Addicts in the Wake of a Major Disaster

[NCW_Robert]

So does caffeine, or withdrawal therefrom...

Rule #23: Never mess with a Marine's coffee if you want to live.--SSA Leroy Jethro Gibbs, NCIS

OK... new SHTF plan, buy coffee and tobacco seeds and get that green house built soon.... Won't need food or too many bullets, people will be bringing that stuff to me by the box full haha

Wonder what one good cup of jo or a nice fat home rolled cig will fetch?

As of now starbucks gets what, 4 bucks for a cup of fancy coffee.. and I have no idea what cigs cost per pack... but are there not a lot of taxes on them now so pretty expensive?

Figure a 10x upcharge for SHTF and these items should be worth enough so if I have enough I will have the trade thing taken care of.

I got a feeling there are actually quite a few people who have quite a few bullets but not that many who have a year or more supply of cigs and coffee.

Wonder if you could actually grow coffee and tobacco in a green house? Probably not or people would be doing it more.

###

 

[jbett98]

I recently read a good book about a young man that inherited his grandparents farm in rural New England.
Up in the packed attic was a small paper box with a notation on the lid written in ink that said "String to short to be saved"
Inside were short pieces of string.
Nothing was ever thrown out.

 

[DuneHopper]

Sadly addicts and those reliant on medication will have a very hard time. if not a fatal one.
I have family that wont make it without medication. I suspect without modern medicine many of us would not be here either and would have died long ago at child birth , or giving a child, infection most would never have lived long enough to need long term medicines as it usually in most cases medication needs are based on a events triggering that need. Drug addicts will fail in SHTF for same reason their bodies wont endure what comes from a SHTF situation. Not long term.

 

[jbett98]

I heard on the radio the other day that the newest generation of children growing up will not have been exposed to bacteria that has been present in humans since we were living in caves.
Scientist are blaming all the anti bacterial hand washing and other antiseptic products that are being used to disinfect everything a child handles.
Over protective parents aren't letting their babies play in dirt like we did as kids. Playing in dirt is an essential link to good health later on in life.

 

[NCW_Robert]

I heard on the radio the other day that the newest generation of children growing up will not have been exposed to bacteria that has been present in humans since we were living in caves.
Scientist are blaming all the anti bacterial hand washing and other antiseptic products that are being used to disinfect everything a child handles.
Over protective parents aren't letting their babies play in dirt like we did as kids. Playing in dirt is an essential link to good health later on in life.

There have always been kids with that problem. Do you think Donald Trump's kids ever were allowed to play in the dirt? Or any kids who grew up like them in NYC who's parents lived in a 100 story building?

Just visited my son, his wife and my grand daughter who just turned 1 yrs old. They are dog lovers and the wife is the kind who has no problem sleeping with a dogs arse in her face, the dogs are allowed on the bed at night, YUK!

Their house um... has plenty of dog hair and the grand daughter plays with and cuddles up with all the 4 legged creatures who go in and out to take care of doggy business as needed.

Don't think there is going to be any problem with her immune system, the [germ fighting] force will certainly be with her.

They even joke about that as according to their pediatrician this is exactly what grand daughter needs right now so her immune system is fully developed.

###

 

[jbett98]

Kids should be exposed to dogs and cats at an early age to help their immunity system later on in life, so they don't have allergies.

 

[Sgt Nambu]

I recently read a good book about a young man that inherited his grandparents farm in rural New England.
Up in the packed attic was a small paper box with a notation on the lid written in ink that said "String to short to be saved"
Inside were short pieces of string.
Nothing was ever thrown out.
View attachment 366449

That's the way I was raised. Parents and grandparents that lived through the grinding poverty of famine and immigration or the want of the depression! I'm not quite as anal as they were but I am a pack rat about things that may be useful. For instance, yesterday I needed to make a cat tower. I had everything I needed wood, hinges, carpeting. Easy as can be!

Sadly addicts and those reliant on medication will have a very hard time. if not a fatal one.
I have family that wont make it without medication. I suspect without modern medicine many of us would not be here either and would have died long ago at child birth , or giving a child, infection most would never have lived long enough to need long term medicines as it usually in most cases medication needs are based on a events triggering that need. Drug addicts will fail in SHTF for same reason their bodies wont endure what comes from a SHTF situation. Not long term.

Yes, and drug addicts are dangerous all the time and dangerous as rabid Cougars when in withdrawals! I NEVER TRUST AN ADDICT!

