understand about either Republicans or Democrats... or people in general I guess. How is that they're so willing to vehemently drag someone through the mud for doing or saying something, while completely dismissing it when someone of their own affiliation does the exact same thing. It almost seems like that Orwellian double-think... you know... the idea that two mutually exclusive, contradicting notions can be equally true at the same time. Frankly, when I see it happen, it's hard to take the individual's opinion seriously because it goes to show they're not really capable of free thought.

Beautifully put. There are plenty of folks..from both sides of the fence....who selectively choose the facts that fit the argument of the day rather than encompass the whole truth to reach a logical and sound decision.

 

[Jamie6.5]

read my previous post.

As for my personal opinion of Obama. I dont like him. He is the one who doesnt have the nads to do anything. Everything he has said he would do during his campaign, he has done half-assed. I don't want to stereotype, but he is african american... and u know what that stereotype is.... just sayin. When he had the majority, he should have taken a page from the republican playbook, and gone forth with his plans, rather than wait for bi-partisanship. Bush and Cheney didn't care about bi-partisanship, and they got what they wanted.

So we're back to Bush and Cheney,... *crickets*

He did get lot's done so far. It hasn't done squat for the populace, and there's a serious question as to whether it will,... He knew we were in the grips of a SERIOUS recession and chose to work on pet projects instead of the economy,...
The guy is clueless. And not just about guns either.

And as for racist stereotypes?? Shut the 773H up!!

 

[KomradRazvan]

Oh for chrissake go back to class.
Just because we aren't willing to sit on our hands and do nothing until it's too late, doesn't mean we are saying he's already done it.

But from all angles that I can see, he is surrounding himself with anti-gun people in critical places.
Those of us that are 2ndA advocates don't like that.
The OP posted a link that advocates a letter writing campaign. You apparently took offense to that and started railing about how nothing's been done,... YET!

We don't want to have to fight to get it back, we want to prevent a loss by heading off a bad appointment to a critical position.
Got that? I sincerely hope so.

Yeah, he hasn't made the best (in our opinion) appointments. I am not denouncing that, i agree with it. I did not take offense to what the OP said. In fact, i don't take offense to much, since this is the internet. lol. with that said... I did ask for an example of something he or anyone he has appointed has done anything opposing the 2nd ammendment (And it was a response to another comment, not to what the OP said). Surrounding yourself with anti-gunners does not oppose the 2nd ammendment. It is the president's perogative to try and appoint whomever he likes. If you don't like the lame duck congress, then why did you vote them in?

 

[Jamie6.5]

I never once disputed your guys' claims to that. What I DID dispute, if you look at the beginning of the thread, is the misguided and misinformed notion that Obama's Presidency has done something to limit our second ammendment rights or our firearm freedoms.

This is what you objected to, and how you did it Quote:

Originally Posted by Spad View Post
What can you expect from a slimeball president, hopefully the new House of Representatives will start to put the screws to him. I have to agree the worst president I have ever seen. He still has two years to go to inlflict his warped agenda on us. You will notice almost all of his appointments are anti-gun people, especially in positions to effect our firearms freedom. Scary...Spad

Can you please provide me with one example Obama or his administration has done since they are in power that his curtailed your firearms freedom? I would like just 1 example. Please?

If you read that whole post/quote again, you will find that Spad said nothing about what Obama had already done to gun rights. Neither had anyone else up to that point.
You made that up in your head apparently. Spad made some statements about what he thinks of Obama, and how he has surrounded himself with anti gunners in key positions and you went off on him,... And you've been defending your position rabidly ever since.

Oh those darned reading and comprehension skills.

 

[Jamie6.5]

If you don't like the lame duck congress, then why did you vote them in?

I didn't,..
But I did my best to see them voted out!

 

[KomradRazvan]

So we're back to Bush and Cheney,... *crickets*

He did get lot's done so far. It hasn't done squat for the populace, and there's a serious question as to whether it will,... He knew we were in the grips of a SERIOUS recession and chose to work on pet projects instead of the economy,...
The guy is clueless. And not just about guns either.

