I will soon have the trust, now what for SBR

Vaultman · May 21, 2016

My trust will be in place soon. I know I want to go with an SBR. Do I need to know the specs on what I am building (or having built) prior for applying with ATF? Assuming so, how many of the details do I need to know?
I looked through a bunch of threads, but didn't see it answered (Maybe my cart is way ahead of my horse).

Oh... I am in OryGUN.

John Gault · May 21, 2016

Buy a lower receiver for the size intended now. You'll need a receiver with a serial number and maker and model number to file. (unless using a 80%) Then e-file as soon as the trust is ready. You'll need to get the Trust put on an electronic file for submission online with BATFE. File size is limited depending on how detailed your trust is...

They will ask you on the form what caliber and barrel length. Pick one, it's not that important... I'm building 300 Blackout.. Once it's papered the lower can be used for any other caliber or length of barrel..
I got my approval with trust on e-file in less than 4 months...

PDXSparky · May 22, 2016

John Gault said:
They will ask you on the form what caliber and barrel length. Pick one, it's not that important... I'm building 300 Blackout.. Once it's papered the lower can be used for any other caliber or length of barrel..

AS long as it can be returned to it's original configuration. You can also return the firearm to title I status by writing to the BATFE to have them remove it from the registry.

Vaultman · May 22, 2016

John Gault said:
....They will ask you on the form what caliber and barrel length. Pick one, it's not that important... I'm building 300 Blackout.. Once it's papered the lower can be used for any other caliber or length of barrel..
I got my approval with trust on e-file in less than 4 months...

So I do not have to have this thing all picked out on paper. No need to know finished overall length... I thought I read somewhere that was needed.

Vaultman · May 22, 2016

PDXSparky said:
AS long as it can be returned to it's original configuration...

So I have to have and keep all the original parts so that I could put it back together?

jbett98 · May 22, 2016

Don't forget to engrave the lower per ATF form 1 specs.

John Gault · May 22, 2016

Vaultman said:
So I have to have and keep all the original parts so that I could put it back together?

No.... If you wanted to sell it as Non NFA you could put stock stuff back on and take it out of NFA ...

zul · May 22, 2016

Do you plan on buying an already-completed SBR or building the SBR yourself from a pistol or rifle? If you are buying you need to fill out a Form 4 for the transfer, and the dealer can help you with that (I have no experience with Form 4's personally so I don't know the details). If you're making it, you need to fill out a Form 1 and you WILL need to know the current manufacturer's markings and serial number. Which means you really need to buy the pistol/rifle/receiver that you want to make into an SBR before you fill out your paperwork to turn that firearm into an SBR.

For instance I just bought an MP5 clone to SBR. It is a pistol right now, but before I can buy and throw on a stock to make it perfect, I have to fill out my Form 1 and get it approved. On that Form 1 I write in the serial number and current manufacturer's name and location (in my case: MKE, Turkey) and a few other details like the barrel and overall length that the SBR will have once it is built. Once your form is approved, have it engraved with the "maker's name and location" (which is you) so "First Last, City, OR". There are more steps to take obviously like filling out the certification form, printing and signing everything in duplicate, but I'll assume you can figure that stuff out or can follow one of the online guides around here. Actually since you have a trust you can do an online Form 1 and have it come back even quicker. I can't help you with that since I do all my NFA stuff as an individual. Hope my ramblings on the subject help you out a little bit!

madmax · May 23, 2016

jbett98 said:
Don't forget to engrave the lower per ATF form 1 specs.

I always leave that box empty.

zul · May 23, 2016

madmax said:
I always leave that box empty.

You're still required by law to engrave the firearm. When you build up an SBR, you are the "maker" of said firearm and all manufacturers, importers, and makers are required to permanently mark the firearm with their name, city, and state, regardless of what you put in box 4h.

madmax · May 23, 2016

Well in my case it's a few sbs's But yeah I left it empty....... they signed off on it that way. Cant change it now.

Vaultman · May 23, 2016

Thank you guys.
Maybe I should give a little more of my scenario.

I have a completed lower, built for a rifle. I have no upper receiver or any of the upper parts yet.
I have tested my lower with a buddy of mines upper (rifle). Just to shoot 'my gun' and make sure I am capable of this new hobby... (not new to guns, just new to AR's and building anything mechanical).

If I wanted to, could I make this lower into a SBR?

zul · May 23, 2016

Vaultman said:
Thank you guys.
Maybe I should give a little more of my scenario.

I have a completed lower, built for a rifle. I have no upper receiver or any of the upper parts yet.
I have tested my lower with a buddy of mines upper (rifle). Just to shoot 'my gun' and make sure I am capable of this new hobby... (not new to guns, just new to AR's and building anything mechanical).

If I wanted to, could I make this lower into a SBR?

Sure. Just don't buy an SBR upper (or all the parts to build one) without having a pistol lower to attach it to. That would be constructive intent - wait until you have the approved Form 1 until you buy the upper/upper parts.

Most SBR's start as already manufactured rifles, pistols, or receivers. A smaller minority of people build them up from scratch as SBR's with an approved Form 1, but you need to be capable of making it from scratch (or from 80% complete receivers/flats). The Form 1 has a section to write down the original manufacturer's name, location, and serial number, so most people just make an SBR from an already complete pistol (by adding a stock) or rifle (by shortening the barrel).

PDXSparky · May 28, 2016

Vaultman said:
So I have to have and keep all the original parts so that I could put it back together?

Not really what I was getting at. If you register the lower as a SBR in 5.56 with a 10 inch barrel, you can still put any other caliber upper with any length of barrel on it temporarily as long as you are able to put the upper with the register caliber and barrel length back on the lower.