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Chrome lined barrel?

Discussion in 'Preparedness & Survival' started by Medic!, Jan 12, 2015.

  1. Medic!

    Medic! What just happened? Has eagle eyes. But cant remember what he saw. Bronze Supporter

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    We all take good care of our rifles. Well, at least we keep them dry and store them under our roof.
    But what if they had to live outside in the weather with us?

    Most think chrome lined barrels are for preventing throat erosion. And A chrome chamber helps with extraction. Plus a chrome barrel cleans up easier. But what about just having a bit of insurance against rust?

    I just fixed a friends Weatherby hunting rifle that had extraction problems. What I found and removed. Was rust in the chamber.
    Of course it could have been prevented. But the difference in this gun, is that it has spent many months hunting in Canada. So It's out in the elements for weeks at a time. In the rain and snow.

    It got me to thinking? How many people betting on there guns in a SHTF . Have no idea what the elements can do to a gun? Once it's not living a pampered life.

    Think your gun is up to the task? Even after a dip in the river? And days of neglect while you worry about surviving. And are possibly constantly on the move?

    I always here the argument ''The average person dose not need a chrome lined barrel''
    Well........To that I would say. ''A bug out gun should not be the average gun''. Is yours?
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2015
  2. Joe13

    Joe13 NW of Vancouver Opinionated & Blunt Bronze Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    Mines lined but I keep a balloon over the Muzzel to help while I've got it shouldered when out hunting.

    I keep a small bottle of oil and a rag in my bug bag just for keeping her lubed while out in the PNW.

    Good thread idea
     
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  3. SheepDog223

    SheepDog223 Salem Well-Known Member

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    Great observation. I will be taking that into consideration from now on. Time for some retrofitting....
     
  4. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    Well.... Most of them are Stainless, but some are steel have a chrome chamber and bore and some do not.

    There is something to be said for a chrome lined bore for sure.
     
  5. Caveman Jim

    Caveman Jim West of Oly Springer Slayer 2016 Volunteer

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    I will revert back to my military training, "but Sarge we haven't fired them in a week" Shut your pie hole private and clean that @*^^$!@ rifle!!!!!!
    I know that care for your PDW is one of the top priorities when surviving.
     
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  6. Medic!

    Medic! What just happened? Has eagle eyes. But cant remember what he saw. Bronze Supporter

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    Well stainless is more rust resistant. But I have seen stainless guns rust also. It's the carbon in the steel that rusts. True stainless is nonferrous. It will not attract a magnet.
    Try and attract a magnet to your stainless King Cobra, or rifle barrel and it will. That's carbon.

    I think true stainless is to hard on the cutting tools used to make guns and barrels. So they use a softer ferrous version. True stainless is prone to galling. It's very hard. Witch makes sense, since they add chromium to steel to make it stainless.

    There is something to be said for stainless, and blue steel. They are better in some applications. For match grade accuracy. Give me a stainless barrel!
    But with a bug out AR, or AK . I think chrome is the way to go. Sure at the range a non-chrome AR bore will do everything a chrome one will do. However with prolonged exposure to the elements [water] it can do something a chrome barrel AR bore can't. Rust!

    As for accuracy? I see no hard fast rule that a chrome bore is inaccurate. The chrome barrel FNAR I had was guaranteed for 1'' from the factory. And it did better than that. And FN's chrome barrel bolt guns will shoot 1/2''or better. The Colt M-4 6920's are chrome lined. And they shoot as good as other non-chrome 16'' AR's . Better than some non-chrome lined! So chrome guns can be accurate.

    A cheep gun company will make a cheep chrome barrel. And it's lack of accuracy has nothing to do with the fact it's chrome. It's because it's done cheaply.
    Put differently. Some folks think chrome barrels are inaccurate because they had a brand-x rifle and it was inaccurate. When the chrome had nothing to do with it's accuracy! It's not accurate because it's brand-x!
     
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  7. Derbarbarian

    Derbarbarian Seattle New Member

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    Hey guy's just saw this thread, I was actually doing some outdoor research and ran across these a couple days ago and I found these. The price seems a bit crazy, but I'm sure you could rig something like that up yourself for much cheaper. Seems like it would be a pretty good idea if a SHTF scenario pops up and we're all stuck in the woods of the wondering PNW.
     
