M855 Ammo Ban

[captqc]

I just heard on the radio that the Obama/ATF M855 ammo ban is dead! Looks like we won a victory for a change!

 

[jac1304]

This is only the beginning "they" will be back.

 

[teflon6string]

I fully expect a severe shortage to set in and persist, just like with 22.

So in a sense, the emperor and his guffawing jester Joe Bidet still get their way - the agenda-driven obstruction of law abiding citizens from enjoying/exercising second amendment rights. All thanks to the creation of a vicious gray-market for opportunistic profiteers.

Damn I hope I'm wrong on this one.

 

[Caveman Jim]

I'm curious about the number of emails they've received. 80,000 sounds like a lot, but in reality, it's only a small percentage of the number gun owners out there. The NRA, last I checked, was in at over 5,000,000 members. That amounts to about 2% of all NRA members if we figure one email per member. And that doesn't account for all the folks that are gun owners, but not part of the NRA. It's estimated there are 80,000,000 to 100,000,000 gun owners in this country. So where the hell are they? Why doesn't the ATF have hundreds of thousands, or even millions of emails?

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy for this bump in the road for the ATF, but damn, why can't we get more folks to even sit on their butts and write a simple email? Is it that they don't care? Too apathetic? Aren't paying attention? Just don't give a sh!t? I'm just sorry to see such a lackluster performance on behalf of a nation of gun owners. And you know damn well there are millions of AR's out there. Does anyone really believe only 80,000 people own all of those rifles?

Sorry for the rant, but the numbers just really are disappointing.

Welcome to the club, I594 was a slap in the face to all pro gun pro 2A people in Washington. It all comes down to how many gun guys either didn't get off the couch to vote, had the mentality of "That'll never pass", or were brow beat by their ole ladies!!!

Oregon is feeling it too, just look at the pitiful turnout for the Salem gun rally, Hell I even attended that & I live in Washington!!!!

Complacency is the death for any of our constitutional rights and it will only get worse with the supposedly pro 2A people who believe that "common sense" gun control works and still continue to vote the D party line!!!

 

[Caveman Jim]

I just heard on the radio that the Obama/ATF M855 ammo ban is dead! Looks like we won a victory for a change!

Don't you dare celebrate yet!!!! This is not dead!!!!

 

[Member 3687]

This is not over just postponed till the frog settles down and can be put back into the pot.

So what do you want to bet say in 6 months to a year a false flag event will happen with a AR pistol and this ammo and over night it will be banned. . I will admit I do not trust my government.

I do not look good in tin foil either but I try to look at history and the US is not above doing covert operations to get its way.

Just look up US government and human experiments.

 

[etrain16]

Welcome to the club, I594 was a slap in the face to all pro gun pro 2A people in Washington. It all comes down to how many gun guys either didn't get off the couch to vote, had the mentality of "That'll never pass", or were brow beat by their ole ladies!!!

Oregon is feeling it too, just look at the pitiful turnout for the Salem gun rally, Hell I even attended that & I live in Washington!!!!

Complacency is the death for any of our constitutional rights and it will only get worse with the supposedly pro 2A people who believe that "common sense" gun control works and still continue to vote the D party line!!!

I was in Salem too, and was disappointed at the low turnout. I can't quite figure out what the issue is. I do think part of it is that people aren't aware - maybe they never get on a forum like this, maybe they either don't belong to a group like the NRA, OFF, SAF, etc. and so they don't get notifications. Maybe they don't watch the news or read news feeds online. Maybe that is part of it. And if that's true, how do we reach them? And once we reach them, how do we convince them they need to respond?

Or, maybe many people do know, but just don't think the fight is their responsibility. I personally hate having to spend my time and effort writing letters, making calls or attending meetings and rallys, but I really don't want to lose any more of my rights than I've already lost, so, it seems it has become a necessary part of life.

 

[DieselScout]

I was in Salem too, and was disappointed at the low turnout. I can't quite figure out what the issue is. I do think part of it is that people aren't aware - maybe they never get on a forum like this, maybe they either don't belong to a group like the NRA, OFF, SAF, etc. and so they don't get notifications. Maybe they don't watch the news or read news feeds online. Maybe that is part of it. And if that's true, how do we reach them? And once we reach them, how do we convince them they need to respond?

Or, maybe many people do know, but just don't think the fight is their responsibility. I personally hate having to spend my time and effort writing letters, making calls or attending meetings and rallys, but I really don't want to lose any more of my rights than I've already lost, so, it seems it has become a necessary part of life.

