I will not comply

[Suge206]

Wow misterbill, I'm really not sure of what to make of your post, I will not call you a POS or make any degrading comments to you, I will say I believe charoit13 has every right (protected by the constitution) to say whatever he wants. and truly believe the government needs to hear people openly defy them so they know the very intent and maybe just maybe they will at some point think twice. I personally joined the U.S. ARMY on 1 Jan. 1986, 50 days before my 17th birthday I took a oath to defend my country against all enemy's foreign and DOMESTIC, I turned 17 at FT.Benning GA, and proudly served for 6 years and I feel the oath I took was a oath till the day I die, not just a six year oath. Don't F with my constitution is how I feel, now and forever I don't care who hears me say it.

we're always going to be debating and ammending the constituion as the FF intended it to be a living document. save the melodrama and theatrics

 

[DireWolf]

I'm willing to make happen if thats the way you want to see it. I still see it differently because the bullet will be landing inside the agressor of any sort,............ It won't be landing inside me.

So if not cops, are you able to clarify this statement?

 

[gehrheart]

Its not a living document.

 

[Medic!]

How to cook a frog= Turn the heat up slowly. If it get's too hot too fast he will jump out of the pot. Just a few degrees at a time. It will take some time . But the frog will end up getting cooked.
So far with gun control they have never taken too much. Sure Kali gun owners hate there rules. But they put there energy into geting arround the laws with things like bullet buttons. They tell themselves. It's not worth gettin nuts over!
And so our rights slip away. Never pulled too forcefully from our hands. I would bet we get more of this, vs. a gun grab thats seen as too unfair. A move even non gun folks would not like it. Devide and conquer. It needs to be kept'' us and them''. Just like taxing the too rich. Them and us. Gun nuts and child lovers. Gun nuts and responsible people. This is how they frame it.
The truth is our battle will be slow and by degrees. A big battle would be easy by compairison.
I'm not saying there is never a time to fight. But that time will be obvious. It will get so hot, so fast that you will be forced to jump.
Outside of talk among fellow gun owners. I dont see a time or good reason for saber rattling. I don't threaten. I don't bluff. Now with you guys Im good with a bit of a locker room pep-talk. Some folks are loud about there gun views. I'm glad there out there. It's just not me. It takes all kinds of people and methods to get our point accross. I think when it comes time to pick the mountain we want to die on. We will all pick the same one.

 

[chariot13]

So if not cops, are you able to clarify this statement?

An agressor (offender of the constitution)of any sort. Its clarified perfectly.

 

[DireWolf]

An agressor (offender of the constitution)of any sort. Its clarified perfectly.

So.... city cops, county sheriffs, troopers, feds, national guard, all comers, huh?

 

[Kid@Heart]

So.... city cops, county sheriffs, troopers, feds, national guard, all comers, huh?

Well obviously it has to be less than ten of the above if I am to use the "New and Improved ACME 10 round Maxi clipmagazine".

 

[chariot13]

So.... city cops, county sheriffs, troopers, feds, national guard, all comers, huh?

"against all enemies, foreign and domestic;"

 

[DireWolf]

"against all enemies, foreign and domestic;"

"Yes" would have taken fewer keystrokes.

 

[WasrNwarpaint]

Well Chariot, that's a pretty safe oath since neither the Oregon State Legislature nor the Federal government seem in any way willing to inflict any further restrictions upon you.

Like most of these screeds, I have to call BS.

You mean you're willing to KILL cops, charged with law to come confiscate SOME of your arms, and not maybe, but CERTAINLY die in the attempt?

Come out and say it or you're a poser and a coward.

If you think you dying is anything but CERTAINTY, you're too stupid to take seriously. If you WEREN'T serious then why are you posting this stupid thread?

"Go-time," has been much over-stated in these forums. But if it's "go-time" why would you be stupid enough to announce it to your enemies? Unless, oh, yes, you have no intention of anything like what you said, you're only talking trash on the IntarWebs.

Stop talking trash on the internet and start writing letters to everyone in congress and you state legislature. -No, wait, that would take actual time and effort, as opposed to showing us your false bravado, which only takes a keyboard commando's screed on the intarwebs.

BS? I said come get them, who said I was willing to die for a gun, Ill use my gun to keep from dying.....My defiance isnt bravado, I simply refuse to make it easy for anyone to mess with me...so if you claim your coming to get my right full possessions, you wont find it easy, should you threaten my life....you now have a problem.....this is how I lived my life,Im no different today than the rest of my years as a 1%ER

 

[Suge206]

Its not a living document.

Twenty-seven amendments have been ratified since the original signing of the Constitution

 

[billstaf]

Well Chariot, that's a pretty safe oath since neither the Oregon State Legislature nor the Federal government seem in any way willing to inflict any further restrictions upon you.

Like most of these screeds, I have to call BS.

You mean you're willing to KILL cops, charged with law to come confiscate SOME of your arms, and not maybe, but CERTAINLY die in the attempt?

Come out and say it or you're a poser and a coward.

If you think you dying is anything but CERTAINTY, you're too stupid to take seriously. If you WEREN'T serious then why are you posting this stupid thread?