And as for racist stereotypes?? Shut the 773H up!!

What did he get done? What has Obama done that was the way he wanted it? NOTHING! And it is not the Bush and Cheney thing. I was actually giving them props for having the balls to get done what they wanted, where as Obama doesn't.

And i didn't make the stereotypes... don't blame me for that. I was just making an observation and drawing a connection between the two.

 

[Jamie6.5]

What did he get done? What has Obama done that was the way he wanted it?

Everything from healthcare to the green agenda and his attempts at cap and trade,...
Instead of working to dig us out of our fiscal mess that the Dems contributed greatly to.
Which is what he should have been doing.

 

[KomradRazvan]

This is what you objected to, and how you did it Quote:

If you read that whole post/quote again, you will find that Spad said nothing about what Obama had already done to gun rights. Neither had anyone else up to that point.
You made that up in your head apparently. Spad made some statements about what he thinks of Obama, and how he has surrounded himself with anti gunners in key positions and you went off on him,... And you've been defending your position rabidly ever since.

Oh those darned reading and comprehension skills.

It was the implied danger to our gun rights that has been stated here, as well as elsewhere, from conservatives and people that are spreading fear throughout the public. Until they provide some actual evidence that shows anything has been signed to take effect, it is nothing more than fear-mongering and paranoia.

I did not go off on him, but asked a simple question for an example. When I was asked the same question, i provided an answer. No one else has. Now you are "going off" on me, for asking 1 question, instead of actually answering the question itself. Hey, if you can't do it, just say so. I will understand.

 

[KomradRazvan]

Everything from healthcare to the green agenda and his attempts at cap and trade,...
Instead of working to dig us out of our fiscal mess that the Dems contributed greatly to.
Which is what he should have been doing.

PM me, and we will discuss these there.

 

[Karma]

But that did NOT affect our firearms freedom! We can still purchase M1's. Just not THOSE M1's.



My position is that while as senator, he was very anti-second ammendment. I will always have my doubt about him. But as president, he has done nothing, as of yet, that would affect our second ammendment rights. Stating otherwise is just ignorant. As to what his intentions are, i don't doubt that there are some gun-control issues he would like to bring to the table, but right now there are way too many other pressing issues for him to deal with. like the economy, unemployment rates, inflation, housing market, poverty levels. Gun control is one of the least important things to him at the moment.

True, we can still purchase M1's. If we could have imported those M1's it could have made that piece of history much more affordable for the average person to own. By keeping the supply down and demand high, the price tag for a decent M1 is pretty dang high.

He was very anti-second ammendment as a senator. I agree that he hasn't done anything yet directly to impact the second ammendment. He has been busy passing stuff like the several thousand page healthcare bill etc, which we still do not know exactly how it will impact our rights. I guess my problem is that we know where this is headed if he manages to get a second term. I think anyone who denies it is kidding themselves.

 

[Trlsmn]

Thats why i said "I'm not sure about this". lol. If you're going to quote me, make sure you read the quote before responding to it.

Your rebuttal post missed half the information I posted and that part you ignored was key to your ignorance. I can't blame you for trying to sweep the part of your argument that shows that the foundation of your argument is in error and flawed and everything else you have said is built on that ignorance, here it is again though just so yo can ignore it again.

Originally Posted by KomradRazvan View Post

Infact, if you really want to get into it, the whole M1 garand issue is a lose/lose for him. If he had bought them, he would be criticized for spending money we dont have on guns we dont really "need", but rather that some people just "want." He didn't go through with the buyback, so now he is getting criticized by you folks because you want a piece of American history.
OK time to show you the error of your ways and why you are just babbling conjecture based on a false premise.

Trlsmn

These Garands aren't being bought back by Obama or the US government nor even the CMP, they are being bought by private firearm importing companies such as CAI

 

[Trlsmn]

PM me, and we will discuss these there.

Don't waist your time PMing this guy Jamie he's the same brick wall only more personally insulting in PM where he thinks he can get away with it..