A Ruger Old Army gets all blowed up...

[Oathkeeper1775]

Squib?

 

[tac]

1. BP revolvers and pistols, providing that they are front loaders, are totally normal. That is based on the premise that they have seem little use in crime [since May of 1926, in UK].



2. Two gunsmiths here in UK make conversion cylinders for not only the Ruger Old Army, but a couple of regular-style d/a revolvers and a Uberti Cattleman s/a Army look-alike. It involves, in the case of the cartridge revolvers, making a new cylinder that can only hold the recommended charge of 3.5gr of Herco or equivalent, and shoots a .38cal full wad-cutter, set off by a #209 shotgun primer.

3. The ROA converter is the same, but in .45 cal. Same goes for the Remington New Model Army of 1858.

If you look on Youtube tac's guns, you can see one of these nitro and legal handguns in action.

As for what constitutes the difference between nitro propellant and black powder, the difference is basic chemistry. BP is an EXPLOSIVE, and will actually burn extremely rapidly in air without containment. Nitro means nitro-cellulose-based, and all other forms of propellant are actually just that - they burn, when contained, in a controlled fashion, with different burn rates for handgun and large and small rifle loads. There are a number of good Youtube video, one by Hickock45, showing the difference.

tac

PS - the Alfa project thing cost around $1400, just in case anybody here is Jonesing after one...

 

[johnny bob]

tac, banned and castigated.

Any forum that would ban Tac can't be much of a forum.

 

[HB of CJ]

Stupid things do happen. Old Story. In about 1988 I sold a semi auto replica CAR15 to a gentleman out of state. FFL to FFL. He got drunk and loaded 25.0 grains of 2400 instead of 748. The CAR lasted 12 rounds before locking up. He did admit to drinking too much beer while hand loading.

An amazing design. He was not hurt other than a bruised hand. Blew out the mag. Blew out the mag catch. All the fired 12 cases had blown out primers. The brass was nearly separated in half. He did say the recoil and flash were very big and the brass flew quite a huge distance.

How do you prevent such mistakes? Dunno that. I replaced the entire top end free. It was NOT my fault. The welded shut blown up upper half got sent to my barrel maker. They sectioned the whole thing on a big band saw and placed it on a walnut plank. No alcohol while hand loading.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

As I noted in my resplone, the dealer [actually a highly regarded gunsmith in Southern England] actually said that was exactly the case.

Me, I'm still trying to figure out how that can happen with a loose loader......

tac

I use "loose" loads all the time in my cap and ball revolvers...I just load from the flask or if a horn , into a charger like a rifle...I have and do use pre-loaded paper cartridges in my revolvers and muskets from time to time however...

The important thing is to keep smokeless and black powder apart
Andy

 

[tac]

I use "loose" loads all the time in my cap and ball revolvers...I just load from the flask or if a horn , into a charger like a rifle...I have and do use pre-loaded paper cartridges in my revolvers and muskets from time to time however...

The important thing is to keep smokeless and black powder apart
Andy

I do the same, although I only have two muzzleloaders - the ROA and the Musketoon. But when I'm filling up the flask I use to fill the little phials for the revolver, I can't help but notice that the short fat and brightly-coloured powder container is covered with lots of words, like Pyrodex P and so on.

Same goes for the making up of them little paper cartridges. They are just so darn finicky to make in the fust place that they really do take a lot of attention.

Making the larger cartridges for the Musketoon, using the excellent Youtube videos from Rob in Britishmuzzleloaders, also requires a lot of concentration. The thought that I could be pouring a measured tablespoon of Bullseye into them, instead of good ol' 2Fg, has never occurred to me. Why? Well, because the Bullseye powder comes in a large black plastic container with the word 'BULLSEYE' printed on it.

That's the clue.

tac

 

[tac]

I just revose my post to include a movie of the Alpha Project conversion. whoopee.

tac

 

[wired]

As for what constitutes the difference between nitro propellant and black powder, the difference is basic chemistry. BP is an EXPLOSIVE, and will actually burn extremely rapidly in air without containment. Nitro means nitro-cellulose-based, and all other forms of propellant are actually just that - they burn, when contained, in a controlled fashion, with different burn rates for handgun and large and small rifle loads. There are a number of good Youtube video, one by Hickock45, showing the difference.


tac

Eh....Black Powder is not considered an explosive per se' in the US. It deflagrates and burns quickly supplying it's own oxygen of course . They call BP an explosive in the UK and really the rest of the world. The argument being that rapid deflagration is an explosion. In the US we call BP a Low Explosive as it "burns" in contrast to high explosives that undergo shock wave molecular detonation and do not burn in the same fashion although they will burn uncontained. Ironically smokeless powder is considered a High Explosive in the US but does not get placarded the same way that Black Powder , a low explosive, does because it only detonates with extreme shock and containment while black powder, a low explosive will burn to explosive force uncontained with fire. You get blown up one way or another .

