International Gun control in heavily-armed Switzerland faces May 19 vote, and the Swiss are grumbling

[E4mafia]

My understanding is Switzerland isn't part of the EU so why adopt something you aren't formally part of??

I see Germany is on a new career path of conquering. RIP medpack bros if true.

 

[Mikej]

My understanding is Switzerland isn't part of the EU so why adopt something you aren't formally part of??

I see Germany is on a new career path of conquering. RIP medpack bros if true.

Read below....

For what it's worth: the voter turn-out (EU-Waffenrichtlinie, Beteiligung) was only 43.9%.

I think it's important to again note that the choices given to the voters were:

#1. Slightly more restrictive firearms laws, keep Schengen and Dublin
#2. No change to firearms laws, lose Schengen and Dublin

Sunday's vote wasn't about the Swiss wanting more restrictive gun laws, but rather not wanting to lose the advantages of the Schengen and Dublin agreements. Of course you can discuss whether options other than #1 or #2 above might have been possible with proper negotiation, but that's a separate topic.

What ever Schengen and Dublin are, must be important to those folks.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Read below....

Schengen Visa - Comprehensive information about Europe Visa



What ever Schengen and Dublin are, must be important to those folks.

The Schengen Agreement signed on June 14, 1985, is a treaty that led most of the European countries towards abolishment of their national borders, to build a Europe without borders known as "Schengen Area". Signed in Luxemburg, initially by only five EU countries, the agreement remains one of the world's biggest areas that have ended border control between member countries.

for Dublin Agreement;

Dublin Regulation - Wikipedia

One of the principal aims of the Dublin Regulation is to prevent an applicant from submitting applications in multiple Member States. Another aim is to reduce the number of "orbiting" asylum seekers, who are shuttled from member state to member state. The country in which the asylum seeker first applies for asylum is responsible for either accepting or rejecting the claim, and the seeker may not restart the process in another jurisdiction.

Basically; the EU member states pressured Switzerland to adopt their gun control schemes; in order to maintain these two agreements whose goal is towards open borders and expedited asylum provisions

Economically, the Schengen Agreement grants member states a free, borderless travel within Europe via the Schengen Visa; I do wonder if eventually there would be an "United States(or United Provinces, or United Serfdoms) of Europe"; which may be patterned somewhat like the United States but with a vastly different governmental system..... The concept of an United Europe is very old; its just the citizens in there are still quite insistent on maintaining their individual identities, but willing to bend over for an unified set of laws and codes that treats them as serfs/peasants regarding individual liberty

These are interesting times indeed.

 

[Camelfilter]

Read below....





What ever Schengen and Dublin are, must be important to those folks.

Schengen is kinda like a pre-European Union, but comprises more countries than the EU.

Schengen agreements & rules have since been absorbed into EU rules.

So kinda leaves non EU Schengen countries tails hanging out in the wind as far as economic threats/consequences go. Making there individual economies easier to manipulate, sorta, if they do not play along with the majority. Simplistically.

 

[Mikej]

for Dublin Agreement;

Dublin Regulation - Wikipedia


Basically; the EU member states pressured Switzerland to adopt their gun control schemes; in order to maintain these two agreements whose goal is towards open borders and expedited asylum provisions

Economically, the Schengen Agreement grants member states a free, borderless travel within Europe via the Schengen Visa; I do wonder if eventually there would be an "United States(or United Provinces, or United Serfdoms) of Europe"; which may be patterned somewhat like the United States but with a vastly different governmental system..... The concept of an United Europe is very old; its just the citizens in there are still quite insistent on maintaining their individual identities, but willing to bend over for an unified set of laws and codes that treats them as serfs/peasants regarding individual liberty

These are interesting times indeed.

Schengen is kinda like a pre-European Union, but comprises more countries than the EU.

Schengen agreements & rules have since been absorbed into EU rules.

So kinda leaves non EU Schengen countries tails hanging out in the wind as far as economic threats/consequences go. Making there individual economies easier to manipulate, sorta, if they do not play along with the majority. Simplistically.

Thank you gentlemen. I did know it was something along those lines. Here's what I see. These little countries over there really do NEED trade agreements because they don't have everything they need within their borders to survive as an island. To survive they must trade materials with other countries. It seems like a sort of blackmail to me. Wouldn't the US be able to survive, feed and protect it's people with zero help from any other countries? I'm not saying it would be an idea situation. But as I understand, if the US hadn't stepped up and helped England during WWII many people would have died, and/or ended up speaking German?

