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How neurotic is this?

Discussion in 'Ammunition & Reloading' started by speeddemon94, Apr 23, 2013.

  1. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    So, a few weeks ago I sat down and did an nice long run of .223. LC brass, 69gr Sierra Match Kings, and 22.6gr of H335 (lee perfect powder measure on my Pro 1000)

    I got to wondering, and to make sure I was not over charging the loads, I sat down last night with my scale and weighed them all.

    The lowest total weight was 185.5gr and the highest was 190.5, with most of them being in the 187.3-188gr weight. I know my powder measure is not the most accurate, so I made sure to throw a little low to start with, so I am not worried anymore with over/under charge.

    My question is: Could the cases be accounting for most of the differences I'm seeing?

    These were not loaded for super accuracy, it was just a run for learning and to get some rounds put back.
     
  2. deadeye

    deadeye Albany,OR. Moderator Staff Member

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    The brass is most likely the biggest variable but if you have some bullets left from that batch you used I would weigh some of those to see what part they are playing also.
     
  3. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    I did weigh some as I loaded, and they were close enough to each other to make very little difference. I figured it was mostly brass.
     
  4. P7id10T

    P7id10T Cedar Hills Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Never checked myself but I understand that primers can also vary by a grain or two.

    I haven't played with H335 but I would suspect you would see a huge difference in the case level of a 223Rem with 5 more grains of powder, heck with even 2 more grains of powder.
    Lately in the loadings I've done (308 Win), a 1/2 grain of powder makes a noticeable difference in the case.
     
  5. Mark W.

    Mark W. Silverton, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I have some Bullets that across 500 pc's varied by 6 grs. Granted these were Coated lead. But even High end match grade bullets can vary in a box. But deadeye is correct the most likely variable is the brass.
     
  6. Cameron72

    Cameron72 Harrington, WA Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I make it a habit to check the weight of the powder thrown by measure every 10 to 20 rounds as I make them. Then I don't have to wonder what I've made.
     
  7. Throckmorton

    Throckmorton Florence,Ore ah gone Well-Known Member

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    wighing loaded bullets won't tell u much ,if anything. Too many variables with the components.Heck,a piece of media or 2 hiding in a case could easily make you go 'WTH??!'. and it would be no problem at all in there,shooting-wise.
     
  8. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    I did this randomly as well. My guess is that most of the variation is coming from the cases and the fact that the powder measure is not the most accurate thing in the world.

    I will definitely load shell by shell for accuracy loads and bypass that part of my system. Particularly for my 308.

    I'm pretty sure I'm close enough for standard utility rounds.
     
  9. ron22250

    ron22250 Newberg Member

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    Another something to think about is this. As the hopper empties the the weight of the powder pushing down lessens which may change the charge thrown. Keep the hopper full :)
     
  10. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    I do! Plus, I took to giving my powder thrower a little tap to make sure it both filled and then emptied. I found I got far more consistent charges that way.

    Now I just need to get some more powder and pills to finish off the rest of the brass and primers I have.
     
  11. bellarum

    bellarum beaverton Well-Known Member

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    If you want to get real crazy you can weigh your trimmed cases (uniform the flash holes too). Batch them by weight. Do the same with your primers and projectiles. hand weigh each powder charge. That will be as close as your rounds will ever get to an average weight. You will find that if you start batching all of your components to try and make consistent ammo; you will have batches of a bunch of different overall weights. Check each batch over your chrono and see if going that route gets you your desired results. Good luck!
     
  12. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    When I checked my 556/223 brass,I was astounded at how close they were in weight.And I bought 3 gallons of it.
    This was primmered brass too
    If it's plinking ammo,shouldn't matter too much. Probably way with in what factory ammo is,lol

    Oh and to answer your question,


    VERY!:wave:
     
  13. amcardon

    amcardon Mustang, OK Member

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    I think you should do some more experimentation and trade me some of your match kings for a different bullet weight, ya know, just to be absolutely sure that it's not the bullet causing the discrepancy ;)

    But if you decide against trading bullets, which would be crazy because it is your absolute best option, then I would lean towards the brass being the culprit.
     
  14. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, aside from the 77gr SOST rounds, which I have not seen to purchase, the 69gr pills are my favorite.
     
  15. Shooter98

    Shooter98 McMinnville, Or. Member

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    Well, you're question is breaking the threshold of the start of loading "match" ammo. When most of us load match ammo, the first thing we do after we deprime, clean and trim brass is to seperate them by weight. Each time you trim a case you're changing it's weight. Then we weigh the bullets and seperate them as well. So, as my rambling is trying to state, lol, yes, if you don't pay attention to variations then your ammo will have quite a bit of variation of weight between loaded bullets even using all the same brass.
     
  16. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, and these are just to have, full magazines give me a warm fuzzy. Like I said, for the .308 I'll be ultra neurotic, but I will hunt with that ammo as well.

    I'm bringing a box with a smattering of loads to fire next week. Some match, some ballistic tips, and a few factory, just for comparisons sake.
     
  17. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    And, I want to pick up a little single stage press, so I can eventually fiddle with rounds at the range. That way I can really be anal about my long range loads.
     
  18. Shooter98

    Shooter98 McMinnville, Or. Member

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    I've always been interested in doing the same thing, but after shooting with a couple of guys that do this, man it seems like a huge pain in the butt! lol...
     
  19. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    Well, I think that method is likely the hands down best if you are working up a load. The press, dies in the quick changers, a little pocket scale, and funnel, but yeah, I bet it's a pain. Though, once you have your load worked up you could go home and replicate in quantity.
     
  20. Shooter98

    Shooter98 McMinnville, Or. Member

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    I agree, and I'm going to have to start doing the same thing soon. When we go shooting I'll be trying out new 308 loads so I'll have 25 rounds of 5 round packs that I'll be trying out. I do have a semi portable Lee ss press with a portable stand that I guess I can haul out there some day, lol,