We also call tomatoes vegetables.

 

[tac]

Any forum that would ban Tac can't be much of a forum.

I just found out that he banned me from his site because I had declared my intention to 'make trouble'. It seems that he had taken upon himself to look up my profile on Booktwitch in which I had described myself as a 'Retired old f*rt with nothing to do but make myself a PITA [on Booktwitch]'.

It's kind of odd that with literally thousands of posts here, over EIGHT thousand on sigforum, a total of over fourteen thousand on gunboards, muzzleloadingforum, canadiangunnuts and vcrai - and that's just the gun fora - I've managed to make myself a PITA so few times that I can't remember when.

I guess some folks are just delicately brunged up.

tac

 

[Flymph]

If I recall correctly, the Old Army was tested by Ruger with a charge of 30 grains of Unique. Not recommended, but tested to check it's strength. What exactly is Nitro powder? A generic term or an actual powder?

It's smokeless powder, they're both generic terms. See tac's explanation for more details, I read his post after writing some.

This is all really stupid, from the guy using improper loads to the mod whom banned tac. Just hope nobody gets any more dumb ideas, and I hope that scratch gets infected so it's really itchy for a while.
I guess the only bright side is that maybe you will have more time to pay attention to us here at NWFA.

 

[tac]

Dear Flymph, I'm saddened to learn that you feel neglected, and I'll endeavour to spend more time with you guys, instead of getting shot down in flames by knee-jerkers here in the UK.

Seems he has now had second thoughts, and I'm not the demon destroyer he thought I was initially. I once again am allowed to have access to his hallowed FB site.

By me, he can still go blow it out of his ears.

tac

 

[Flymph]

We appreciate you here tac, and you're too good for FB. Don't worry about them anymore, because they don't matter.

 

[nammac]

I just found out that he banned me from his site because I had declared my intention to 'make trouble'. It seems that he had taken upon himself to look up my profile on Booktwitch in which I had described myself as a 'Retired old f*rt with nothing to do but make myself a PITA [on Booktwitch]'.

It's kind of odd that with literally thousands of posts here, over EIGHT thousand on sigforum, a total of over fourteen thousand on gunboards, muzzleloadingforum, canadiangunnuts and vcrai - and that's just the gun fora - I've managed to make myself a PITA so few times that I can't remember when.

I guess some folks are just delicately brunged up.

tac

Well tac, it seems to me that your not quite accomplishing your desired task of being a PITA, at least here... Perhaps you just need to try harder...

 

[ditchtiger]

1. BP revolvers and pistols, providing that they are front loaders, are totally normal. That is based on the premise that they have seem little use in crime [since May of 1926, in UK].

I've seen other handguns with bar stock on the grip frame. I'm sure it never would get cut off by a criminal wanting a concealable handgun. that would be illegal.

 

[Rick4070]

Here is a Colt Anaconda that came into the shop one day.
Owner claimed factory ammo, Winchester claimed either faulty gun or reloads.

 

[tac]

I've seen other handguns with bar stock on the grip frame. I'm sure it never would get cut off by a criminal wanting a concealable handgun. that would be illegal.

Oddly enough, no UK handgun of this kind has EVER been stolen. I guess that the reasons are pretty simple - they are comparatively rare for a start, and pretty pricey, too. But the main reason is that they are simply too well protected by their owners. When you consider how difficult is is to get into the average UK home without attracting attention - it is REALLY hard, trust me on that - you then have to find the guns and remove them from the safe, all the while under the noise of the alarm going off.

No criminal has thought it's worth the trouble, when he can lay his or her hands on a REALLY cool gun like a Glunk or similar for around $300, so I'm told.

The Taurus revolvers like mine are well north of a thousand bucks, and one like mine is not only rare, but getting stupid. I was offered $3500 cash right there in my hand by a dealer last year at one of our guest days.

tac