 

[DuneHopper]

That's the way I was raised. Parents and grandparents that lived through the grinding poverty of famine and immigration or the want of the depression! I'm not quite as anal as they were but I am a pack rat about things may be useful. For instance, yesterday I needed to make a cat tower. I had everything I needed wood, hinges, carpeting. Easy as can be!



Yes, and drug addicts are dangerous all the time and dangerous as rabid Cougars when in withdrawals! I NEVER TRUST AN ADDICT!

How do you know when an addict is telling the truth ? When they are no longer breathing and thats a true reality.

 

[mrblond]

There have always been kids with that problem. Do you think Donald Trump's kids ever were allowed to play in the dirt? Or any kids who grew up like them in NYC who's parents lived in a 100 story building?

Just visited my son, his wife and my grand daughter who just turned 1 yrs old. They are dog lovers and the wife is the kind who has no problem sleeping with a dogs arse in her face, the dogs are allowed on the bed at night, YUK!

Their house um... has plenty of dog hair and the grand daughter plays with and cuddles up with all the 4 legged creatures who go in and out to take care of doggy business as needed.

Don't think there is going to be any problem with her immune system, the [germ fighting] force will certainly be with her.

They even joke about that as according to their pediatrician this is exactly what grand daughter needs right now so her immune system is fully developed.

###

Well, i dont have anything to worry about then, I used to eat dirt when I was a kid.

I saw a very gross doc a while back where there are some peoiple who dont have the right bacteria in their bowels and they need to... import..the bacteria bu putting others stool into them.

 

[mrblond]

How do you know when an addict is telling the truth ? When they are no longer breathing and thats a true reality.

yes, in my opinion.. if there is a SHTF event, treat the meth monkeys and crack heads as zombies

 

[Sgt Nambu]

^^^^Big bore, high power!

 

[CoastRange57]

When I had to move my parents into a nursing home, we took six truck loads of 'good stuff' to the local thrift store and made uncounted trips to the dump. But, by God, they had enough TP to wipe family butts from coast to coast for 3-4 months: stashes in the closets of both bathrooms, in all three bedroom closets, and in the basement laundry room. My dad would say things like 'you never know when you'll need a good cardboard box' or 'do you know how many things you can do with a plastic milk jug?' I know it was the result of growing up during the great depression, and based on their life experience when the economy tanks or croplands turn into a dust bowl, the suffering goes on for years so nothing got thrown out if there was any conceivable way to make use/reuse of it. They weren't brainiacs, but they were resilient and frugal and always planning ahead and 'setting aside for a rainy day.' They had no elaborate plan, as it was their lifestyle.

I will just go ahead and add my ditto to both the stories. My folks were Midwest post Dust Bowl migrants that moved to California to find good jobs. Came to Oregon in the start of high tech ( Tektronics) and lived a good life here. We moved them to our place in a manufactured home on a care hardship for 9 years where they lived their lives out.

My folks thing was they got Meals on Wheels every week day and my mom washed out every gdamn one of those styrofoam containers and stacked them in the cabinets everywhere. Kept the extra napkins, and plastic spoons. I would try and get rid of them but she had a fit, might need to put some meals in those in the freezer. My Dad had explained to me how hungry they were at times during the Depression, that you ate the entire apple, core and all because if you did not somebody would ask you for it or pick it up off the ground and eat it. Hearing that and seeing how profoundly it affected them was a huge part in my upbringing.

They would eat liver and onions, cooked beets, some kind of liverworst sh*t so they did not spend the money on good cuts of meat. That was a huge factor in my becoming a damn good hunter at a young age, and learning how to raise rabbits, and my Dad finally started raising his own beef. By the age of 12 I was bringing home pheasant, rabbits, ducks for meat. Dad did like to hunt so we usually had plenty of deer meat and the occasional elk.

You still ate what Mom cooked though and your kept your tongue to yourself about it lest you get an azz chewing. When I had a drivers license and part time job at 16, I could go to town for a burger and not eat whatever nasty thing was on the menu that night, but I best let Mom know in plenty of time so she did not make a portion for me.

We probably did go through the last of the things we had from them and my aunt and uncle last year. Gave a lot away and threw a lot away too. The youth of today will never have to be that hungry or desperate for anything. I was not dirt poor, but I did have to listen to the stories first hand.

 

[CoastRange57]

OK... new SHTF plan, buy coffee and tobacco seeds and get that green house built soon.... Won't need food or too many bullets, people will be bringing that stuff to me by the box full haha

Wonder what one good cup of jo or a nice fat home rolled cig will fetch?