"Go-time," has been much over-stated in these forums. But if it's "go-time" why would you be stupid enough to announce it to your enemies? Unless, oh, yes, you have no intention of anything like what you said, you're only talking trash on the IntarWebs.

Stop talking trash on the internet and start writing letters to everyone in congress and you state legislature. -No, wait, that would take actual time and effort, as opposed to showing us your false bravado, which only takes a keyboard commando's screed on the intarwebs.

This is an unwarranted comment. Everybody has their point of no return. Some will stand and fight, others will cut and run. Obviously, misterbill would elect to do the latter. I expect that Chariot would stand by his comment and do his best to prevent his constitutional rights from being taken away by the force of a police state. At some point we may all be faced with making a tough decision like this. In the end it will matter to each of us just how much freedom we are willing to part with to stay safe from our own government.

Nobody in his right mind wants to get into an armed confrontation with the police. The likelihood of winning such an engagement is pretty small unless one is part of an organized and well-armed resistance. Individually, there is virtually no real chance of success. At that point each one of us must finally decide just what it is we might be willing to die for.

We need to remain vigilant. We need to stay on the right side of the law (cops aren't the enemy), we need to become much more organized than we are (where the hell is the NRA?), and we need to hold on to the moral high ground.

Misterbill: You chastised Chariot for exercising his 1st Amendment rights. Are you telling us here that you are willing to cede both the 1st and 2nd Amendments to the state. Perhaps you are French?

 

[Father of four]

Twenty-seven amendments have been ratified since the original signing of the Constitution

I do not consider it a "living document". I see it more like...Originalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[kibs45]

Twenty-seven amendments have been ratified since the original signing of the Constitution

Ammending the constitution, is different from reinterpreting the constitution. When people reference the constitution as a "Living Document" they are usually referring to "new, or redefined meaning". That is absolute and total garbage. I highly doubt anyone here would argue that the constitution couldn't be ammended, especially when there is constitutional guidance on how to ammend it.

 

[dmancornell]

I'm totally cool with amending the Constitution... when the change tells the government to FOAD. For example:

1-10, 13, 21 = examples of good amendments, the government decided to take a hike
16, 18 = bad examples, the government granted itself new power

 

[Squidly]

Twenty-seven amendments have been ratified since the original signing of the Constitution

Yes, but the first 10 are known as the Bill of Rights. To call it a living document leaves it open to be ignored. Consider the Patriot Act I & II, and the NDAA. How much of the Constitution did they nullify with those? Are you willing to accept more loss of liberty? Where will you draw the line?

 

[gehrheart]

Twenty-seven amendments have been ratified since the original signing of the Constitution

Yep true enough... your point?

I still see it as written in stone. You have to make an amendment, an addition to take away or to add to it. Not just change the wording around, or interpret it differently than they did 50, 100, 200 years ago. Those words are as they say, per what they say and no room to change them without following the rules set by it.
A living document would allow for changes to law to "adapt to modern times"
you can say well, they didn't have internet then, so the first only sort of applies to the internet.
You can say they did not have AR15's then so doesn't really apply to black guns.
You can say they didn't have phones then so yea.. we can tap those..

the bill of rights is not NOT A LIVING DOCUMENT!

 

[chariot13]

"Yes" would have taken fewer keystrokes.

Enemies are not limited to only certain jobs, colors, ages, sexes, religions etc......

 

[Father of four]

How to cook a frog= Turn the heat up slowly. If it get's too hot too fast he will jump out of the pot. Just a few degrees at a time. It will take some time . But the frog will end up getting cooked.
So far with gun control they have never taken too much. Sure Kali gun owners hate there rules. But they put there energy into geting arround the laws with things like bullet buttons. They tell themselves. It's not worth gettin nuts over!
And so our rights slip away. Never pulled too forcefully from our hands. I would bet we get more of this, vs. a gun grab thats seen as too unfair. A move even non gun folks would not like it. Devide and conquer. It needs to be kept'' us and them''. Just like taxing the too rich. Them and us. Gun nuts and child lovers. Gun nuts and responsible people. This is how they frame it.
The truth is our battle will be slow and by degrees. A big battle would be easy by compairison.
I'm not saying there is never a time to fight. But that time will be obvious. It will get so hot, so fast that you will be forced to jump.
Outside of talk among fellow gun owners. I dont see a time or good reason for saber rattling. I don't threaten. I don't bluff. Now with you guys Im good with a bit of a locker room pep-talk. Some folks are loud about there gun views. I'm glad there out there. It's just not me. It takes all kinds of people and methods to get our point accross. I think when it comes time to pick the mountain we want to die on. We will all pick the same one.

I want to eat some fried frog legs now...thanks.

 

[MountainBear]

I think there is an awful lot of talk around here. That's good. It's a forum for discussion of gun related issues. But how much is bravado? How many people who are saying 100% "I won't comply" are sure about that? I'm not. It's easy to say and I am sure that I will not participate in turn-ins or buy-backs. But if someone shows up at my door to forcibly ensure my compliance? I don't know. I've never been put in that situation. I hope I never am. I hope none of us are...

Please remember people. There is nothing wrong with not being sure how you would react. There IS something wrong with not standing and fighting to make sure that we never have to find out.