  8. Medic!

    Medic! What just happened? Has eagle eyes. But cant remember what he saw. Bronze Supporter

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    A plastic gun bag would kinda block your access to the controls. Don't you think?

    Besides my rifle's not made out of sugar. It won't melt from a little water! :s0140:
     
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  9. Sam Kinard

    Sam Kinard Active Member

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    Fortunately, at 5,000 ft. in the SE Oregon mountains, we get a lot of practice with this stuff. We keep chrome-lined barrels on our AK74's and a few others, but the bottom line is that when your rifle is what you depend upon for life and not just some pretty and fun things in a safe, you will be much more likely to check your firearms every night and lube and clean as necessary. I believe it's akin to having a horse for when the SHTF, but then never feeding or watering it and wondering why it died 3 days after the collapse.

    In Alaska and so many other places are hunting guides like Phil Shoemaker. These guys have used and in many cases still use bolt guns that border on antique and they use them every day in mud, rain, snow and ice. They do not send their guns away to be chrome lined, they put a strip of electrical tape over the bore to prevent spiders from nesting at night and weather and other things getting in there during the day. It's amazing how many people hunted Alaska, Canada or any other inclement weather for so many decades without a chrome lined bore and had incredible success.

    In my opinion, this is another example of an argument that will go on forever. AK47's are plenty accurate and AR15's won't gum up with carbon like they did in the '60's. 9mm is a plenty deadly self-defense round, so is the 45acp. 1911's are wonderful and so are Glocks.

    I believe in a survival situation, you will keep your knife sharp and your rifle clean and lubed. You will keep your socks dry and your six covered. I believe when it happens, 25 years after the fact, there will be people still carrying chrome lined barrels and chambers and there will be those with circa 1900 8mm Mausers and '06 Springfields and as long as they are well maintained, they will all work fine.
     
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  10. Sam Kinard

    Sam Kinard Active Member

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    Those bags seem great for making a jump into a body of water. If we were being deployed from helicopters, what would we be hiding in the woods for?
     
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  11. Medic!

    Medic! What just happened? Has eagle eyes. But cant remember what he saw. Bronze Supporter

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    You can keep any gun/barrel pristine.
    But if you lack time, training or cleaning supplies a chrome barrel would be nice. Can it hurt?

    People never plan on not planning.
     
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  12. Sam Kinard

    Sam Kinard Active Member

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    Absolutely. I'm only saying that if you have firearms that do not have chrome-lined barrels or chambers, you do not need a gunsmith to do a $1,500 job on your rifle and you do not have to sell your rifles and replace them with those that are chrome. I completely agree with your assessment, especially of the FN/Browning examples that chrome-lining is conducive to accuracy. At the same time, the accuracy culled from $3-350 Ruger/Savage/Remington and other bargain basement rifles is amazing these days and what really goes into the barrel of a $325 rifle? $20? $15?

    Legendary Arms Works now owns the rights to the Ed Brown 704 action and that is an incredibly big deal. I can now get one for $1,600 instead of $5k+ for an Ed Brown Damara or a McWhorter's Custom on the same action. My point is, while I have every intention of purchasing one of these new rifles and will be paying for incredible quality, they won't really print much better groups than a Ruger American.

    In short, were I looking at the same rifle, one chrome-lined and the other not, I would every time choose the chrome one assuming the price is similar.
     
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  13. oli700

    oli700 Rogue Valley Well-Known Member

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    Nitride, melonite, tinnifer, QPQ.........whatever you like to call it is the shiz. Outshines chrome in every way.
     
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  14. Medic!

    Medic! What just happened? Has eagle eyes. But cant remember what he saw. Bronze Supporter

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    May be melonite is the way to go? For all I know it's twice as good as chrome?

    But I can tell if a barrel is chrome lined buy looking at it.

    Am I OK to just trust what the gun maker say's he's done to the barrel? Are Nitride, melonite, and tennifer all the same? Applied the same? What is there standard? How do I check it?

