Oregon Measure 114 "Registry/list"?

[killing field]

Let me start by saying that from my understanding of the text of the 2A, anything less than "Constitutional Carry" is by definition, an infringement.

That being said, I saw a poll on here a month or so ago where people were saying they would not purchase from FFLs in the future if M 114's Registry/list went into effect. My confusion lies in other than it being public access, and thus an issue with Oregon's Red Flag laws, why is this any different than Oregon's current CHL and the ATF's Tax Stamp? I am pretty sure all of those applications are scanned and stored in a database somewhere, legally or not.

I am wondering if I am missing an angle of this, again, other than the public access? Yes, it sucks even more if this goes through, but it seems like we unfortunately already have several "lists" in place currently.

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[solv3nt]

Let me start by saying that from my understanding of the text of the 2A, anything less than "Constitutional Carry" is by definition, an infringement.

That being said, I saw a poll on here a month or so ago where people were saying they would not purchase from FFLs in the future if M 114's Registry/list went into effect. My confusion lies in other than it being public access, and thus an issue with Oregon's Red Flag laws, why is this any different than Oregon's current CHL and the ATF's Tax Stamp? I am pretty sure all of those applications are scanned and stored in a database somewhere, legally or not.

I am wondering if I am missing an angle of this, again, other than the public access? Yes, it sucks even more if this goes through, but it seems like we unfortunately already have several "lists" in place currently.

Other than the list that person keeps getting your BGCs, your CHL doesn't list what you own.

 

[ROTORYWING]

The CHL List is protected from pubic access

 

[FireArm]

the state and feds are not supposed to be keeping lists of gun owners and what they have purchased, they do, which is criminal.
there are a ton of laws that are a waste of time, and need to be rolled back, red flag laws, SB941, BM114, I could go on, they dont make our society better and are not worth the paper they are printed on or space they take up in some database somewhere

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Yet Portland was forced to delete their Gang Database because it was Racist!

 

[Member 53328]

Yet Portland was forced to delete their Gang Database because it was Racist!

Lucky for me. Being a gang banger and all.

 

[rurallife]

The CHL List is protected from pubic access

Apparently for awhile it was open for public viewing.

 

[TTSX]

It's 100% the publicly listed inventory of my safe that's the issue to me. I am not willing in any way to make an itemized shopping list for the neighborhood crackhead.

I have a CHL. Even if the public knew that, so what? It doesn't tell them if I have 1 hi point or 100 machine guns. It doesn't tell them phukall except I'm licensed to conceal a handgun.

I'm not required to knock on my neighbor's doors and tell them they live next to NFA items, complete with make and model, so phuk 'em. They don't get to know what's behind my doors just so they can tell a guy they know when I'm not home and to go shopping.

 

[arakboss]

Let me start by saying that from my understanding of the text of the 2A, anything less than "Constitutional Carry" is by definition, an infringement.

That being said, I saw a poll on here a month or so ago where people were saying they would not purchase from FFLs in the future if M 114's Registry/list went into effect. My confusion lies in other than it being public access, and thus an issue with Oregon's Red Flag laws, why is this any different than Oregon's current CHL and the ATF's Tax Stamp? I am pretty sure all of those applications are scanned and stored in a database somewhere, legally or not.

I am wondering if I am missing an angle of this, again, other than the public access? Yes, it sucks even more if this goes through, but it seems like we unfortunately already have several "lists" in place currently.

Don't worry, I believe that many of those who said they won't get a permit will end up getting one. Some people don't seem to mind being on lists. Pretty much every list is public in today's hacking environment.


Edit: I predict we will have a whole new generation of gunbuyers to replace me and others who refuse to get a purchase permit. Some people like doing things just because they are difficult and restricted. Those people may now feel that buying a gun is a worthy challenge.

 

[Jay Walk]

Anything that was FFL'd is registered.

Plenty of reports confirming ATF knocking on doors with a nice list of what you have.

 

[Stomper]

Lucky for me. Being a gang banger and all.

