Watching the fallout from the weather in Texas - lessons to be learned.

[4Freedom]

What's happening in Texas will be a walk in the park when the US dollar collapses..

That being said, my heart goes out for Texans having to deal with this kind of cold weather and the foot or so of snow they got.. Well, still not as bad as the entire Pacific Northwest living under smoke and fire for 3 months and not being able to even leave their houses without dying if you are not wearing a respirator.. I kind of feel like Americans as a whole are very complacent and unprepared for disaster.. I found it ironic people on Mexico side of border were melting snow , boiling it and using it as water while poor, helpless Americans were running to shelters fearing they will die of thirst. It's interesting how people in poorer countries have to be more resourceful just to stay alive and in times of chaos it tend to be able to rough it out a little easier than people from more coddled and wealthier nations. Of course, what kind of silly prepper would dare store a couple weeks water supply in their house? I always keep lots of jugs of water around and it always gets a good laugh, untill.. Until, those same people get thirsty ..

Here in the Carolinas, ironically, we get pretty fierce heat waves at times and its been even really freakin cold in winter (down in the teens and single digits) and we have hurricanes, floods, monsoons, ice storms and just had a major EF-3 tornado that killed some people a few days ago.

Yet, nothing seems to make a dent on this place. Carolinas are one of those weird places that pretty endure every kind of weather phenomenon imaginable.

Again, feel bad for Texans.. Surprised that April weather in Colorado could wreck such havoc on such a great state.

But, just wait until the next heat wave when Texans are laughing at all the weaklings up North while they are just relaxing on another 110F day under resilient A/C systems while the rest of people run to their heat shelters, suffer major power outages, fires, and unimaginable chaos.

 

[308]

The lesson to be learned here is that liquid natural gas, which supplies 50% of Texan's electricity, can freeze inside pipelines if not properly winterized.

Actually the biggest lesson is that Texas has inept leadership at every level, so wherever people decide the buck stops, you'll find an idiot. Take your pick.

Ted Cruz, blistered for Cancun getaway during epic Texas power crisis, calls it ‘obviously a mistake’ in hindsight

Ted Cruz, blistered for Cancun getaway during epic Texas power crisis, calls it ‘obviously a mistake’ in hindsight

www.dallasnews.com

How does -265f LNG freeze when exposed to an ambient temperature at least 250f higher? I'm sure I'm missing something...just curious

 

[Camelfilter]

Green energy has its place. It's not ready for prime time yet. Last Thursday before we had our little event I topped off all of our vehicles with gas. That's about 70 gallons on tap that could keep my generator running for weeks if necessary.
Frozen wind mills, ugh. Hopefully the good people of Texas get a break quickly.

If you haven't already, make sure you have a means to siphon said fuel from your vehicles.

Some folks may not be aware newish vehicles have anitisyphon / anti spill valves/ screens and such.

 

[Certaindeaf]

How does -265f LNG freeze when exposed to an ambient temperature at least 250f higher? I'm sure I'm missing something...just curious

cold + cold = colder

 

[Camelfilter]

How does -265f LNG freeze when exposed to an ambient temperature at least 250f higher? I'm sure I'm missing something...just curious

More likely grid controlled valving/pumps and such, vs secondary / backup LNG generators etc.

Grid down if grid controlled, LNG "frozen" as in nonfunctional...

 

[powersbj]

I would disagree... Clearly much infrastucture built along the West Coast has taken into consideration a 100 year earthquake and flood control on the Mississippi River is designed to mitigate if not totally control the damage of a 100 year flood.

You just cherry picked a brand new 3 billion dollar 2 mile tunnel, but left out the failing west seattle bridge. I doubt much of our infrastructure is as ready as you assume.

 

[cigars]

If you haven't already, make sure you have a means to siphon said fuel from your vehicles.

Some folks may not be aware newish vehicles have anitisyphon / anti spill valves/ screens and such.

None of my vehicles present that problem. Otherwise I would just bleed off a fuel line.

 

[Catfishmoon]

You just cherry picked a brand new 3 billion dollar 2 mile tunnel, but left out the failing west seattle bridge. I doubt much of our infrastructure is as ready as you assume.

Actually I just picked one of the first examples that I received when I Google searched....

Your mention of The West Seattle Bridge is an excellent example of where millions of extra dollars were spent to design and build infrastructure that could withstand an earthquake with a chance of occuring once in many lifetimes. Something Texas deemed unnecessary even though deep freezes in Texas are certainly much more common than are earthquakes in Seattle that would destroy a bridge.

The inflation calculator says the 150 million cost of the bridge in 1984 would be 385 million today (for a single bridge)...

Bottom line is that many municipalities have paid large sums to upgrade infrastructure fearing the damage caused by rare events, Texas decided not to and the results are currently being witnessed...

This whole discussion is familiar territory for any individual who spends time and money prepping for a disaster, watches others not prep, (heck he is often even ridiculed) and then witnesses the disaster occur and the reactions of those who failed to prepare... The only modern twist is that those who failed to prepare now try to create a false conspiracy as an excuse.