I'm sure glad I was born in America. Best damned country in the world. If we can just keep our unique identity things will stay fine.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Thank you gentlemen. I did know it was something along those lines. Here's what I see. These little countries over there really do NEED trade agreements because they don't have everything they need within their borders to survive as an island. To survive they must trade materials with other countries. It seems like a sort of blackmail to me. Wouldn't the US be able to survive, feed and protect it's people with zero help from any other countries? I'm not saying it would be an idea situation. But as I understand, if the US hadn't stepped up and helped England during WWII many people would have died, and/or ended up speaking German?

I'm sure glad I was born in America. Best damned country in the world. If we can just keep our unique identity things will stay fine.

I agree that trade and tourism is vital to the economy. Really the EU is threatening the equivalent of "economic sanctions" to the Swiss if they don't comply with EU gun regs.

 

[Mikej]

I agree that trade and tourism is vital to the economy. Really the EU is threatening the equivalent of "economic sanctions" to the Swiss if they don't comply with EU gun regs.

Like I said, "Blackmail"! Where as the sanctions the US and other countries put on the like of Iran and North Korea are to urge those leaders to quit being threats to other countries, or their own people.

This "One World Order" thing really creeps me out. Luckily I don't see that happening in MY life time. None of us here will ever know most likely.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Given the size of Europe, a better analogy may be that of the United States. Could the individual States survive without the economic advantages of free travel and trade with other States in the US? Most likely not. Each State has a form of sovereignty, yet must abide to the Federal Constitution (though many States seem to subvert the Constitution on a few key points)
It is mostly the same with the EU; except that there are a few nations that are not yet part of the EU but abide by the EU agreements, those could be considered territories, similar to Puerto Rico and the US Virgin Islands, among others

 

[Camelfilter]

...I'm sure glad I was born in America. Best damned country in the world.

Darn tootin!!

...If we can just keep our unique identity things will stay fine.

The globalists sure are trying their darnedest to bring us down.

Our infrastructure is likely the easiest & biggest hit, currently.

Major sectors are now outsourced, completely, which would take years to bring back. Would need start up from scratch (think primary source steal milling/refining as a simple example), extrapolate that into multitudes of manufacture.

One of the bigger things that pops into my mind here is our electric grid, and the components that keep it limping along. Many of the larger components, if failed catastrophically, would need years to get replaced...and that's using all outsourced stuff. No manufacturing ability here anymore for them.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Major sectors are now outsourced, completely, which would take years to bring back. Would need start up from scratch (think primary source steal milling/refining as a simple example), extrapolate that into multitudes of manufacture.

In the last few years, there has been rumors and studies of "reshoring" of American manufacturing....since China's middle class is growing and the labor pool there of young Chinese workers are demanding higher wages and better conditions; or they move to the US for the education and jobs with better pay (relatively); that its supposedly starting to get cheaper to get US sourced steel products than it is to pay the increased costs of Chinese manufacturing and shipping...along with the new tariffs but honestly, it may take a few decades before a full reshoring happens... I do know that increasingly, there is a trend among people my age and younger, to set up "maker spaces" as places to make objects that are not found in catalogs; so there may be a growing pool of employees who are willing to actually work...maybe not the same kind of work, but work nonetheless.

Reshoring Initiative | Reshoring Initiative

 

[Mikej]

One of the bigger things that pops into my mind here is our electric grid, and the components that keep it limping along. Many of the larger components, if failed catastrophically, would need years to get replaced...and that's using all outsourced stuff. No manufacturing ability here anymore for them.

Not that it would work now, but....What kind of manufacturing ability did we have when we entered WWII after Pearl Harbor was bombed? I think about that frequently. Wifey got a bunch of old pennies from and old acquaintance so we turned them in at Liberty Coin. Steel pennies aren't worth much, but they sure make me think. And nickles were made with partial silver during the war becuse nickle was needed.. Food/gas/tire rationing coupons. Sad part is, after all these generations have since passed, could we still step up and do what we did in WWII again.?

 

[CamoDeafie]

Sad part is, after all these generations have since passed, could we still step up and do what we did in WWII again.?

perhaps. I am seeing personally, a growing number of people learning to do blacksmithing, manufacturing, foundry working, finding creative ways to recycle old plastics (that guy with the lego recycler is a good example lol) into new goods; and there are more workshops locally that is dedicated to learning how to repair, solder, and troubleshoot electronics, usually in retirement homes where the older guys are passing on their knowledge to the kids... Also am seeing a trend of "DIY" creation on social media sites, so there is hope. Maybe it won't be the exact same as how we did manufacturing in WW2, but maybe much more efficient and faster, or alternately, going a different route to get the same results? Instead of a large scale, industrialized, centralized manufacturing, but large scale, cottage industry/high competition between smaller shops for smaller contracts and so on?

 

[surevaliance]

I find it unbelievable that a nation of marksmen would give up their guns. The Swiss were the last people I would have guessed to give up their rights.

Well, for me and mine I say come and take them.

Yep...