    I have owned glocks that could not be made to rust! Then I bought one with a slide that rusted with daily carry.
    Not just on the outside flat's. But between the barrel and slide.

    This made me wonder about the consistency of treatments. It's not that they don't work. I know they do! Like I said. I cant make my other glocks rust!

    So I feel like I may miss out on some realy great snake oil treatment! Or the best treatment in the world?
    I wish I could just trust them. It's pretty bad when you have to ''Buy the gun not the story'' on a new gun.
     
  15. oli700

    oli700 Rogue Valley Well-Known Member

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    They are the same , applied the same, and for me anyway I can easily tell QPQ from glueing and parkerizing......handle it enough and you can tell a shotty QPQ as well

    Anything for a weapon I can by in QPQ I do the last couple of years.

    Don't know if you want answers to your question or if you were just throwing out some thoughts but it is all that and more.

    It is not a coating, so no chipping, no inconsistany in thickness causing tolerance problems on either end of service life, bores are more accurate because it cannot have inconsistencies like coatings , lands and grooves are sharper for better purchase on the projo's bearing surface

    More protection form throat and gas port erosion

    Really sucks trying to drill it for gas block dimples or pins, and if barrel and extension are not QPQ separately than the extension can back off .

    Salt spray tests smoke on the chrome results, wear tests smoke on the chrome results, more accurate, more consistent
     
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  16. Lilhigbee

    Lilhigbee SE Portland Visit Target550.com Gold Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    A little metallurgical correction if I may;
    Carbon does not rust, iron rusts.
    There are many types of stainless, each for it's own purpose. Most of the stronger stainless steels (316, 318, etc.) will rust, and are easier to machine. Their strength and machinability are why they are used in gun barrels. They are less prone to rusting than normal steels. The softer, much less rust-prone stainless steels (304, 308, etc.) are much more prone to galling and are difficult to machine; think machining play-doh.
     
  17. oli700

    oli700 Rogue Valley Well-Known Member

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    Nice, and so true...416 is not impervious and it is even proven that proper QPQ on 4150 CMV will out last 416r in wear and corrosion resistance over time.....the information is out there if a person want to muddle through chairborn ranger crap and get to actuall industry studies
     
  18. AMProducts

    AMProducts Maple Valley, WA Jerk, Ammo Manufacturer Silver Supporter

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    So, my AR, is pretty much attached to my right arm when I'm out in the wilderness, keeping oil or grease handy is pretty much a must no matter what environment. Even though I have a chrome lined bore, there are still plenty of other spots that will attract corrosion if not dealt with. Main reason why I went with chrome lined bore was exactly as you state.... extraction.

    Typically, I use a light machine oil (rem oil, or 3-n-1) for the inside, and a heavier lube on the outside of the barrel and steel parts to keep rust away. I used to use froglube, however I'm now just using petroleum jelly, it's cheaper, and does as good a job of excluding water, and even when it vaporizes it's still food grade (froglube also smokes when it heats up). It can also be applied thinly enough so that you don't get greasy handling it.
     
  19. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    As a blacksmith I just feel the need to jump in here :D Carbon is not what makes a stainless alloy magnetic There could be more carbon in some magnetic stainless alloys but its not what gives it its magnetic property's.

    I am not a metallurgist, but the basic gist is that magnetism comes about because of the way the molecules aline in a crystalline structure. There are several phases that these molecules can exist in and even in plain old carbon steel some times they are not magnetic. If you heat a bar of iron or steel up to about 1500 degs F it becomes non magnetic. Not because the carbon went away, but because now all the molecules are in solution and able to break free from a rigid polar alinement that attracts a magnet. The reason why some stainless alloys are not magnetic is because the molecules are trapped in such away that the poles of the molecules are random. Basically if its trapped in the Ferritic or Martensitic phase its magnetic, if you trap it in the Austentic phase its not.

    Ok, Sorry..... On with the barrel's :D
     
  20. nwwoodsman

    nwwoodsman Vernonia Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter 2015 Volunteer

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    Not a chrome lined barrel in my safe. I do have enough gun oil to last me the next 20 years. Chrome lined or not, proper care and maintence will be key to making your firearms last.