On July 14, 1984, the West Seattle Bridge is dedicated. This six-lane cantilevered concrete structure is more than 150 feet high and cost $150 million to build. The bridge spans Harbor Island and the Duwamish Waterway at the point it enters Elliott Bay.

West Seattle Bridge is dedicated on July 14, 1984.

On July 14, 1984, the West Seattle Bridge is dedicated. This six-lane cantilevered concrete structure is more than 150 feet high and cost $150 million to build. The bridge spans Harbor Island and the

www.historylink.org

West Seattle Bridge - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[cigars]

Actually I just picked one of the first examples that I received when I Google searched....

Your mention of The West Seattle Bridge is an excellent example of where millions of extra dollars were spent to design and build infrastructure that could withstand an earthquake with a chance of occuring once in many lifetimes. Something Texas deemed unnecessary even though deep freezes in Texas are certainly much more common than are earthquakes in Seattle that would destroy a bridge.

The inflation calculator says the 150 million cost of the bridge in 1984 would be 385 million today (for a single bridge)...

Bottom line is that many municipalities have paid large sums to upgrade infrastructure fearing the damage caused by rare events, Texas decided not to and the results are currently being witnessed...

This whole discussion is familiar territory for any individual who spends time and money prepping for a disaster, watches others not prep, (heck he is often even ridiculed) and then witnesses the disaster occur and the reactions of those who failed to prepare... The only modern twist is that those who failed to prepare now try to create a false conspiracy as an excuse.


On July 14, 1984, the West Seattle Bridge is dedicated. This six-lane cantilevered concrete structure is more than 150 feet high and cost $150 million to build. The bridge spans Harbor Island and the Duwamish Waterway at the point it enters Elliott Bay.

West Seattle Bridge is dedicated on July 14, 1984.

On July 14, 1984, the West Seattle Bridge is dedicated. This six-lane cantilevered concrete structure is more than 150 feet high and cost $150 million to build. The bridge spans Harbor Island and the

www.historylink.org

West Seattle Bridge - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Texas over building for an event like this makes about as much sense as Florida over building for the same weather event. The weather event will pass, Texas will learn from it, strengthen its grid and life will go on.

 

[The Heretic]

Actually I just picked one of the first examples that I received when I Google searched....

Your mention of The West Seattle Bridge is an excellent example of where millions of extra dollars were spent to design and build infrastructure that could withstand an earthquake with a chance of occuring once in many lifetimes. Something Texas deemed unnecessary even though deep freezes in Texas are certainly much more common than are earthquakes in Seattle that would destroy a bridge.

In short, there is more to prepping besides the likelihood, there is also impact.

A Cascadian earthquake in the PNW is not only possible, since it is a recurring phenomena it is very likely. Whether it is is likely to happen during our lifetime or that of our children/grandchildren is debatable, but bridges do last longer than human lifetimes.

I don't prep just for earthquakes, but I do take them into consideration while prepping. Fortunately most of my preps cover multiple event scenarios including earthquakes. If/when I buy land and build on it, I plan to have the building materials, design, etc. take into account the possibility of a strong earthquake.

I will only live about 20 more years, but my kids who will probably be living on that new property, will be living about 40-50 more years, increasing the possibility that they would experience a strong earthquake.

The main objective of my preps is to be self-sufficient, including with regards to energy sources, like home electricity.

 

[Catfishmoon]

Texas over building for an event like this makes about as much sense as Florida over building for the same weather event. The weather event will pass, Texas will learn from it, strengthen its grid and life will go on.

Actually they have failed to strengthen the energy grid infrastructure after simililiar events in the not distant past...

What we do agree on, is that it comes down to a risk/cost analysis, and every person has to decide their personal tolerance level...

No different then one person decides they want to spend no money on insurance, next person pays $1000 a month for coverage... Same thing for neighbors choosing flood or earthquake.

Some people definitely do not want their belongings stolen and will spend large sums on home security, others spend nothing. Even on this forum would be a wide variance of those who have spent $1000's on a high quality safe to secure their firearm and the next guy puts the same shotgun in his closet or on a wall.

Some people definitely did not want to run out of ammo and spent $1,000's stockpiling, others decicided to accept the risk that a shortage may occur

I have lived in a semi-arid farming area when most of the farmers are totally dependent on rainfall for the success/failure of their wheat crop. While a few have spent many thousands of dollars for irrigation to ensure plenty of water...

Basically life is a gamble and we all have to decide at what cost we are willing to pay to mitigate some of the risk.

 

[cigars]

Actually they have failed to strengthen the energy grid infrastructure after simililiar events in the not distant past...

What we do agree on, is that it comes down to a risk/cost analysis, and every person has to decide their personal tolerance level...

No different then one person decides they want to spend no money on insurance, next person pays $1000 a month for coverage... Same thing for neighbors choosing flood or earthquake.

Some people definitely do not want their belongings stolen and will spend large sums on home security, others spend nothing. Even on this forum would be a wide variance of those who have spent $1000's on a high quality safe to secure their firearm and the next guy puts the same shotgun in his closet or on a wall.