I am going to out on a limb here and say it has to do with the fact it was on a Monday and many of us work and cannot get as many days off as we want or need. Then combine that with the horrible weather.

 

[Member 3687]

Big win for regulators at supreme court.

The Supreme Court ruled 9-0 that federal agencies do not have to follow procedures for notifying the public and collecting comment when changing the interpretations of rules, effectively removing steps from the process that can take months and sometimes years to complete.


http://thehill.com/regulation/court...s-with-administration-in-rulemaking-challenge

If this is true this means the ATF can change its ruling at any time and do not need comments or anything else from the public.
They just change it and it becomes law this maybe the only reason why they said they would hold off is just so we would be quiet and then they can change it anytime they want.

Round 2: The war begins?

 

[Brutus57]

Here's my personal view of some of the gun rallies. Mask up, cause I guarandamtee they have folks getting nice imagery to interpret later on. Not to mention just the usual stuff all ready rolling for stop lights, traffic and security. I'd like to think they aren't but good OPSEC sez they are. Btw, one of the anti gun groups in Seattle is looking for a director. If I was closer I'd apply for the job just so could get an interview and
bubblegum them.

Brutus Out

 

[Flopsweat]

This isn't over yet. They've clearly stated that they are going to think about it some more. I take that to mean that they will look for another way to mess with the AR15 or its ammunition.

On an unrelated note, I have half a case of M855 left. First $1500 takes it.

 

[Martini_Up]

They raised the water temp more than they thought. And the frog jumped out! Boy is he pissed!

perfectly said! temp was turned up a bit too quick.

but we're still on the stove.

 

[bulzeye]

This isn't over yet. They've clearly stated that they are going to think about it some more. I take that to mean that they will look for another way to mess with the AR15 or its ammunition.

On an unrelated note, I have half a case of M855 left. First $1500 takes it.

good deal. well below gun show prices

 

[U201491]

We can absolutely do what is needed. The problem is, every time we want to act like Americans, the subjects claim we'll "make them look bad". Then, any time someone writes something that appears to defy this illegal regime, it is swiftly deleted from the record.

So, what is it you're doing to "fight" this? Are you simply signing the petition, or actually preparing to act like an American? You speak of complacency, yet there are so many of us that left cities to make real lives and real stands in places with like-minded individuals. The real laziness lies in those that somehow believe they can "talk down" rabid Anti's. "Compromise" implies that at some point the Anti's will say "Hey, you've given up enough. We're happy now.". Do you really think that will happen? Is The 2A just a decoration, or an actual right, to be used when necessary?

I didn't make The Constitution, I'm just here to help enforce it.

I have been locked and loaded since 1968 !

 

[U201491]

DAILY ALERT FOR Wednesday, March 11, 2015


NEWS
NRA Forces Obama to Wave White Flag on Proposed Ammo Ban … For Now
Fairfax, Va. – The National Rifle Association (NRA) was instrumental in stalling the Obama Administration's initial attempt to ban commonly used ammunition for the most popular rifle in America, the AR-15. The announcement that the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) will suspend its proposed framework to ban M855 ammunition validates the NRA's assertion that this effort was nothing more than a political maneuver to bypass Congress and impose gun control on the American people.


NEWS
NRA Forces Obama to Wave White Flag on Proposed Ammo Ban … For Now
Fairfax, Va. – The National Rifle Association (NRA) was instrumental in stalling the Obama Administration's initial attempt to ban commonly used ammunition for the most popular rifle in America, the AR-15. The announcement that the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) will suspend its proposed framework to ban M855 ammunition validates the NRA's assertion that this effort was nothing more than a political maneuver to bypass Congress and impose gun control on the American people.

 

[U8395279]

This isn't over yet. They've clearly stated that they are going to think about it some more. I take that to mean that they will look for another way to mess with the AR15 or its ammunition.

On an unrelated note, I have half a case of M855 left. First $1500 takes it.

That seems a bit high. I just purchased 750 rounds for $450 last week.

The ammo can still be found, if one looks for it.

.

 

[Sam Kinard]

I have been locked and loaded since 1968 !

Indeed. That's the reply I expected. Next time you've got "lazy American" comments, I'm sure you have a mirror in your home. The continued permission asking won't get you anywhere, so please stop pretending that writing letters gets anything done. Someone has to actually do the heavy lifting and not just complain from within the confines of what you yourself refer to as "Little Pyongyang".