Sounds…… sexual!

 

[Member 53328]

Sounds…… sexual!

It is.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Let me start by saying that from my understanding of the text of the 2A, anything less than "Constitutional Carry" is by definition, an infringement.

That being said, I saw a poll on here a month or so ago where people were saying they would not purchase from FFLs in the future if M 114's Registry/list went into effect. My confusion lies in other than it being public access, and thus an issue with Oregon's Red Flag laws, why is this any different than Oregon's current CHL and the ATF's Tax Stamp? I am pretty sure all of those applications are scanned and stored in a database somewhere, legally or not.

I am wondering if I am missing an angle of this, again, other than the public access? Yes, it sucks even more if this goes through, but it seems like we unfortunately already have several "lists" in place currently.

The progression to control and eventually confiscate your guns goes like this:

Registration > incrementally expanding rules to allow you to have that registered gun > violation of a rule, or an outright ban > confiscation

Both WA and OR want a REGISTRY. Permits is how they can do that easily. That is, force people to register to exercise their given right.

Why do they want a registry? So they know where the guns are, so they can regulate them. And if the regulations get tighter and tighter every year, they have several reasons they can force you to no longer own that gun (confiscate). WA already has a law on the books to do yearly background checks for gun owners (they have not been able to implement it yet because they do not yet have a registry).

If you sign up for a permit you are signing up on a registry for future enforcement and possible confiscation.

If they pass a gun control law, and shootings continue (which they will), then they need tighter laws next year is what they will say. This method will continue until the restrictions are so tight you can't legally own a gun. As Coilon Noir said, look at Canada, first it was a list of dangerous weapons banned, then the next year handguns were banned, then the next year hunting guns were/will be? banned.

They will do exactly the same here if we let them. If you are in WA I would suggest passing this along to your legislators and let them know! Also empower those groups on the front lines who are suing them by donating to the fight. Also VOTE and encourage other gun owners to do the same so they don't lose their rights.

 

[WillametteWill]

Fast forward to about 4:45 where they explain how the ATF told GOA that they are going to use all the evidence everyone sends them to use to prosecute them after their application passes 88 days and is automatically denied. "I don't think they thought this through," well yes, nearly always the case with government policies.

If it sounds too good to be true...

 

[PiratePast40]

The video has nothing to do with M114. Good information, just posted in the wrong thread.

 

[WillametteWill]

The video has nothing to do with M114. Good information, just posted in the wrong thread.

It's posted in the pistol brace thread as well. My point is more that there is so much tracking of gun owners and that it should be no surprise that bad government actors will have no problem using it against people if it suits them.

 

[Camelfilter]

The video has nothing to do with M114. Good information, just posted in the wrong thread.

Moved.

 

[killing field]

The progression to control and eventually confiscate your guns goes like this:

Registration > incrementally expanding rules to allow you to have that registered gun > violation of a rule, or an outright ban > confiscation

Both WA and OR want a REGISTRY. Permits is how they can do that easily. That is, force people to register to exercise their given right.

Why do they want a registry? So they know where the guns are, so they can regulate them. And if the regulations get tighter and tighter every year, they have several reasons they can force you to no longer own that gun (confiscate). WA already has a law on the books to do yearly background checks for gun owners (they have not been able to implement it yet because they do not yet have a registry).

If you sign up for a permit you are signing up on a registry for future enforcement and possible confiscation.

If they pass a gun control law, and shootings continue (which they will), then they need tighter laws next year is what they will say. This method will continue until the restrictions are so tight you can't legally own a gun. As Coilon Noir said, look at Canada, first it was a list of dangerous weapons banned, then the next year handguns were banned, then the next year hunting guns were/will be? banned.

They will do exactly the same here if we let them. If you are in WA I would suggest passing this along to your legislators and let them know! Also empower those groups on the front lines who are suing them by donating to the fight. Also VOTE and encourage other gun owners to do the same so they don't lose their rights.

Glad you mentioned him, he has great videos.