Some people definitely did not want to run out of ammo and spent $1,000's stockpiling, others decicided to accept the risk that a shortage may occur

I have lived in a semi-arid farming area when most of the farmers are totally dependent on rainfall for the success/failure of their wheat crop. While a few have spent many thousands of dollars for irrigation to ensure plenty of water...

Basically life is a gamble and we all have to decide at what cost we are willing to pay to mitigate some of the risk.

Perhaps the fact that much of our grid infrastructure is supplied by Chinese outfits as indicated in the article below.
It's all over the country but Texas just happened to take the first hit, showing how the Chinese grid components perform sub par in extreme events.

What Caused The Texas Energy Crisis? ⋆ Politicrossing

As Texas Continues to dig itself out from a massive winter storm, an overlooked vulnerability in the U.S. power grid may be to blame.

politicrossing.com

 

[Idaholandman]

'ERCOT Failed': Texas Gov. Abbott Issues Executive Order To Call For Investigation (msn.com)

FAIL! Board members are not even located in Texas or the USA...

The Electric Reliability Council of Texas (ERCOT) manages the flow of electric power to more than 26 million Texas customers -- representing about 90 percent of the state's electric load. As the independent system operator for the region, ERCOT schedules power on an electric grid that connects more than 46,500 miles of transmission lines and 680+ generation units. It also performs financial settlement for the competitive wholesale bulk-power market and administers retail switching for nearly 8 million premises in competitive choice areas.

ERCOT is a membership-based 501(c)(4) nonprofit corporation, governed by a board of directors and subject to oversight by the Public Utility Commission of Texas and the Texas Legislature. Its members include consumers, cooperatives, generators, power marketers, retail electric providers, investor-owned electric utilities, transmission and distribution providers and municipally owned electric utilities.

 

[gmerkt]

What a mess the thaw will bring. I feel badly for those people with burst pipes in their homes. Repairing the actual plumbing failure is nothing compared to remediating the damage caused by the water that was released. Lots of work ahead there.

 

[EHJ]

How does -265f LNG freeze when exposed to an ambient temperature at least 250f higher? I'm sure I'm missing something...just curious

More likely grid controlled valving/pumps and such, vs secondary / backup LNG generators etc.

Grid down if grid controlled, LNG "frozen" as in nonfunctional...

It's the hydrates and water in the 'field gas' (raw gas) that's a big part of the issue.
And ambient temps are used for the calculations for pipeline psi transfer to keep it from freezing even on a warm day. (Lower the pressure - the higher the gas/liquid temp and vice versa.) Kinda like how some propane devices on high will slow down half way through a tank and then you see how cold the remaining propane in the tank has become?

Drop a few transfer pumps out of this equation and pressure goes down just a bit combined with even colder ambient temps and voila.

 

[dfisher1981]

Remember how the "Texas model" was supposed to save consumers money?

Texas Power Sales Hit Record $50 Billion on Cold: Energy Update

(Bloomberg) -- The Texas power grid has returned to normal operations as a historic cold blast eases, but the impact of the deep freeze on vital infrastructure is just being realized.The Electric Reliability Council of Texas, which manages the grid, said it had exited emergency conditions...

finance.yahoo.com

$50 BILLION in energy costs just last week, a new record.

Add to that another $50 BILLION in economic and property damage from...not the storm...from the POWER FAILURES.

That's $100 BILLION out of the pockets of Texans. OUCH!

 

[dfisher1981]

'ERCOT Failed': Texas Gov. Abbott Issues Executive Order To Call For Investigation (msn.com)

ERCOT has been around since 1970. I'm surprised it took Texas this long to figure out it was a failure.

As for Abbott, I guess we know where he thinks the buck stops: anywhere else but me!

I suppose that's better than Cruz, who thought the buck stopped at the Ritz Carlton in Cancun.

 

[Retired Guy]

There are only so many things you can plan and pay for. Unfortunately, there are some things that cannot be mitigated without a significant expense. It really is a "damned if you do and damned if you don't" scenario. Spend the money to bolster emergency equipment. If there are no emergencies, then you're the fool that wasted all that money. There will always be "an expert" out there with hindsight who will point out how money/time/effort was wasted. You get the picture.

The one point I have been hammering home to family and friends is that it starts with you. So many people think the government is going to swoop in and save them anytime there is a disaster. The government will do that...eventually. Until then, it's up to you. I actually know people who refuse to prepare because it's "the governments job to protect us".

I'm sure there are a bunch of folks in Texas that will vow to do better next time. A bunch that will blame everyone else. A small percentage that will make the necessary prep. Within a couple weeks, it will be forgotten as people worry over Kanye West and Kardashian antics or the latest iPhone. The next time something happens, it will be the same finger pointing. Very little will change.

I hope you guys are ready for a disaster here in the PNW. Be ready to stand on your own for at least a week.

 

[The Heretic]

I believe the basic practice, at least for some states, including Oregon, is that when something needs replacing, like a bridge, the replacement is built according to new standards that take into account risks that were not part of the standards previously.

 

[Tony617]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottc...ze-de-icing-and-carbon-fiber/?sh=6c23ae0a1f59