In short, those of us growing our own food and setting up to live completely independent are not "lazy". We simply have learned that real efforts are wasted when surrounded by "Progressives". There's a VA in White City. Get the h*** out of there and get within communication range of like-minded folks. Even if you have been "Locked and loaded since 1968!"(Which is a good thing, please don't misunderstand.), you only have the two trigger fingers and are surrounded by a legitimate 1.5-2 million enemies.

I'd actually rather find common ground than division, but so many of us have left the crap to make a real life and, just maybe, a real America someday. We are not "lazy", we simply have known for years that playing within the system gets you nowhere. Well, to h*** with "the system". It left America, Freedom and Liberty behind long ago.

Riddle me this. Now that their ban has temporarily failed, do "they" create a false flag using M855, or do they just purchase it all, like DHS after Sandy Hook? Either way, "they" aren't listening and do not care that we have spoken. They will find another way around it, and you can believe they are working on it right now.

Sincerely, good luck to you and fight the good fight, whatever that may mean for you.

 

[Riot]

Now if we could get everyone to give a crap about 5.45x39, that would be great!

(ATF) received a request from the U.S. Customs and Border Protection agency (CBP) to conduct a test, examination and classification of Russian-made 7N6 5.45x39 ammunition for purposes of determining whether it is considered "armor piercing ammunition" as defined by the Gun Control Act (GCA), as amended.

When ATF tested the 7N6 samples provided by CBP, they were found to contain a steel core. ATF's analysis also concluded that the ammunition could be used in a commercially available handgun, the Fabryka Bronie Radom, Model Onyks 89S, 5.45x39 caliber semi-automatic pistol, which was approved for importation into the United States in November 2011. Accordingly, the ammunition is "armor piercing" under the section 921(a)(17)(B)(i) and is therefore not importable. ATF's determination applies only to the Russian-made 7N6 ammunition analyzed, not to all 5.45x39 ammunition. Ammunition of that caliber using projectiles without a steel core would have to be independently examined to determine their importability.

https://www.atf.gov/press/releases/...and-classification-7n6-545x39-ammunition.html

For the record, I don't even own (nor do I intend to own) anything in 5.45x39. However, this letter pre-dates the M855 attempt...no outcry...nothing. This set the tone as to what the ATF did later- try to ban all steel core rifle bullets under the premise that because they make pistols for them they are "armor piercing".

The same thing applies for the 5.45 as it does for the 5.56...they are RIFLE rounds and they are SUPPOSED to go through armor (level IIIA and below, respectively)...however, it's not until recently has the ATF been called out on their bullcrap.


This was not a win, folks...this was simply the ATF realizing where the line actually was...and apparently we only care about 5.56!

 

[Sam Kinard]

Now if we could get everyone to give a crap about 5.45x39, that would be great!



https://www.atf.gov/press/releases/...and-classification-7n6-545x39-ammunition.html

For the record, I don't even own (nor do I intend to own) anything in 5.45x39. However, this letter pre-dates the M855 attempt...no outcry...nothing. This set the tone as to what the ATF did later- try to ban all steel core rifle bullets under the premise that because they make pistols for them they are "armor piercing".

The same thing applies for the 5.45 as it does for the 5.56...they are RIFLE rounds and they are SUPPOSED to go through armor (level IIIA and below, respectively)...however, it's not until recently has the ATF been called out on their bullcrap.


This was not a win, folks...this was simply the ATF realizing where the line actually was...and apparently we only care about 5.56!

I'll tell you, it's been an odd thing being an AK74 shooter and general fanboy. On one hand, the "banning" of importation of 7N6 is quite appalling and amazingly illegal, but on the other hand it has had quite the opposite effect as the various AR threats of the past.

Prior to the banning of importation of 7N6, I had 2 rifles, 21 magazines and 4k rounds of 7N6 and another 1k of commercial. I now have, in only a few short months, 3 rifles, 48 magazines and just shy of 10k 7N6 and 3k commercial. Whereas everyone panicked and snatched up the 5.56, they dumped the 5.45 and that has been great for me.

I have no interest in a AR/AK debate(to each their own. I've made my decision.), but for my money and my family, the only way I would let go of my 74's(a Saiga, a Waffenwerks and an old Bulgarian on a Nodak Spud.), mags and ammo would be to replace them with high-grade AR's, mags and 13k rounds of 262. And since that would cost me all of my 74 stuff and an additional ten thousand dollars, I will gladly be one of the only dudes in SE Oregon firing 5.45x39.

I'm now feeling disgusted that an illegal violation of our BOR has worked in my favor. I guess since all the others worked against me, one was bound to pay off.

 

[Stomper]

Sam, every dog has his day.