I tried to grow some tobacco here about 3 years in a row. No success. I even bought in some tobacco plant starts from Kentucky. Now I am a college trained crop science second major and have been farming and growing things all my life, and had my doubts but thought I would try and beat mother nature at her game. I had a commercial grade greenhouse with heaters and all that too.

It really comes down to the fact that our photo period ( available light and wave length of it) here is just impossible to get the genetics of tobacco to respond to it to reach any kind of harvestable amount of quality. Kind of like grapes and wine. I kept the heat on it, tried a bit of supplemental light, but again trying to provide the right wave length of light was impossible without trying to go steal some dope growers halides, and pay for the electric bill to keep the heat and light where it needed to be in January - February. Tobacco is an annual crop and they come with their own inherent set of challenges, plus in Western Oregon we get way too much rain and tobacco can be fungus prone in that type of climate. Most tobacco growing areas in Kentucky, Tennesse, Carolinas etc are all about 800 miles or more farther south in latitude than our area, and while soil, water and temperatures all play a huge part, that light thing is just something you cannot replicate.

Coffee is all grown in equatorial or sub tropical climates and you would spend a lot of money trying to replicate those conditions anywhere but outside in those zones. Trying to hold a 50/50 balance or close to it between day and light and less than a 20 degree temperature differential at all times can be done, but at what cost. You can see why both commodities were highly valued as barter items since they were truly luxuries in early times. Of course the Indians found out you could grow weed just about anywhere seasonally, and the white man did as well. Deeper research will show you that pioneers, mountain men and cowboys smoked a lot more weed than tobacco.

Hope this was not too boring, and some of you found something of interest, I have tried to find ways to grow different crops not normally grown around here ( well for a reason duh) and have usually failed.

 

[Tony617]

OK... new SHTF plan, buy coffee and tobloacco seeds and get that green house built soon.... Won't need food or too many bullets, people will be bringing that stuff to me by the box full haha

Wonder what one good cup of jo or a nice fat home rolled cig will fetch?

As of now starbucks gets what, 4 bucks for a cup of fancy coffee.. and I have no idea what cigs cost per pack... but are there not a lot of taxes on them now so pretty expensive?

Figure a 10x upcharge for SHTF and these items should be worth enough so if I have enough I will have the trade thing taken care of.

I got a feeling there are actually quite a few people who have quite a few bullets but not that many who have a year or more supply of cigs and coffee.

Wonder if you could actually grow coffee and tobacco in a green house? Probably not or people would be doing it more.

###

I wonder if I should be buy 2 or 3 cases of Tasters Choice coffee for myself? I like my coffee. I guess I could trade for ammo or something else.

 

[Capn Jack]

I recently read a good book about a young man that inherited his grandparents farm in rural New England.
Up in the packed attic was a small paper box with a notation on the lid written in ink that said "String to short to be saved"
Inside were short pieces of string.
Nothing was ever thrown out.



View attachment 366449

My Father-in-Law had boxes of bent nails.
He would stop and straighten them out before using.

 

[mrblond]

I will just go ahead and add my ditto to both the stories. My folks were Midwest post Dust Bowl migrants that moved to California to find good jobs. Came to Oregon in the start of high tech ( Tektronics) and lived a good life here. We moved them to our place in a manufactured home on a care hardship for 9 years where they lived their lives out.

My folks thing was they got Meals on Wheels every week day and my mom washed out every gdamn one of those styrofoam containers and stacked them in the cabinets everywhere. Kept the extra napkins, and plastic spoons. I would try and get rid of them but she had a fit, might need to put some meals in those in the freezer. My Dad had explained to me how hungry they were at times during the Depression, that you ate the entire apple, core and all because if you did not somebody would ask you for it or pick it up off the ground and eat it. Hearing that and seeing how profoundly it affected them was a huge part in my upbringing.

They would eat liver and onions, cooked beets, some kind of liverworst sh*t so they did not spend the money on good cuts of meat. That was a huge factor in my becoming a damn good hunter at a young age, and learning how to raise rabbits, and my Dad finally started raising his own beef. By the age of 12 I was bringing home pheasant, rabbits, ducks for meat. Dad did like to hunt so we usually had plenty of deer meat and the occasional elk.

You still ate what Mom cooked though and your kept your tongue to yourself about it lest you get an azz chewing. When I had a drivers license and part time job at 16, I could go to town for a burger and not eat whatever nasty thing was on the menu that night, but I best let Mom know in plenty of time so she did not make a portion for me.

We probably did go through the last of the things we had from them and my aunt and uncle last year. Gave a lot away and threw a lot away too. The youth of today will never have to be that hungry or desperate for anything. I was not dirt poor, but I did have to listen to the stories first hand.

Reminds me of stories my grandma told about when the was on the Pine Ridge Res during the war. they had nothing up there and they would eat whaever they had. she said ground squirrel was not bad and dog was awful and very greasy.
Liver and onions were very popular with my grandma and my great grandma. she was lucky though that one of her former students liked her and would bring smelt and salmon many times a year. One of the comfort foods we had was canned salmon and fried potatoes. Has to be Sockeye though as chum was cat food.

 

[NCW_Robert]

Man we got it pretty darn good in this country now a days... Look at what our relatives had to go through and what they had to eat to survive in earlier times. Many were very tough people, my hat is off to them for what they went through and had to endure.

###

 

[CoastRange57]

That was how I learned at 9 years of age to use a hammer and not smash my fingers. Pound those bent staples straight boy, we got a lot of fence to put up.

 

[Camelfilter]

I tried to grow some tobacco here about 3 years in a row. No success. I even bought in some tobacco plant starts from Kentucky. Now I am a college trained crop science second major and have been farming and growing things all my life, and had my doubts but thought I would try and beat mother nature at her game. I had a commercial grade greenhouse with heaters and all that too.

It really comes down to the fact that our photo period ( available light and wave length of it) here is just impossible to get the genetics of tobacco to respond to it to reach any kind of harvestable amount of quality. Kind of like grapes and wine. I kept the heat on it, tried a bit of supplemental light, but again trying to provide the right wave length of light was impossible without trying to go steal some dope growers halides, and pay for the electric bill to keep the heat and light where it needed to be in January - February. Tobacco is an annual crop and they come with their own inherent set of challenges, plus in Western Oregon we get way too much rain and tobacco can be fungus prone in that type of climate. Most tobacco growing areas in Kentucky, Tennesse, Carolinas etc are all about 800 miles or more farther south in latitude than our area, and while soil, water and temperatures all play a huge part, that light thing is just something you cannot replicate.

Coffee is all grown in equatorial or sub tropical climates and you would spend a lot of money trying to replicate those conditions anywhere but outside in those zones. Trying to hold a 50/50 balance or close to it between day and light and less than a 20 degree temperature differential at all times can be done, but at what cost. You can see why both commodities were highly valued as barter items since they were truly luxuries in early times. Of course the Indians found out you could grow weed just about anywhere seasonally, and the white man did as well. Deeper research will show you that pioneers, mountain men and cowboys smoked a lot more weed than tobacco.

Hope this was not too boring, and some of you found something of interest, I have tried to find ways to grow different crops not normally grown around here ( well for a reason duh) and have usually failed.

Thanks for the info, appreciated! Bit of a black thumb here, so always keen to learn. It'll be a long ways out before we have any suitable property, but it is still nice to absorb what I can.

I did my internship at a hospital in western Massachusetts, near the Connecticut river valley. I remember driving thru fields of tobacco, which I found really quite odd, given the short New England growing season and the temperate region.

It's quite the interesting science!

Windsor Tobacco: Made in the Shade | ConnecticutHistory.org

The combo of the sandy soil, genetics of the particular strain & just enough light & rain seems to be the trick.

-As for all of us mentioning putting up coffee: Best would be to learn how to roast your own (we haven't yet). My understanding is green coffee (unroasted) can be put up for a long long while, and can be purchased relatively inexpensive in bulk.

As for us rite now coffee wise, I'd imagine we'd be good for over a year. Currently we're at several pots per day. If SHTF, it'd be rationed immediately, not just for the sake of ration. Lifestyle would drastically change from sedentary to active. There would be less of a "need" for coffee thru out the day, just as a treat to start or end the day.

Plus we've put up a decent amount of tea & sugar. Sweet tea would make for a heck of a nice mid day treat, and hot tea is always nice if your feeling crappy.

 

[Hayshaker]

Several threads back "TP" was mentioned .Well ~ not only having some is important,but WHERE are you going to be able to use it as most if not ALL sewer systems will be down. Even septic tanks require water to function. No power means no pump for wells. In any metro area look what kind of mess your going to have with waste. Then the health problems that will follow very shortly afterwards.
As for drug users they will be out in force pretty fast as most will panic not know where to look for their next fix.
Then mentioned earlier normal people will start running out of food for their kids/family so when they start looking for food at WHAT point do you start using arms to protect your stock ??
Also it would be VERY foolish to run a gen set after about two days as the noise would attract people in need of what ever.